Real estate, post COVID-19 level 4 (since 2020)

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#3256557 5-Jul-2024 10:59

tweake:

people get so bent out of shape about their house value falling. as long as the cost/situation fits you, then who cares what the value does. the only time it really matters is when you use that value to buy something else and thats typically another house. plus kiwis have short eyesight, values may go down today but it will go up in 10-20 years time. which is why people sit and wait. note the recent article showing many people pulling their house from the market, they are sitting and waiting for the price to go up to get their profit margin.

Exactly: I always say, the house may go up or down in dollar terms, but when denominated in "number of houses" or "square metres of shelter" it stays consistent over the years...

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mudguard

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#3256559 5-Jul-2024 11:03

tweake:

people get so bent out of shape about their house value falling. as long as the cost/situation fits you, then who cares what the value does. the only time it really matters is when you use that value to buy something else and thats typically another house. plus kiwis have short eyesight, values may go down today but it will go up in 10-20 years time.

Again, this entirely depends when someone bought. There are people who have bought recently that may have had their equity wiped out, which in real terms, is their deposit. So they don't have much choice other than to stay put, hope they stay employed etc.

I bought my first home about three years ago in Auckland. However I'm being made redundant (very slowly) so there is a genuine chance I may need to sell and move. As I'll go where I can find work. So some can definitely list and then pull it if it doesn't get near their asking price (a friend has just done this). Up until I was informed about work I had no desire or intention to move. But it could be forced on me. I'm ambivalent about values, I just wanted to not be moved out of a rental every year or two. I'd be quite happy to stay in the house indefinitely. But I have to be able to afford it. Friends of ours down the road bought and possibly a grossly inflated price. If they sold now, I suspect their 20% deposit will have vanished. Which will leave them worse off than most renters.

tweake

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#3256561 5-Jul-2024 11:05

alasta:

tweake:

thats another interesting quirk of nz homes, most people expect a custom built house or a customized house. eg it may be off the plans but they want their colors, their kitchen sink, their tapware etc. that all adds to the price. but then again nz really doesn't do much in the way of mass production housing.

I bought my place off the plans and the developer gave us the choice of four colour palettes, but refused any other customisations. That seemed like a good compromise to keep the process efficient while still allowing some personalisation.

Having said that, some of my neighbours have smashed out cabinetry and fittings to replace them with their own preferred alternatives. It's probably not very efficient to have nearly new materials thrown away and replaced like that.

the thing is they won't be getting a great deal on paint and that cost will be past on. where companies make money is by buying bulk. they will buy truck loads of paint, but that means it is usually all the one color direct from the manufacture.

while its not efficient, its not always a bad idea to have cheap cabinets etc and replace with their dream kitchen later on. what i dislike is when people shortcut the basic building in order to get their dream kitchen straight away. eg they have a tent with a 200k kitchen, instead of building a decent house, and have a cheap throwaway kitchen until they can afford their dream kitchen.

tweake

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#3256571 5-Jul-2024 11:17

mudguard:

tweake:

people get so bent out of shape about their house value falling. as long as the cost/situation fits you, then who cares what the value does. the only time it really matters is when you use that value to buy something else and thats typically another house. plus kiwis have short eyesight, values may go down today but it will go up in 10-20 years time.

Again, this entirely depends when someone bought. There are people who have bought recently that may have had their equity wiped out, which in real terms, is their deposit. So they don't have much choice other than to stay put, hope they stay employed etc.

I bought my first home about three years ago in Auckland. However I'm being made redundant (very slowly) so there is a genuine chance I may need to sell and move. As I'll go where I can find work. So some can definitely list and then pull it if it doesn't get near their asking price (a friend has just done this). Up until I was informed about work I had no desire or intention to move. But it could be forced on me. I'm ambivalent about values, I just wanted to not be moved out of a rental every year or two. I'd be quite happy to stay in the house indefinitely. But I have to be able to afford it. Friends of ours down the road bought and possibly a grossly inflated price. If they sold now, I suspect their 20% deposit will have vanished. Which will leave them worse off than most renters.

your only loosing if you sell out. otherwise your selling and buying in the same market. however it can come down to what risk the bank thinks you are, if they will let you continue with a high mortgage. which may mean having to buy something lower price to reduce debt level. that can be a big problem if you only have an entry level home.

otherwise stay put. kiwis move around way way to much.

kingdragonfly

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#3256572 5-Jul-2024 11:17

It reminds me of Feng Shui advisors, insisting on replacing tiled floors, carpet, wallpaper, and paint for each new tenant. It's not very environmental friendly

This article on roof repair is earnest, not a parody.

