Putting in Extra Downlight

Forums › Home Workshop DIY › Putting in Extra Downlight - Legality

Paul1977

5171 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2192

#275860 14-Sep-2020 11:28

We’re wanting to put an extra downlight in my partners home hair salon.

It would just be a matter of running some TPS from the last light in the circuit and attaching the extra light. Nothing would need to be done at the switchboard.

It’s an IC-F rated LED downlight with HCB and SCB 0.

Simple job, but is it something a home owner is allowed to do themselves? I’d rather not have to pay a sparky a couple of hundred bucks to install a $30 light if I don’t have to.

Thanks

Home: Work:
Home Work

1 | 2

2735 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 829

Trusted

#2563625 14-Sep-2020 11:32

Technically, that would be extending a subcircuit, and thus you would need an electrical inspector to test your work before it's connected. Cost wise, probably cheaper to pay a normal sparky to do the work than to do it yourself and pay an inspector to inspect it.

Practically, you wouldn't be the first homeowner to extend a subcircuit without getting it inspected...

snowfly

549 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 112

#2563631 14-Sep-2020 11:37

As above, that is extending a sub circuit.

This site describes what you can / cannot do: https://worksafe.govt.nz/managing-health-and-safety/consumers/safe-living-with-electricity/getting-electrical-work-done/doing-your-own-electrical-work/

If you know a sparky, just ask them what would it cost to inspect and sign off on the job. (e.g. you run the new cable, install the light, not connect it, and then get it checked).

elpenguino

3576 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2938

#2563670 14-Sep-2020 12:53

nickb800:

Practically, you wouldn't be the first homeowner to extend a subcircuit without getting it inspected...

Just be aware that when your home salon burns down the insurance company will crawl all over the documentation to find any reason they can to deny your claim.

Peace of mind is not a bad reason for playing with a straight bat.

Most of the posters in this thread are just like chimpanzees on MDMA, full of feelings of bonhomie, joy, and optimism. Fred99 8/4/21

andrewNZ

2487 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1461
Inactive user

#2563672 14-Sep-2020 12:53

This is not homeowner exempt work, and legally an electrician can NOT sign off your work. If the homeowner does work, it must be an inspector doing the checking.
Being a home business makes it questionable too.

Is the light circuit on an RCD. If not, it will need to be.

snowfly

549 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 112

#2563695 14-Sep-2020 13:17

andrewNZ: This is not homeowner exempt work, and legally an electrician can NOT sign off your work. If the homeowner does work, it must be an inspector doing the checking.
Being a home business makes it questionable too.

Is the light circuit on an RCD. If not, it will need to be.

Thanks for the clarification on needing a licensed electrical inspector to sign off the work (rather than just an standard electrician).

nickb800

2735 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 829

Trusted

#2563704 14-Sep-2020 13:32

Another thought - assuming you want to play with a straight bat (I can understand that) and do things cheaply, then you might be able replace existing fittings with higher rated fittings, or a bar of spotlights, to the same effect. That would fit within the owner-occupier exemption of replacing fittings outlined in ECP51 (or avoid the need for an RCD when extending the circuit)

Edit: you would also want some confidence that the exemption applies in a workplace that's part of the home, as per comments above

Dyson

Shop now for Dyson appliances (affiliate link).

pistol

39 posts

Geek
+1 received by user: 7
Inactive user

#2563705 14-Sep-2020 13:33

Sorry guys, slightly off topic.

If they were simply replacing all the downlights with newer models, would that be treated as homeowner exempt work?
Would you still recommend getting a sparky (to either install or review the the work) for insurance "peace of mind"?

elpenguino

3576 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2938

#2563737 14-Sep-2020 14:04

pistol:

Sorry guys, slightly off topic.

If they were simply replacing all the downlights with newer models, would that be treated as homeowner exempt work?
Would you still recommend getting a sparky (to either install or review the the work) for insurance "peace of mind"?

