Ventilation in small flat..

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Stephendnz

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#257434 2-Oct-2019 22:17

Interested in any feedback on a ventilation issue.. I have a small 3 room flat under my house that has no ceiling space into which could be fitted a ventilation system.. Looked at it quite hard when installing a system in the main house upstairs but was just too hard.. There's 2 bedrooms and a combined lounge kitchen dining..

The problem is that tenants NEVER open F#$%ing windows.. of which there are plenty.. including 2 large ranch-sliders.. and they cook and wash and every other bloody thing and them moan because the curtains get mouldy..

I am considering installing through-wall extractor fans in a couple of places.. and trying to wondering if they they should be set to just extract air.. or reverse the wiring fit a filter and blow fresh air in..

Will extracting air do anything for creating fresher air, and what happens if it just keeps extracting air with no windows or doors open.. a couple of my concerns are that if I am blowing fresh cold air in, they will cover the vents or turn the fans off.. when I asked the mum the other day why they don't open the doors or windows.. she said the kids told them it was too cold.. and when I was there that day.. house all completely closed up and kids walking around in shorts and t shirts.. while complaining it's cold if they open a window.. sheesh..

To add to the problem there is no way to externally vent the rangehood in the little kitchen area.. I have a reticulating type rangehood which has always worked fine if the carbon filter is changed regularly..

I am going to get a shower dome type thing for above the shower but there is already a window next to the shower which is fitted with security stays and could easily be left open all the time but never is..

I know it is challenging for the tenants. but I myself have lived in the flat at different times and I always managed to keep if fresh and not mouldy.. but do you think I can get tenants to do this.. OMG..

Any helpful comments appreciated.

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#2328684 2-Oct-2019 22:23

Evict them, then get someone in to plan ventilation.

If you pull stale air out, air will have to come in from somewhere.

lNomNoml

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#2328685 2-Oct-2019 22:30

Get rid of the current tenants, if they don't have the common sense to keep the windows open when they obviously need to be then it will only get worse., Come up with a plan to improve the situation before the new tenants settle.

Fred99

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#2328691 2-Oct-2019 22:57

Stephendnz:

To add to the problem there is no way to externally vent the rangehood in the little kitchen area.. I have a reticulating type rangehood which has always worked fine if the carbon filter is changed regularly..

I am going to get a shower dome type thing for above the shower but there is already a window next to the shower which is fitted with security stays and could easily be left open all the time but never is..

Any helpful comments appreciated.

You probably won't appreciate this, but I live in my own house and I'll be stuffed if I would open the bathroom window in winter when having a shower, so I wouldn't expect anybody else to. Maybe I'm a sook - but that's why there's an extractor fan in there.

Same with the rangehood, it might be difficult to vent it externally, but I'd be making an all-out effort to do it anyway. Doing those two things would probably solve most of the problem.

richms

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#2328712 3-Oct-2019 00:18

TBH it sounds like you have built something unsuitable to live in if you cant install the fans etc that any normal rental will soon be legally required to have in them. Security stays are a myth, expecting them to leave a window open and freezing in winter when showering and exposing their stuff to less security is not reasonable.

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nickb800

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#2328728 3-Oct-2019 05:47

Heating is another avenue to explore, although they might be reluctant if they pay for power themselves. Heating the bathroom while showering reduces the formation of condensation. What about providing a ducted dryer to avoid indoor clothes drying?

bfginger

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#2328741 3-Oct-2019 08:29

The problem is that tenants NEVER open F#$%ing windows.

Don't evict them expecting other tenants to be better. You're finding out why so many landlords install ventilation systems and why some of them can't be turned off. Many tenants will never open the windows and some won't use any rangehood or extractor fan out of paranoia about them costing money to run.

Security stays of the kind used in New Zealand provide little security.

Put an extractor fan by the shower as it's going to become a legal requirement and shower domes sound horrible. Maybe there is some system of wall affixed piping for the rangehood to vent outside?

You can't expect tenants to be happy with a fan blowing cold air into the house 24/7. There are through wall heat recovery ventilation systems you can buy that use outgoing air to heat the incoming air.