Open Spaces Feng Shui: How a Damaged Roof Can Affect Your Home's Feng Shui
...
It is important to address any roofing issues promptly to ensure an uninterrupted and healthy flow of energy within your home.
...
By unblocking the energy flow, you can create a more vibrant and uplifting living environment, which is essential for maintaining a positive feng shui.
...
Furthermore, if the damage is due to external factors such as natural disasters or vandalism, the negative energy can be even more intense and difficult to dispel. It is essential to address any roofing issues and clear out any negative energy to maintain a positive feng shui in your home.
...
In feng shui, the condition of the roof is often seen as a reflection of one's financial stability. A damaged or leaky roof can symbolize financial struggles and difficulties. This can create a negative energy in the home and affect the occupants' mindset, leading to financial stress and strain on relationships.

By addressing any roofing issues promptly, you can improve your home's feng shui and potentially bring positive changes in your financial situation. Additionally, maintaining a well-maintained roof can also attract positive opportunities and abundance into your life according to feng shui principles.
...

mudguard

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#3256582 5-Jul-2024 12:03

tweake:

Your only loosing if you sell out. otherwise your selling and buying in the same market. however it can come down to what risk the bank thinks you are, if they will let you continue with a high mortgage. which may mean having to buy something lower price to reduce debt level. that can be a big problem if you only have an entry level home.

otherwise stay put. kiwis move around way way to much.

I think you've misread what I typed. If your equity is removed you lose out completely. Doesn't matter if you move from Auckland to Invercargill. Your deposit is gone.

Take hypothetical example.

Bought last year for

$1,000,000 with a $200,000 deposit. Now it's worth $800,000 and you need to sell because of redundancy, new job and different location etc. You still need to repay the bank. You can't downsize to a $600,000 house as you still have no deposit.

Now your deposit for you next house is zero. So you can't move and buy in Invercargill even if wanted to. The only way is to stay put. Which is fine if you can.

You talk about entry level homes, is it cheaper to spec up an entry level home to say medium? Or is it cheaper to sell and buy? I wouldn't have a clue. I assume people move for all sorts of reasons, I'm not sure it boils down to capital gains, the IRD is very conscious of that behaviour.

Perhaps people buy and sell more in Auckland, it's understandable given it's size. If you get a new job in say Timaru or Nelson where you live within it doesn't really matter. But if you live in Albany and suddenly get a job in East Tamaki, you might want to move.

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cddt

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#3256589 5-Jul-2024 12:29

mudguard:

Perhaps people buy and sell more in Auckland, it's understandable given it's size. If you get a new job in say Timaru or Nelson where you live within it doesn't really matter. But if you live in Albany and suddenly get a job in East Tamaki, you might want to move.

Once you have kids settled in schools etc. you're unlikely to move, even if a change of job means a long commute.

Especially these days when a job loyalty is rarely rewarded, you wouldn't up sticks and move to East Tamaki when you know in a year or two you might be forced to find yet another job in another suburb again...

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tweake

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#3256590 5-Jul-2024 12:30

mudguard:

You talk about entry level homes, is it cheaper to spec up an entry level home to say medium? Or is it cheaper to sell and buy? I wouldn't have a clue. I assume people move for all sorts of reasons, I'm not sure it boils down to capital gains, the IRD is very conscious of that behaviour.

