2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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BDFL - Memuneh
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#2679595 24-Mar-2021 08:14

Have they never watched an action movie? That's exactly how traps are set.

MIQ guest visits someone in CHC hospital

Executive lead for Covid-19 Ralph La Salle said robust infection prevention control measures were in place to protect others.

He said those leaving MIQ have a transport plan, wear PPE and are required to return a negative Covid-19 test.

Batman

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#2679597 24-Mar-2021 08:17

freitasm: Have they never watched an action movie? That's exactly how traps are set.

MIQ guest visits someone in CHC hospital

Executive lead for Covid-19 Ralph La Salle said robust infection prevention control measures were in place to protect others.

He said those leaving MIQ have a transport plan, wear PPE and are required to return a negative Covid-19 test.

Sounds like some VIP treatment for a VIP. Normal people won't even get a spot in miq for this

sbiddle

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#2679598 24-Mar-2021 08:19

freitasm: Have they never watched an action movie? That's exactly how traps are set.

MIQ guest visits someone in CHC hospital

Executive lead for Covid-19 Ralph La Salle said robust infection prevention control measures were in place to protect others.

He said those leaving MIQ have a transport plan, wear PPE and are required to return a negative Covid-19 test.

Reminds me very much of the MIQ guest who tested positive on Sunday. They were at the offsite exercise area when informed they had tested positive.

They were returned to the hotel on the same bus as every other guest despite of this, and Hipkins justified this last night saying there was a low risk of infecting others because they were wearing a mask.

I really do wonder sometimes how we're doing as well as we are..

networkn

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#2679607 24-Mar-2021 08:45

sbiddle:

They were returned to the hotel on the same bus as every other guest despite of this, and Hipkins justified this last night saying there was a low risk of infecting others because they were wearing a mask.

I really do wonder sometimes how we're doing as well as we are..

It's been going on since MIQ was established. Family members who have been through MIQ reported it more than once. I feel we have been playing Russian Roulette with MIQ since day one, and all the reviews that were promised haven't significantly addressed the risk factors.

We really should have had more outbreaks than this, perhaps we could all buy lotto tickets.

Oblivian

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#2679609 24-Mar-2021 08:48

GV27:

I doubt it, they're a worker at an MIQ facility - the link to the border is far clearer than it was for the LG Sky Chefs case a couple of months ago.

If you want a real sleight of hand, the 'Northland' outbreak that supposedly didn't affect Auckland, yet had locations of interest in Helensville, was pushing it.

Clearer now because of no known outside the doors. Sure, But per the previous and Sbiddles shot of it, it doesn't align with previous classifications - As visual representation, Up until this one the 'border' appeared to stop at the door of the MiQ room housing returnees.

Workers, staff and anyone who was free to head home afterward, go shopping, do their day to day with heightened awareness who may have crossed that line (cleaners). Was a 'Community' based person.

Now, all of a sudden the 'border' seems it has widened, to include the front doors of the facility instead. So those housed within working, and in this case particular. Suddenly lumped with them. Despite the community interactions that can come with it -

Note despite date missing in URL, this is a historic article/not current situation

https://www.health.govt.nz/news-media/media-releases/quarantine-worker-case-confirmed

The Ministry is confirming one new case of COVID-19 in a worker in the Auckland quarantine facility. Because the person works at the facility and is not a returnee they are considered a community case.

GV27

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#2679612 24-Mar-2021 08:59

networkn:

We really should have had more outbreaks than this, perhaps we could all buy lotto tickets.

Mauricio's link previously and the fact that a small number of cases lead to further cases suggest they are happening near-constantly, but only very rarely kick off a long-enough chain of symptomatic cases to get picked up at a community testing level.

I'd really like to see it put to one of the medical professionals who do media commentary, to find out whether we are getting regularly lucky or just unlucky in that the only ones getting through at the handful of ones we've seen so far.

I'd also like to know if there's a correlation between the number of cases in MIQ and when we get detected community incursions. Logic suggests there should be, but I'd like to know if that's actually the case.

msukiwi

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#2679629 24-Mar-2021 09:42

The Chinese Consulate in Christchurch is back to being open 5 days a week, after being 3 days a week for the last year.

Must be the demand for Visas!

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frankv

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#2679632 24-Mar-2021 09:55

sbiddle:

...the current scenario of not allowing people to connect with families when the risk is so incredibly low is simply just cruel.

People (if they're Kiwis) *are* allowed to connect with their families. They just have to go through MIQ. They're choosing not to do that (as would I).

People can also connect with their families somewhat through (e.g.) Facebook or Zoom.

freitasm

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#2679635 24-Mar-2021 10:01

Or Skype, WhatsApp, Messenger, Teams.

There are ways.

Scott3

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#2679649 24-Mar-2021 10:34

Fred99:

wellygary:

Total vaccinations given 38,800 includes ~34,200 first and ~4,600 with 2 doses

BUT Hipkins only gave this out after being directly asked this specific question... They really need to be more open

Partial explanation (or excuse if you want to go that way) given that when they ramp up vaccination rate, they want it to be consistent, not ramping up then ramping down because of logistics of vaccine delivery to NZ.

