Best way to connect up Night Rate meter.

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Shoes2468

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#196559 4-Jun-2016 10:48

Hi Everyone

We moved into a new house recently and for electricity it has day rate meter and a separate Night Rate meter which used to be hooked up to the hot water cylinder. The previous owners got the hot water cylinder hooked up to the day rate because they had lots of people in the house at one point and need more hot water its a 300l cylinder. Anyway long story short we are going to get the hot water hooked back up to the night rate meter at some point but I was wondering if there was a way that the whole house could move over to the night rate when there was power and then switch back to normal rate when there wasnt any power coming out of the night rate meter? Because we signed up with Meridian when moving we are locked into a 12 month contract. I dont really want to go down the route of changing to Flick or the likes because at the moment I don't really have enough time to be analyzing power usage throughout the day and working out when its best to put the dishwasher on etc. Essentially what I want is:

1. Power to the house during the day on day rate meter

2. At night when there is power to the night rate meter switch the house over to the Night Rate.

3. Hot water cylinder only runs on the night rate meter.

Any suggestions?

Spyware

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#1565583 4-Jun-2016 11:23

The more typical solution to the hot water cylinder problem was to install a switch and to switch the cylinder between either anytime or night rate meter as required manually, this is how mine is set up, and it would always be senseless from an economic perspective to only wire to the anytime rate (shouldn't be referred to as day) meter. Maybe have a look for such a switch on switchboard.

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richms

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#1565626 4-Jun-2016 12:43

Will be against the terms of the retailer to do that. Night rate is supposed to be for fixed loads only.

You may have a day/night tariff available that will charge everything at day prices and then switch everything to night prices but the day rate will be higher than the anytime rate.

I'm not sure of the legality of having wiring to violate the terms of the power company tariff so not sure if you could have an auto changeover from the anytime to night rate feed.

Richard rich.ms

timmmay

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#1565644 4-Jun-2016 13:12

Consider Flick Electric (ie market rate power not a set rate), a smart meter (Flick will install if your area is ready), and a timer (electrician fitted) so your hot water heats when you specify.

sir1963

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#1565695 4-Jun-2016 16:20

Shoes2468:

Hi Everyone

We moved into a new house recently and for electricity it has day rate meter and a separate Night Rate meter which used to be hooked up to the hot water cylinder. The previous owners got the hot water cylinder hooked up to the day rate because they had lots of people in the house at one point and need more hot water its a 300l cylinder. Anyway long story short we are going to get the hot water hooked back up to the night rate meter at some point but I was wondering if there was a way that the whole house could move over to the night rate when there was power and then switch back to normal rate when there wasnt any power coming out of the night rate meter? Because we signed up with Meridian when moving we are locked into a 12 month contract. I dont really want to go down the route of changing to Flick or the likes because at the moment I don't really have enough time to be analyzing power usage throughout the day and working out when its best to put the dishwasher on etc. Essentially what I want is:

1. Power to the house during the day on day rate meter

2. At night when there is power to the night rate meter switch the house over to the Night Rate.

3. Hot water cylinder only runs on the night rate meter.

Any suggestions?

Hot water was on a "Controlled" meter, i.e. the power company can turn off the power. They typically did this from about 7am to 9am and from about 5pm to 7pm, i.e. when there was peak loading from Breakfast/Dinner times. They could if there was some major disruption in the network do it outside these hours to reduce loading.

So water heating was on during the day and night outside those peak periods.

Because it could be turned off, they gave a discount.

Day/Night metering is where you pay one rate during the day and a different at "night" (11pm-7am). We have this and have delay times on the washing machine / Drier / Dishwasher so they come on after 11pm. We have Gas hot water (infinity system) so that is not an issue for us.

There was another form of power that was used for night storage heaters, they came on at 11 and off at 7am, some people also used this for water heating.

Shoes2468

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#1565767 4-Jun-2016 19:00

Spyware:
The more typical solution to the hot water cylinder problem was to install a switch and to switch the cylinder between either anytime or night rate meter as required manually, this is how mine is set up, and it would always be senseless from an economic perspective to only wire to the anytime rate (shouldn't be referred to as day) meter. Maybe have a look for such a switch on switchboard.

Thanks for this, yeah I thought this would be the case but no switch on the switchboard and checked with the previous owner and they confirmed they got it switched over to anytime meter. I would change to flick or the likes but we use a lot of power at peak times so doesn't make sense imo.

Shoes2468

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#1565768 4-Jun-2016 19:04

richms: Will be against the terms of the retailer to do that. Night rate is supposed to be for fixed loads only.

You may have a day/night tariff available that will charge everything at day prices and then switch everything to night prices but the day rate will be higher than the anytime rate.

I'm not sure of the legality of having wiring to violate the terms of the power company tariff so not sure if you could have an auto changeover from the anytime to night rate feed.

T&Cs are made to be broken :p just kidding. Hmm well that foils that plan, probably don't want to switch to a day/night as the higher day rate seems to outweigh the benefit at night. Guess I'll just get the hwc hooked backup to the night rate with an anytime boost switch

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Aredwood

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#1565935 5-Jun-2016 02:57

Since you have a 300L cylinder, see if it can be fitted with 2 elements. (with second one about 2/3 of the way up). If so connect the bottom element to the night rate power. and the top element to anytime power. Set thermostat on bottom element to slightly higher temp than top element thermostat. This gives the best of both worlds. (Almost) never run out of hot water. But still good economy as the bottom element on night rate does most of the heating.

kiwirock

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#1565937 5-Jun-2016 04:25

Depending on which part of the country you are in and your retailer, double check your night rates.

These days, there's very little difference unit price wise between controlled (including night only) and uncontrolled. Unless you're lucky enough to have a really old contract.

Whole house Day/Night as mentioned comes with a higher day rate.

I had a night only meter for hot water (instead of controlled with peak etc...) on an old contract with low user daily charges. It was brilliant if you live by yourself or are energy conscious with one other person.

The above suggestion of having two heating elements if possible is the way to go. However, having it installed and wired up may take a while to re-gain your investment in it.

timmmay

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#1565942 5-Jun-2016 07:19

We have a 300L tank, which only heats 2am - 7am, to get the cheap night rate power on Flick. 300L is fine for four showers, two warm loads of washing, dishes, and random hand washing. One you get to three or four loads of washing in a day the water in the tank is warm, not hot.

Note, because it heats once a day it's fine for legionnaires disease.

Shoes2468

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#1566073 5-Jun-2016 16:06

Aredwood:
Since you have a 300L cylinder, see if it can be fitted with 2 elements. (with second one about 2/3 of the way up). If so connect the bottom element to the night rate power. and the top element to anytime power. Set thermostat on bottom element to slightly higher temp than top element thermostat. This gives the best of both worlds. (Almost) never run out of hot water. But still good economy as the bottom element on night rate does most of the heating.

Hmm interesting suggestion, it does have two elements but both are pretty much at the bottom. It's reasonably old.