VDSL Massive Jitter, 267kpbs upload, 2mbps download

Forums › 2degrees (including Slingshot, Orcon, Flip, Stuff Fibre, MyRepublic, 2talk and Vocus) › VDSL Massive Jitter, 267kpbs upload, 2mbps download

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variable

124 posts

Master Geek

#1559604 25-May-2016 19:45

hio77:

variable:

I am seeing some speed improvement as I am typing, will report back if problem comes back.

As my above comment, this is sounding like a congested connection at the user level rather than a fault at all.

Post the stats, if you need directions do ask, i have an orcon VDSL modem sitting at my feet i could power up and hand you exact directions.

The result is up and down, sometimes fast sometimes slow...

Statistics -- xDSL

  
Synchronized Time:	0:1:10:27  
Number of Synchronizations:	0  
  
Mode:	VDSL2 Annex B 
Traffic Type:	PTM 
Status:	Up 
Link Power State:	L0 
Copper Loop(kft):	0.0 
  
 	Downstream	Upstream 
Line Coding(Trellis):	On	On 
SNR Margin (0.1 dB):	83	93 
Attenuation (0.1 dB):	328	0 
Output Power (0.1 dBm):	185	105 
Attainable Rate (Kbps):	21850	1168 
  
 	Path 0	 	Path 1	  
 	Downstream	Upstream	Downstream	Upstream 
Rate (Kbps):	22118	1159	0	0 
  
B (# of bytes in Mux Data Frame):	223	219	0	0 
M (# of Mux Data Frames in an RS codeword):	1	1	0	0 
T (# of Mux Data Frames in an OH sub-frame):	64	7	0	0 
R (# of redundancy bytes in the RS codeword):	16	16	0	0 
S (# of data symbols over which the RS code word spans):	0.3221	6.0377	0.0000	0.0000 
L (# of bits transmitted in each data symbol):	5960	318	0	0 
D (interleaver depth):	97	11	0	0 
I (interleaver block size in bytes):	240	120	0	0 
N (RS codeword size):	240	240	0	0 
Delay (msec):	8	8	0	0 
INP (DMT symbol):	1.00	1.00	0.00	0.00 
  
OH Frames:	807999	393013	0	0 
OH Frame Errors:	54	0	0	0 
RS Words:	51699715	2767852	0	0 
RS Correctable Errors:	12556	0	0	0 
RS Uncorrectable Errors:	890	0	0	0 
  
HEC Errors:	317	0	0	0 
OCD Errors:	0	0	0	0 
LCD Errors:	0	0	0	0 
Total Cells:	177834173	0	0	0 
Data Cells:	14174769	0	0	0 
Bit Errors:	0	0	0	0 
  
Total ES:	29	0 
Total SES:	0	0 
Total UAS:	28	28

hio77

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Lizard Networks

#1559606 25-May-2016 19:51

alright so you are synced at 22/1.1 ild pick you were about 14/1 on adsl? thats a reasonable jump

Given the asymmetric nature of 998 sadly there isnt too much of a jump in upstream there. 1mbit upstream is very easy to congest, too many open connections acking is plenty enough to bring it to its knees.

Remember you need upstream traffic to acknowledge traffic to come down the downstream in tcp which will be probably 90% of what you currently use.

Your on a 8/8ms profile, looks like DLM-4 so to the core you would atbest probably see about 16ms. Jitter ontop of that is most certainly congestion on your upstream.

Do you have Icloud, dropbox or some sort of other cloud based service running in the background potentially uploading?

I would recommend an isolation test, remove all devices off the network, connect a single computer via Ethernet. ensure nothing is running in the background and test.

for that sync rate, you will probably get about 20/1 on a speedtest with about >20ms ping (estimations not an accurate calculation)

Your connection has been up for over an hour, any jitter/Variance past that is not todo with the physical DSL connectivity but elsewhere.

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Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

variable

124 posts

Master Geek

#1559607 25-May-2016 19:55

well yeah, I have dropbox and icloud, but I think it's more due to google photos uploading images. Saying that, I didn't experience any issues like this using ADSL.

hio77

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#1559610 25-May-2016 20:00

variable:

well yeah, I have dropbox and icloud, but I think it's more due to google photos uploading images. Saying that, I didn't experience any issues like this using ADSL.

