So where is the 'new' TiVo?

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BlueShift

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#105991 16-Jul-2012 13:29

It looks like there's only a bare handful of TiVos left in a few out of the way Noel Leemings and Bond & Bonds. A friend just bought pretty much the last one left in Hamilton - a display model.

So, what's next? The demand is still there, I have a couple of other aquaintances who I've recommended TiVo to, but they now can't find one. If there is a new, larger model coming, where is it? And how much will it be.

Right now (well, over the last 6 months) TiVo has been a no-brainer - you just cannot buy a better, or equal, PVR for less than $300. If and when a new one turns up, its price point will be vital to its marketability. If its more-or-less the same TiVO with a bigger hard disk, they'll be hard pushed to sell it for more than $300-$400 - disk is cheap. As soon as the price gets over $400 or so, then you can start comparing TiVo with other options; it may still be the better choice, but there's something to compare it with anyway.

There's got to be a marketing textbook somewhere with a case study on TiVo in NZ as a 'how not to do it' lesson.

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#656466 16-Jul-2012 13:35

Trademe

But the $300 price was a run out, so when/if the new one comes out, which I think has a bigger harddrive, I doubt it will be as low as $300.

Jaxson

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#656469 16-Jul-2012 13:38

I agree. TIVO's unanimous choice position of late has been based on price predominantly. At a higher price point you get into competition with the 'official' freeveiw approved MHEG5 EPG based units like the Magic TV etc. TIVO does still have an out of the box web booking system, and presumably the new unit will still include the WIFI dongle adaptor?

Who owns or is pushing TIVO here now though? As I understood it Hybrid were Australia based? I'm not sure that someone is lined up ready to release the new unit? The infrastructure/web signup site etc is all there so it is ready to go.

All freeview channels are supplied on one of 3 muxes on the terrestrial service. Technically there is scope for a 3 tuner unit, which if the software was smart enough, would allow you to record anything at any stage. This would offer a point of difference over all the other units currently being pushed on the market to date. There is no need for more than 3 tuners here currently, unless the software is limited to one channel per tuner.

I don't necessarily think you'll see any new product at similar prices. I get the feeling this was a run out price to clear all stock on a loss of a business opportunity.

mattwnz

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#656474 16-Jul-2012 13:42

I get the feeling this was a run out price to clear all stock on a loss of a business opportunity.

I think they may bring the new one into NZ, because they still need to support the current devices, so they still need some presence here. I hope they do, becuase we do need competition in the PVR market, and is does give sky a bit of competition with their device. If it had better content in caspa, tvnz ondemand and even the possibility to screen live sport on a pay per view basis, it would be a big advantage.

Jaxson

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#656484 16-Jul-2012 13:48

mattwnz: If it had better content in caspa, tvnz ondemand and even the possibility to screen live sport on a pay per view basis, it would be a big advantage.

Yeah, the put TVNZ on demand on the PS3 for instance.

I find the interface clunky, but I do have a TIVO as price wise it can't be beat.

IGLOO with a better device may fill the gap people are wanting really. TIVO seems a bit loner'd to me, in that it's got the capability but not the backing of the big players. I agree, if it was supported more here it would be great.

Klipspringer

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#656489 16-Jul-2012 13:50

Jaxson:TIVO does still have an out of the box web booking system, and presumably the new unit will still include the WIFI dongle adaptor?

Of course it does.

http://genie.mytivo.co.nz/

As for the wifi dongle. I used it before I ran a cable. But I think its a good idea to have for those that can't wire a physiclal ethernet cable. Wifi dongle is just a bonus.

Dunnersfella

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#656493 16-Jul-2012 14:00

Without a NZ presence, some companies simply won't retail Tivo - Harvey's for one.
As soon as a Tivo is priced around the $500 price point, people will start looking at Magic TV's or all-in-one devices like the Panasonic DMR-XW390.
It's clear that Tivo was only a strong proposition for consumers when the price was low... and when Telecom weren't the exclusive retailer. However, it would take a bold importer to take on the new Tivo at a higher RRP.

