Electricity plan shopping

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#2906165 24-Apr-2022 17:50

crewsaider: I am looking at this Bluetooth timer set-up from the PDL Iconic range.

Thanks. Have never used the new PDL Iconic range. Looking at user guide it says internal time is retained for at least 6 hours in power failure. So after 6 hours I would need to connect my phone to the module? Does it default to 24/7 ON until I connect my phone? If not I wouldn't be very popular with the household if that happened while I was away.

I'm looking for a module that is Normally Closed so in event of any failures the HWC will default to ON.

raytaylor

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#2906291 25-Apr-2022 10:12

crewsaider:

I am looking at this Bluetooth timer set-up from the PDL Iconic range.

I am very keen on that device but i cannot find it on the Ideal electrical website

Edit: Nevermind i see its multiple product codes.

Ray Taylor

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xlinknz

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#2906485 25-Apr-2022 14:18

Ragnor:

Jase2985:

dont trust the information you get from Powerswitch (if you used it), some of it is out of date and doesn't include the recent changes in power prices (EK for instance pricing if from FEB)

Yes depends on when pricing was last updated, however a number of providers have just updated in April ie: Genesis, Frank, Mercury and Powershop

Tried switching to Genesis as the new rates are competitive for us however their website totally fails, the link from powerswitch with the ICP isn't used it takes you to a generic join form that doesn't work for our address.

Similar problem on Frank (which is also Genesis) our addresses resolves to our neighbours ICP.. classic, I wonder how many run into these basic issues and give up on that provider, I won't be spending any time chasing them to fix their systems.i

I guess I should analyze whether Electric Kiwi Move Master would be worthwhile without excessive time shifting of usage from our normal usage....

Updated prices were supposed to be available to consumers 4th April with low user plans being phased out and gas suppliers allowed to increase. I waited for this date before using Powerswitch to check I was getting the best deal and found that my providers new plans which had be out for weeks were not on Powerswitch. I asked Powerswitch and they said they had not being received yet and my provider said they were working towards getting them to Powerswitch...

It appears that Powerswitch rely on the providers to provide updated pricing rather than ensuring the Powerswitch tool is up to date. Powerswitch should not wait for providers they should be proactive and monitor and update otherwise I have little doubt some providers will deliberately delay to ensure they do not loose customers esp. when the govt announces dates on possible increases. I know one provider who does not offer plans on Powerswitch and I suspect the reason is that they know they are not necessarily competitive and would rather rely on prime time tv ads that make you think they are a good deal.

WyleECoyoteNZ

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#2906548 25-Apr-2022 16:43

I'm watching this thread with some interest.

Not currently with any provider, as living with the in-laws for around 6 months or so. Was previously with Contact on a fixed term deal where Daily charge was $0.30 with a per kWh charge of $0.2360.

Yes, they are Low user charges, as the where we were living also had LPG hot water, via twin 45Kg cylinders.

For the past 3 3/4 years, I've been recording my usage, and 'Forecasting' my monthly bill. And although yearly usage has increased, my last full year was only 6648kWH, up from 6396kWh.

What I've found interesting when looking today (at what I'll refer to as the Big Boys (Contact, Genesis, Mercury & Meridian)

- Contact and Genesis (for the 2 plans I've looked at for each) still have the 'old' daily charge ($0.30)

- Mercury & Meridian have doubled (and then some) the daily charge (Mercury quote $0.6566 & Meridian ($0.69)

- There is no consistency in reporting the per KWh rate charge, Genesis & Meridian report it at 2dp, Contact at 3dp and Mercury at 4dp. A difference in 2dp vs 4pd can vary the monthly bill by somewhere around +/- $7

For reference, this is a guide to the phasing out of the Low user charges

https://www.mbie.govt.nz/building-and-energy/energy-and-natural-resources/energy-consultations-and-reviews/electricity-price/phasing-out-low-fixed-charge-tariff-regulations/

A question I do have, for those plans that offer a 'free hour', they generally speaking have a slightly higher kWh charge, so are they actually worth it ?

We're a family of 4 (2 adults, 2 children), with someone usually home during the day, then children home after school.