Different routers handle queueing differently, maybe your last router simply handled it better.

the issue your experiencing is textbook results of a connection being saturated in the upstream.

in terms of the move up in technology, VDSL is using PTM rather than ATM in the DSL layer for transits which IMO is a massive benefit even if there is no speed change between ADSL and VDSL.

#include <std_disclaimer>

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

variable

124 posts

Master Geek

#1559621 25-May-2016 20:14

hio77:

variable:

well yeah, I have dropbox and icloud, but I think it's more due to google photos uploading images. Saying that, I didn't experience any issues like this using ADSL.

Different routers handle queueing differently, maybe your last router simply handled it better.

the issue your experiencing is textbook results of a connection being saturated in the upstream.

in terms of the move up in technology, VDSL is using PTM rather than ATM in the DSL layer for transits which IMO is a massive benefit even if there is no speed change between ADSL and VDSL.

OK thank you for the info, will keep an eye on the connection.

variable

124 posts

Master Geek

#1568143 8-Jun-2016 18:32

It's me again, after 13 days, I am still having bad connection... dns takes forever to resolve and page takes forever to load...

See below separate tests, either ping is too high or jitter is massive

RunningMan

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#1568146 8-Jun-2016 18:40

What happens when you stop your Google photos upload?

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Trade NZ and US shares and funds with Sharesies (affiliate link).

variable

124 posts

Master Geek

#1568189 8-Jun-2016 20:10

RunningMan:

What happens when you stop your Google photos upload?

A bit better, looks like the upload is killing the download, any way to prioritise download on Orcon Modem?

hio77

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Lizard Networks

#1568224 8-Jun-2016 20:32

different modems and routers handle queuing differently.

What your seeing is quite simply, bufferbloat in terms of the latency.

as for your DNS issues, it is udp based, congesting your line will cause packets to be dropped, UDP packets would not be retransmitted. so your DNS server needs to work out it failed to resolve and try again.

Heres a quick test on my line, peak time usage so little more latency and network usage than normal. Im not about to brave the force of unplugging everyone!

To test for you, here is the same test with all queuing disabled on my router (do be aware, the modem is still doing its queuing - be it only handling bridging)

on an average device, handling queuing is rather basic and limited. for download performance, you want to be prioritising your ACKs in particular, although everything would want to be above bulk level transfers. Dont think the orcon modem has very much in options here.

Often the trick to queuing is, you give some speed for leway to control things. its a catch22, You cant magically make things work.

Encase you want details to compare directly, my setup is a TG582n bridged to PFsense, VLAN 10 PPPoE over adsl. it seems this evening vodafone have a odd jump in their network over the Layer 2 routing adding a pretty flat 7~8ms ontop of everything. my queuing is FAIRQ based, with codel extensions applied.

Codel is an interesting topic in queueing to read up on if your technically interested.

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sbiddle

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#1568275 8-Jun-2016 21:10

variable:

It's me again, after 13 days, I am still having bad connection... dns takes forever to resolve and page takes forever to load...

See below separate tests, either ping is too high or jitter is massive

You are still saturating your upload. Once you resolve that your issues will go away.

variable

124 posts

Master Geek

#1568277 8-Jun-2016 21:16

So my upload is affecting ack packets it seems, any Orcon guys here to help me configure QoS on their modem(white one) please? I haven't done it before.

hio77

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Lizard Networks

#1568286 8-Jun-2016 21:28

variable: So my upload is affecting ack packets it seems, any Orcon guys here to help me configure QoS on their modem(white one) please? I haven't done it before.

ill say it again, you cant simply expect QoS to magically fix everything.

Saturation is saturation, mitigation is possible but it will always have an affect on you.

#include <std_disclaimer>

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

variable

124 posts

Master Geek

#1568316 8-Jun-2016 21:58

hio77:

variable: So my upload is affecting ack packets it seems, any Orcon guys here to help me configure QoS on their modem(white one) please? I haven't done it before.

ill say it again, you cant simply expect QoS to magically fix everything.

Saturation is saturation, mitigation is possible but it will always have an affect on you.

Fair enough, cheers.

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