Sure it would be good to know the precise delivery schedule, but it wouldn't surprise me if contracts are not quite as cast in iron as most people would hope. Pfizer aren't going to tell us (the public) exactly how much and exactly when - they're no doubt dealing with political pressure from everywhere else with more critical needs than NZ. AstraZeneca's issues in Europe have probably added fuel to that fire.

I don't really buy the reasoning of not wanting to be on a roller coaster with regards to vaccination rates.

I do think we should be holding some some stock:

As long as we hold enough stock to finish the vaccination courses of those that have started then (once we reach steady state it would be about 11 days turnover)
Perhaps 1000 courses of contingency so we can vaccinate new border workers, new air crew etc.

Other than the above, I think we should be utilizing all the vaccines we have on hand. It takes about 4 weeks from first does to full effectiveness, so there is good reason to vaccinate the likes of priory groups 1a, 1b & 2a at least with haste.

I don't see it as an issue if we have to put the vaccination program on hold while waiting for more doses. Better that than holding back 200k doses in the freezer like we are at the moment.... Sure some money would be wasted paying vaccination's etc who are waiting for stock, but I think it is small fry compared to the cost of the vaccination program.

Politically cranking on would be better too.

sbiddle

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#2679652 24-Mar-2021 10:44

frankv:

sbiddle:

...the current scenario of not allowing people to connect with families when the risk is so incredibly low is simply just cruel.

People (if they're Kiwis) *are* allowed to connect with their families. They just have to go through MIQ. They're choosing not to do that (as would I).

People can also connect with their families somewhat through (e.g.) Facebook or Zoom.

They're choosing not to do so because they can't. Getting a space in MIQ is simply a lottery that most people don't win - you only need to look at the last allocation which went within hours.

antonknee

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#2679656 24-Mar-2021 10:54

Handle9:
antonknee:

I’m guessing “the right thing” is the common sense approach of not getting on the bus full of returned who may have Covid-19. However you’re quite right that the individuals are just doing what they’re allowed to do by the authorities (and are presumably told is safe enough to do).

That the authorities allow and encourage what to me is an obviously risky practice is the real issue IMO. Again, it’s a case of where do you draw the line as there’s no such thing as zero-risk.

"Common sense" would be that following the official guide lines formulated by experts would be safe. There's no suggestion of gamification here, it's a systemic issue.

Blaming people affected by systematic screw ups, when they are following the rules set by the people responsible for determining what is or is not safe, is daft.

Well yes but people can make their own decisions within that framework. Ie just because authorities say you can get on the bus to go exercise doesn't mean you have to choose to do so.

I'm not saying it's their fault, and indeed my exact words were "you’re quite right that the individuals are just doing what they’re allowed to do by the authorities (and are presumably told is safe enough to do)".

My point was really the gentleman complaining in the Stuff article about the "stupid bus rides" was presumably not forced to go on the stupid bus rides. I don't think the bus rides should even exist in the first place, but in a world where they do foolishly exist people can still make their own decisions. Same thing applies to plenty of other things where the government is suggesting something, but there are wiser choices an individual can make.

Fred99

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#2679745 24-Mar-2021 11:53

sbiddle:

In the short term I simply don't see that happening. Assuming we do have a ~19th April start to the TT bubble I see it being a couple of months before we start to see any significant numbers of people traveling for tourism. Pricing certainly isn't going to be ideal for leisure travel, and we've already seen taxes rise by 25% on TT flights - the first $250 of a TT ticket is now tax, up from around $200 prior to Covid.

As somebody who normally visits Aussie 6-8 times per year I know a lot of people there. I know people there right now who are hesitant to come back to NZ in the short term because of the perceived higher risk of catching Covid here - you have to remember that in many parts of Australia (WA being a classic example) that their new case numbers have been significantly lower than NZ (they went 10 months with no CT) and there is certainly a perceived idea that a number of Australians have that they've done much better at handling Covid that NZ has done in recent months, and to some extent that is a justified belief.

I had a quick look at TT fares the other day, was (Chch-Syd return) all-up about $880, so not fantastic - not terrible, but I guess all airlines flying TT will be keen to ramp things up ASAP to keep planes in the air and staff on the payroll, so it wouldn't surprise me if prices fall back. Can't remember exact fares I paid, but $300 return rings a bell, one ticket to Sydney after taxes etc the receipt showed the airfare component of the total was less than $1.

Australia is either getting far fewer overseas arrivals as % of population than we are, or the arrivals they are getting are less likely to be infected. Their 7 day average of positive imported cases is about double ours, it should be about 5x ours.

Edit:

OK found it.

January 2021 arrivals:

Aus ~19,000

NZ ~ 12,000

Aus quarantine allocation appears to be far more restrictive than NZ's.

Batman

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#2679757 24-Mar-2021 12:22

msukiwi:
The Chinese Consulate in Christchurch is back to being open 5 days a week, after being 3 days a week for the last year.

Must be the demand for Visas!

Sorry I don't understand, visas for who?

wellygary

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#2679759 24-Mar-2021 12:27

Fred99:

OK found it.

January 2021 arrivals:

Aus ~19,000

NZ ~ 12,000

Aus quarantine allocation appears to be far more restrictive than NZ's.

Yipi, NZ MIQ takes more people on the per cap basis than OZ,

Also there is no MIQ in VIC at the moment,

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