If you are using a plan with a free hour, have you had to change the way you live ? E.g. when I get home from work, we have dinner, do the dishes, then vege out until bed.

Nate001

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Ultimate Geek

#2906551 25-Apr-2022 16:56

WyleECoyoteNZ:

A question I do have, for those plans that offer a 'free hour', they generally speaking have a slightly higher kWh charge, so are they actually worth it ?

...

If you are using a plan with a free hour, have you had to change the way you live ? E.g. when I get home from work, we have dinner, do the dishes, then vege out until bed.

You said you got data, so give it a crunch and see for your use case. Plans like contacts 9-midnight is an example where you really have to shift your usage, or be charging an EV, otherwise the higher kWh rate really hits you.

Really to get the most of these plans you'll need to automate or use timers for high usage items. And consider a HWC timer like I currently am considering. If you can shift all your reheating of evening water usage to 9pm you may save a lot.

smcc

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#2906552 25-Apr-2022 16:59

I changed from EK stay ahead 200 when the put their prices up last time (before move master was available), I am now with Contact Good nights, the rates are around the same as EK new ones but with 3 hours free everyday I am getting over 1/3 of my usage for free. I am quite a high user so that is significant to me. We have moved some activities to 9pm and use timers for some things, but we can now run heat pump for 3 hours summer and winter at no cost, so we sleep well on warm and cold nights, and don't need much extra heating unless it's a really cold day.

I would put that in the mix also when you do your comparison.

here is a referral code that gives each $100 if you go this way. Referral

michaelmurfy

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#2906572 25-Apr-2022 18:08

As I said before - the Good Nights plan has a much hire per unit charge (and in my case - higher daily charge) meaning you've got to shift -quite a bit- of your usage to that 3 hours for it to be worthwhile.

Movemaster for the majority of households is far better.

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Jase2985

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#2906583 25-Apr-2022 18:32

michaelmurfy:

As I said before - the Good Nights plan has a much hire per unit charge (and in my case - higher daily charge) meaning you've got to shift -quite a bit- of your usage to that 3 hours for it to be worthwhile.

Movemaster for the majority of households is far better.

if you have an EV and can charge at 7.6kw then 3 hours free would be golden. then add HW heat pumps etc and your near maxing out your service.

it all depends on how much load you can shift and when you can shift it to. We use about 1100kwh a month and we cant really shift much power so either plan doesn't really help us much.

raytaylor

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#2906596 25-Apr-2022 20:42

michaelmurfy:

As I said before - the Good Nights plan has a much hire per unit charge (and in my case - higher daily charge) meaning you've got to shift -quite a bit- of your usage to that 3 hours for it to be worthwhile.

Movemaster for the majority of households is far better.

I loggged into the contact portal and looked at hourly usage for the last 3 months. I found that if I kept the exact same usage profile, the price of the good nights plan was within $3 of my old everyday contact plan.

So they had obviously taken the number of kilowatts consumed in the 9-midnight period, then changed the onpeak rate to match exactly their losses from the units sold at no charge between 9-midnight.
I dont think my flat is very special in terms of our usage profile so i would feel confident in saying that if you switch to the goodnight plan, it will probably cost exactly the same as before and any load shifting you do is going to be a bonus.

Ray Taylor

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smcc

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#2906611 25-Apr-2022 22:59

michaelmurfy:

As I said before - the Good Nights plan has a much hire per unit charge (and in my case - higher daily charge) meaning you've got to shift -quite a bit- of your usage to that 3 hours for it to be worthwhile.

Movemaster for the majority of households is far better.

Interesting you say that because it's not the case for me. I changed because the unit charge was less than the increased EK charges. The savings for 9-12 free are a big bonus and I have some large use things I can shift to that time, so I save a lot. However as I said move master wasn't on offer to me at that time (last year), even then I think it would be had to beat 35% of my usage at no cost.

michaelmurfy

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#2906619 26-Apr-2022 01:41

Jase2985:

if you have an EV and can charge at 7.6kw then 3 hours free would be golden. then add HW heat pumps etc and your near maxing out your service.

I even calculated charging the Tesla (at 32a), doing the washing etc during those 3 hours and I would have still been worse off (by around $50/mo) over and above my current plan.