Yes, replacing downlights with other downlights is homeowner exempt. If you're doing this be absolutely sure of the insulation that's present and whether the fittings you have are rated to suit the level of insulation.

If you can make a termination properly i.e. good strength, adequate screw tension, no bare conductors or damaged insulation then having an electrician to review would be a needless luxury.

If you're worried about doing it properly you should think about not doing it.

If you're new to this have a go with terminating some scrap cable on an old fitting.

Most of the posters in this thread are just like chimpanzees on MDMA, full of feelings of bonhomie, joy, and optimism. Fred99 8/4/21

Paul1977

5171 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2192

#2563798 14-Sep-2020 14:50

Thanks guys, I figured that would probably be the answer.

I’ll get the sparky in.

Dingbatt

6804 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3694

Lifetime subscriber

#2563816 14-Sep-2020 15:14

What I have done in the past is do all the donkey work for the sparky. Crawling through all the horrible places, drilling holes, etc to install but not connect any of the cabling. Even fixing flush boxes to studs.

My sparky then comes in, inspects the installation and tests the new cabling, then wires up the fittings and switches. I just don’t see the point in paying a professional to do labouring work.

Helps that he is a mate that fits it in around his other work.

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

Paul1977

5171 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2192

#2563822 14-Sep-2020 15:26

How would I go about finding out if simpler things such as swapping existing downlight in the “home occupation” part if our house is covered by the normal owner/occupier exemption?

I just assumed it would be covered as it’s literally just another room in our house. We stuck to all the rules so didn’t require any resource consents or anything. So just a home occupation in a residential house.

Samsung

Shop now on Samsung phones, tablets, TVs and more (affiliate link).

SomeoneSomewhere

1882 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1086

Lifetime subscriber

#2571587 21-Sep-2020 23:01

andrewNZ: This is not homeowner exempt work, and legally an electrician can NOT sign off your work. If the homeowner does work, it must be an inspector doing the checking.
Being a home business makes it questionable too.

Is the light circuit on an RCD. If not, it will need to be.

Extensions to existing lighting circuits are not required to be RCDed under current (2007+A2) rules. Extensions to socket circuits are. 2.6.3.4.

gregmcc

2173 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 836

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2571607 22-Sep-2020 05:57

snowfly:

As above, that is extending a sub circuit.

This site describes what you can / cannot do: https://worksafe.govt.nz/managing-health-and-safety/consumers/safe-living-with-electricity/getting-electrical-work-done/doing-your-own-electrical-work/

If you know a sparky, just ask them what would it cost to inspect and sign off on the job. (e.g. you run the new cable, install the light, not connect it, and then get it checked).

An electrician CANNOT inspect and sign off on homeowners work, it must be an Inspector

gregmcc

2173 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 836

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2571608 22-Sep-2020 06:02

SomeoneSomewhere:

andrewNZ: This is not homeowner exempt work, and legally an electrician can NOT sign off your work. If the homeowner does work, it must be an inspector doing the checking.
Being a home business makes it questionable too.

Is the light circuit on an RCD. If not, it will need to be.

Extensions to existing lighting circuits are not required to be RCDed under current (2007+A2) rules. Extensions to socket circuits are. 2.6.3.4.

While this may be true, a good portion of downlights come with a plug on them and you need to put a socket on the lighting circuit - now they need to be RCD protected

Daynger

444 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 313

#2572225 22-Sep-2020 17:37

gregmcc:

SomeoneSomewhere:

Extensions to existing lighting circuits are not required to be RCDed under current (2007+A2) rules. Extensions to socket circuits are. 2.6.3.4.

While this may be true, a good portion of downlights come with a plug on them and you need to put a socket on the lighting circuit - now they need to be RCD protected

Or you remove the plugset and wire directly into the drivers.

This does sometimes depend on the drivers as they quite often have tiny tiny terminals that wont cope with more than one wire, or those stupid push connections which are single wire also.

1 | 2