Klipspringer

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#656498 16-Jul-2012 14:10

Dunnersfella: Without a NZ presence, some companies simply won't retail Tivo - Harvey's for one.
As soon as a Tivo is priced around the $500 price point, people will start looking at Magic TV's or all-in-one devices like the Panasonic DMR-XW390.
It's clear that Tivo was only a strong proposition for consumers when the price was low... and when Telecom weren't the exclusive retailer. However, it would take a bold importer to take on the new Tivo at a higher RRP.

I agree. But there are now thousands of Happy Tivo users out there. Those that don't have a Tivo yet have probably lost out. But all those happy customers like me would seriously look at buying the new one when it comes out. Even if its $200 more expensive, and has even better features that the current model.

Tivo made a mistake with not designing the box to be capable of using both UHF and freeview Satellite. I think they would have had a stonger footprint in NZ. I know people for instance that would love to downgrade to Tivo from Sky. But they could not be bothered with installing a UHF arial. There is nothing in the market for them that can compare to the price and functionality of a Tivo.

The low price of late has just helped Tivo enter the market. Lets hope they don't pull the plug

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mattwnz

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#656501 16-Jul-2012 14:15

Jaxson:
mattwnz: If it had better content in caspa, tvnz ondemand and even the possibility to screen live sport on a pay per view basis, it would be a big advantage.

Yeah, the put TVNZ on demand on the PS3 for instance.

I find the interface clunky, but I do have a TIVO as price wise it can't be beat.

IGLOO with a better device may fill the gap people are wanting really.? TIVO seems a bit loner'd to me, in that it's got the capability but not the backing of the big players.? I agree, if it was supported more here it would be great.

I can't see the current igloo being a tivo replacement as it isn't a PVR. It is really just a STB, with some programing saving ability using a usb key. Perhaps if they brought out a PVR , it may fill a gap
The problem with on demand on the PS3 according to the tvnz website, is that the PS3 doesn't have the processing power to run higher resolution programs, but I think the tivo would, as it can run movies with caspa. But that probably would never now happen as tvnz have an agreement with sky with the igloo.

Klipspringer

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#656505 16-Jul-2012 14:20

mattwnz:
The problem with on demand on the PS3 according to the tvnz website, is that the PS3 doesn't have the processing power to run higher resolution programs, but I think the tivo would, as it can run movies with caspa. But that probably would never now happen as tvnz have an agreement with sky with the igloo.

TVNZ then are seriously misinformed. PS3 probably has more processing power than the Tivo. Its designed for gaming

PS3 runs blueray movies just fine from disk. And I use it to stream Full HD, 1080p HDX movies from Vudu. Even have a couple saved to the hard drive which I have purchased.

mattwnz

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#656507 16-Jul-2012 14:27

BraaiGuy:
mattwnz:
The problem with on demand on the PS3 according to the tvnz website, is that the PS3 doesn't have the processing power to run higher resolution programs, but I think the tivo would, as it can run movies with caspa. But that probably would never now happen as tvnz have an agreement with sky with the igloo.

TVNZ then are seriously misinformed. PS3 probably has more processing power than the Tivo. Its designed for gaming

PS3 runs blueray movies just fine from disk. And I use it to stream Full HD, 1080p HDX movies from Vudu. Even have a couple saved to the hard drive which I have purchased.

http://tvnz.co.nz/video/faq

Why is the 1500Kbps stream option not available via the TVNZ Ondemand PS3 Player?
We've tried to offer a 1500Kbps stream on the the Playstation 3 but the video playback experience wasn't good enough to make it worthwhile. The PS3 has a limited amount of processing power.