IRD doesn't care one bit. theres no tax on the family home, brightline has never applied to the family home. why do you think kiwis love it so much. kiwis move for short term capital gains. national average is only 7 years (at the peak i'm told it was down to 5 years). most nz born kiwis live within 100km of where they are born. from my years as a tradie i had lots of repeat customers who only move from one side of town to the other, sometimes only streets away, or the town down the road. even my own house has had 8 owners in 30 years, i'm probably the longest owner already.

most tend to reno to sell. not uncommon for major reno, add extra rooms etc, and then sell a few years later. people up spec a cheap home to get max profit, then jump up a level or two.

mudguard

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#3256602 5-Jul-2024 13:04

tweake:

national average is only 7 years (at the peak i'm told it was down to 5 years).

most tend to reno to sell. not uncommon for major reno, add extra rooms etc, and then sell a few years later. people up spec a cheap home to get max profit, then jump up a level or two.

I haven't looked to see how the averages stack up globally. I did find a stat that said a million homes have never been listed. IE in the sixteen years of that digital record, they'd never been listed. Seven years seems pretty reasonable. As someone pointed out, you might stay put once kids are in school. But how many need to change houses once they have kids? Is the pre-kids home suitable for 1,2 or 3 kids? No idea, but can't imagine many starting out with 3-4 bedrooms as their first home. Maybe. I don't know.

tweake

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#3256607 5-Jul-2024 13:20

mudguard:

tweake:

national average is only 7 years (at the peak i'm told it was down to 5 years).

most tend to reno to sell. not uncommon for major reno, add extra rooms etc, and then sell a few years later. people up spec a cheap home to get max profit, then jump up a level or two.

I haven't looked to see how the averages stack up globally. I did find a stat that said a million homes have never been listed. IE in the sixteen years of that digital record, they'd never been listed. Seven years seems pretty reasonable. As someone pointed out, you might stay put once kids are in school. But how many need to change houses once they have kids? Is the pre-kids home suitable for 1,2 or 3 kids? No idea, but can't imagine many starting out with 3-4 bedrooms as their first home. Maybe. I don't know.

seven years is insanely short. in comparison usa is double that. i have not seen good data on uk, but what i have seen suggest an average of about 10 years even tho they have similar house buying habits as us. yes there would be a lot of houses in nz that have never been sold or 30+ year ownership etc, i personally know quite a few. that gives you some idea of how often the rest are sold to get that average. kiwis love to flip houses.

3 bedrooms as a first home is pretty common. theres not many 2 brm homes left these days.

alasta

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#3256628 5-Jul-2024 14:02

You need to take social trends into account. Birth rates are declining and living alone is becoming more common.

I bought my one bedroom unit in Wellington when I was 40 and intend to stay there until I retire at which point I would like to move to somewhere else like the Wairarapa or upper South Island.

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Eitsop

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#3256793 5-Jul-2024 21:43

Well I am keen to subdivide my father in laws real/urban fringe property in ChCh that is 100m away from residential area and build a new house for the family..

When will these rules come into place? how long will it take for council to zone 30 years of property?

mattwnz

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#3256798 6-Jul-2024 00:45

When I heard the new rules about not having a minimum size on new apartments, I couldn't believe it. Didn't they learn the last time. History always repeats. Also no requirement for a building consent on 'Granny Flats ' (which will become small rentals). Not consent I presume also means no council inspections on 'Granny flats' which is crazy. Don't they know how many defects councils pick up on new builds, and a granny flat is still a house that should be up to the same building and safety standards.

kingdragonfly

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#3256803 6-Jul-2024 07:26

RNZ: Granny flat rule changes: The gritty detail, explained

...the granny flats could be up to 60 square metres in size.

... the dwelling could only be one-storey high and had to be detached from the main house.

There was nothing in the proposal saying how many bedrooms the dwelling could have, with McKay saying a dwelling of that size could easily have two along with living, kitchen, dining and a bathroom.

The dwellings could be built without consent - as long as they met certain criteria
...
notify their local council that they were planning to build such a dwelling - and they would need to get some information.

This included areas on the property that were prone to flooding.

Once the build was complete, the council would need to be notified and be supplied with some drawings, showing locations of drains, for example.

All dwellings would still need to comply with the Building Code.
...
current proposal only allowed one granny flat per property and it must be near the main house.

alasta

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#3256827 6-Jul-2024 11:11

My place is a 40sqm structurally independant unit on tall piles. When I moved in I discovered numerous examples of defective workmanship, so I dread to think what I would have been left with if the structural aspects had not been subject to council inspection.

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