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rhy7s

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#2328742 3-Oct-2019 08:32

nickb800: Heating is another avenue to explore, although they might be reluctant if they pay for power themselves. Heating the bathroom while showering reduces the formation of condensation. What about providing a ducted dryer to avoid indoor clothes drying?

Heating will just turn it into a stale sauna if they won't ventilate though. I think the culture of sealing places up and throwing more heat at the problem of humans and their activities adding water to the air, along with designs that don't separate rooms that contribute a lot of water, is going to increase problems. People insulating themselves and opening windows is the ideal but might be a lost cause. I think you'd have to explore mechanical ventilation and heat pumps (so you also get dehumidification) in your situation.

1101

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#2328764 3-Oct-2019 09:02

"and them moan because the curtains get mouldy"

perhaps , the flat being under the house next to damp ground, you have a rising damp issue
It could be the house, NOT the tenants .

My house has a mould problem. Its NOT because I dont open windows. I also have kitchen & bathroom extractor fans, mould is still an issue .
Perhaps look at the person who built the thing , rather than blame tenants

Most people dont open windows mid winter. What did you expect ?
Install dehumidifiers . Paint the walls & ceiling with anti moud paint .

mclean

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#2328796 3-Oct-2019 09:34

Stephendnz: Interested in any feedback on a ventilation issue.. I have a small 3 room flat under my house that has no ceiling space into which could be fitted a ventilation system...

Is there really no ceiling space? What about between the floor joists?

mdf

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#2328804 3-Oct-2019 09:44

Where are you based? If in Welly, I'd suggest you book a consultation with Sustainability Trust. There are DVS/HRV type systems that can be configured without a roof cavity, but would likely need to be specced to your house.

rhy7s

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#2328846 3-Oct-2019 09:46

1101:
Most people dont open windows mid winter. What did you expect ?
Install dehumidifiers . Paint the walls & ceiling with anti moud paint .

People in seriously cold countries like Germany open their windows in winter (though they also have a fear of drafts, so they tend to get it all out of the way in one big comprehensive event dedicated to the task at periodic intervals).

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Stephendnz

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#2328861 3-Oct-2019 10:08

Thanks for all the replies.. Actually what I really wanted to know was which was a better option running semi permantly.. could be on a timer.. or a controller.. Fresh air coming in or stale air extracting air out.. Maybe it could operate while they are out during the day..

And yes will put extractor in the bathroom.. will have to go in the window but no biggy...

Cheers for all the feedback

Disrespective

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#2328862 3-Oct-2019 10:10

There are a few decentralised ventilation systems on the market. One that i've seen mentioned a fair bit is the Lunos system.

You'd put one at each end of the house/flat and they'd work together to push and pull stale air out of the house while bringing in fresh air. Might be worth a look.

timmmay

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#2328923 3-Oct-2019 11:10

Disrespective:

There are a few decentralised ventilation systems on the market. One that i've seen mentioned a fair bit is the Lunos system.

You'd put one at each end of the house/flat and they'd work together to push and pull stale air out of the house while bringing in fresh air. Might be worth a look.

A quick read suggests they're ventilation systems with a heat exchanger, suitable for a single room. Push / pull from different parts of the house wouldn't really be able to do heat exchange would it?

neb

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#2328928 3-Oct-2019 11:15

bfginger: Don't evict them expecting other tenants to be better. You're finding out why so many landlords install ventilation systems and why some of them can't be turned off. Many tenants will never open the windows and some won't use any rangehood or extractor fan out of paranoia about them costing money to run.

I've run into that when I was a kid at a flat my parents owned, the place was a toxic pit after my dad finally got the tenants crowbarred out of there, grey mould all over the ceilings, walls mouldy, ugh. I don't think they'd ever opened any windows, apparently preferring to live surrounded by mould rather than risk a breath of fresh air.

What you can do is get the window glazing changed to add passive ventilation strips at the top which allow a trickle of air flow through the flat. This should be enough to prevent condensation.

It also depends on where you are, this is in Auckland where it wasn't a problem, not sure what it'd be like in colder areas.

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