Maybe it has something to do with the codecs used, where it is not as efficient on the ps3

Klipspringer

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#656508 16-Jul-2012 14:30

mattwnz:
BraaiGuy:
mattwnz:
The problem with on demand on the PS3 according to the tvnz website, is that the PS3 doesn't have the processing power to run higher resolution programs, but I think the tivo would, as it can run movies with caspa. But that probably would never now happen as tvnz have an agreement with sky with the igloo.

TVNZ then are seriously misinformed. PS3 probably has more processing power than the Tivo. Its designed for gaming

PS3 runs blueray movies just fine from disk. And I use it to stream Full HD, 1080p HDX movies from Vudu. Even have a couple saved to the hard drive which I have purchased.

http://tvnz.co.nz/video/faq

Why is the 1500Kbps stream option not available via the TVNZ Ondemand PS3 Player?
We've tried to offer a 1500Kbps stream on the the Playstation 3 but the video playback experience wasn't good enough to make it worthwhile. The PS3 has a limited amount of processing power.

Maybe it has something to do with the codecs used, where it is not as efficient on the ps3

Its probably due to them trying to run it through the PS3 web browser. They should build a PS3 app for it like they have done for Vudu, Netflix, Hulu etc ...

Jaxson

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#656515 16-Jul-2012 14:45

Yeah Mattwnz, I was thinking along the lines of Igloo bringing out a PVR. That's not likely to happen either though with the possible poaching from mySKY.

BraaiGuy, I didn't ever say Tivo didn't have a web interface. You seem quite defensive, but others such as Dunnersfella have identified quite clearly viable reasons why TIVO could have issues at a higher price point.

The PS3 is certainly capable of supporting higher res graphics, as you have mentioned it is a bluray capable player itself. Possibly it's not fully supportive, maybe codec wise, to stream via the web interface component. The option for high/low quality TVNZ ondemand streaming has gone now via the PS3. And I agree, a native app would probably work much better.

The big problem now seems to be that no one local is pushing/owning the product. Whilst we have all won from the price of the clearance product, financially bringing TIVO to NZ was a huge flop. One that's not likely to reassure future investors.

PimpMyMagic

267 posts

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#656546 16-Jul-2012 15:43

TVNZ On Demand is Flash Video which they have taken progressively through a number of formats, presumably to disable easy saving of downloaded files.
I imagine their licence agreements are to enable only live feeds and exclude methods of saving.
The quality is not that great either to encourage the generation of files that can be easily saved.

JimmyH

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#656611 16-Jul-2012 19:16

Dunnersfella: As soon as a Tivo is priced around the $500 price point, people will start looking at Magic TV's or all-in-one devices like the Panasonic DMR-XW390.

I would. I have a Tivo (which I got for $199) and it's a nice bit of kit, but I wouldn't pay much north of this for another one - I would go with the Panny instead. While the Tivo is a nice bit of kit:

- It's limited to Freeview only and, to be blunt, with the demise of TVNZ7 etc there is so little content on FV that's worth recording/watching, the value proposition for a dedicated FV recorder is low. At least the Panny has external inputs can record off a T-Box or Sky STB as well.

- I now have a home network setup feeding several WD TV Lives etc. I understand that I can pull recorded material straight off the Panny using DLNA, without having to transfer to a PC first and/or transcode. The Tivo, even with the HNP purchased, won't let me do that.

- Burning disks for archiving or moving material around is a nice plus with the Panny.

So, in summary, while mine has been an interesting experiment and it's a nice elegant bit of kit with a good UI, it's limitations coupled with the sad state of content on FV mean that I couldn't & wouldn't recommend it to anyone above a $300(ish) price point. Above that point the comparative value proposition from the alternatives starts to get too good.

Skolink

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#656672 16-Jul-2012 21:03

BlueShift:
So, what's next? The demand is still there, I have a couple of other aquaintances who I've recommended TiVo to, but they now can't find one. If there is a new, larger model coming, where is it? And how much will it be.

You mean this one?

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