There is the other aspect to it also - normally I am in bed by 10pm most nights with the exception of tonight and run a front loader washing machine that takes ~1hr to do a load (it does heat its own water) and also have a heat pump dryer which really, compared to a conventional dryer uses bugger all power.

The heatpumps are often used throughout the day and even night regardless especially during summer. Computer gear is always on too.

It may work for some households but really given the per unit cost along with the daily cost it is more a marketing scheme as they are making their money back for the majority of users with these higher charges. I have a few friends of mine who will be better with another provider than this plan despite having an EV.

My current supplier (EK) does the same with their hour of power but I do get use out of this and my normal rates are already low compared to other companies. I often find with my daily driving my car can charge within the hour free (I don't need to charge any more) and we normally have showers just before so the HWC is heating during that time too - I do draw a fair few amps in this hour (average 30% per day) :)

@smcc Interesting - you're right. If it were not for Movemaster I would have been worse off on EK. I was incorrect on the daily charge as this is cheaper on Contact for my address with the new EK pricing but not by much. 86% of my use falls in off-peak usage (which I am guessing includes shoulder use).

timmmay

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#2906625 26-Apr-2022 06:58

Interesting - I couldn't get "good nights" plan because they say some smart meters don't work reliably. I was just curious about the price I wasn't looking to change.

To go on the Good Nights plan, you need to have a communicating smart meter that records and send us your electricity usage at every half-hourly interval. This way we can identify the right amounts of electricity used in the free periods vs the chargeable periods and bill you accordingly.

Unfortunately, some meter types aren’t as reliable in providing this half-hourly usage data as others, meaning we might not get all the data in time to bill you accurately. So, we’ve had to exclude some smart meters from being eligible for the plan.

Stu

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#2906688 26-Apr-2022 09:40

I got the same result from Contact regarding not having a compatible Smart Meter, even though the meter does supply half-hourly readings. It seems they may not have full data on all addresses.

People often mistake me for an adult because of my age.

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Eva888

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#2906697 26-Apr-2022 09:56

What strikes me about pricing and all these plans that require you to shift your usage is it’s just another thing the consumer has to worry about for an essential you pay for and which we can’t survive without. It puts the onus on the paying consumers to 'work' to get themselves a discount...if they can be bothered and which is probably what these power companies rely on.

Am thinking especially of those with young families who bath kids early are cooking at set times etc it’s not easy to change their bedtimes and feeding. Time shifting creates a discount only by you altering schedules but is still using the same amount of electricity so there's no environmental saving to feel holy about. It's just another stress trying to ensure everything is done within a certain time frame.

Look at the $ time spent by everyone trying to figure out the convoluted rates of each company to make a decision which power company to choose to pay a small fortune to. Understandable when buying a new toaster but this is electricity a necessity of life that we can’t live without. It should be straight-up easy and accessible.

IMHO I really wish the government or CC would step in and make electricity companies which are an essential service show clear daily usage rates on a published list from cheapest to most expensive. No frills and variables. If the power companies then want to gift you a TV or washing machine or free months or hours to join them WITHOUT you needing to change the time you shower etc, so be it, but the rates of all suppliers should be clear and simple enough for anyone to compare and make a decision.

Maybe by creating this clarity prices would be forced down because they would be prominent and obvious.

timmmay

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#2906705 26-Apr-2022 10:09

Eva888: Am thinking especially of those with young families who bath kids early are cooking at set times etc it’s not easy to change their bedtimes and feeding. Time shifting creates a discount only by you altering schedules but is still using the same amount of electricity so there's no environmental saving to feel holy about. It's just another stress trying to ensure everything is done within a certain time frame.

It takes some thought to optimise, but with MoveMaster the standard peak rate is pretty good so you can choose to optimise when you have time.

I have a young family, and I don't find it difficult. Hot water heating is on a timer, that's a big easy win but needs an electrician to fit a timer. You have to cook in peak time, but that's not so bad. You schedule heating to come on before peak time say 5/6am and 4pm, then turn it down a bit. Timers on many appliances such as dishwasher, clothes drier, washing machine make it easier. I manage 20 - 30% free hour and the rest is about 1/3 peak 1/3 shoulder 1/3 night, given I work from home.

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