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LostBoyNZ

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#273106 4-Aug-2020 15:03
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I made a surprising discovery about myself yesterday. I'm 38 and learned I have something called Aphantasia, which is where I cannot form images in my mind. So where someone might imagine a beach and see it in their mind, or remember someone / an experience and be able to picture that in their mind, I can't. I don't 'see' anything in my mind.

 

I thought it was so interesting (and I must admit kind of depressing) because I never knew people actually see things in their mind. When people talk about visualising things, I always just assumed they were thinking about the idea. Like if I think of my wife for example, I can think her hair style, her clothes and such, but I don't actually 'see' them.

 

This suddenly explains why I have no interest in reading fiction books, but absolutely love movies. Even as a kid, comics were my go to, not novels. It might also be part of why I enjoy photography so much, because the idea of capturing a picture of something is so cool, and I had no idea people could do that in their own heads.

 

I've always had people comment that I'm quite creative, so I don't believe it's affected that, and I have dreams, but it's just ideas of things happening I guess, it's never actual seeing things. I've never day dreamed.

 

I can understand it's an advantage if people want to forget more unpleasent memories and experiences, as reliving those by seeing them in your head must be pretty hard to deal with sometimes. This might contribute to why I have a dark sense of humor, I can joke about things and give other people mental images because I don't have them myself. I've never had trouble with horror movies or such.

 

It's just interesting to suddenly realise something so drastic about your own mind. Apparently about 2% of the population have it, so who knows, we may find another geekzone member with the same.





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Gurezaemon
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  #2534557 4-Aug-2020 15:07
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Wow. Very interesting. What are your dreams like?




LostBoyNZ

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  #2534567 4-Aug-2020 15:18
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I guess I don't remember a lot of my dreams, but they can still feel kind of real. I suppose my brain is just processing the ideas of things happening, even though I don't ever 'see' anything. I'll have to pay more attention to what my dreams are like next time I remember one.

 

Someone at my work here, if she has a mental image of an orange just for example, she can smell the orange really strongly. I'm not sure if that's the same with everyone?





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  #2534570 4-Aug-2020 15:20
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I found out the same about myself after a Twitter thread earlier this year. It hasn't affected my love of reading, fiction especially. I can imagine things, but i just don't get a 'visual' image of it in my mind. It may explain my mild face blindness, when I think about a person, I don't 'see' an image of them in my head, which may be why I have trouble recognising faces sometimes.

 

I do dream, and I recall seeing images in my dreams, but I have a vague suspicion that either I dream less than some people, or recall them less, as on the odd occasion when dreaming comes up in conversation, others seem to have a more active dream-life than I do. That could be entirely unrelated though.




Dingbatt
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  #2534575 4-Aug-2020 15:28
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Kind of like the reverse of eidetic memory (commonly called ‘photographic memory’). From what I’ve read, though many claim eidetic memory, it hasn’t been proved to definitively exist.

 

Until we can see/experience things as others do we can’t really know how unique each of us actually is.





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GSManiac
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  #2534580 4-Aug-2020 15:35
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Reminds me of this tweet

https://twitter.com/premium__heart/status/1225610677177520130?s=21

fearandloathing
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  #2534583 4-Aug-2020 15:44
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Dingbatt:

 

Kind of like the reverse of eidetic memory (commonly called ‘photographic memory’).

 

 

I wouldn't have thought so. the reverse of remembering everything would be remember nothing.


 
 
 

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Dugimodo
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  #2534584 4-Aug-2020 15:47
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I'm pretty sure eidetic memory and the Idea your mind is like a video recorder are both impossible. Sure some people have near perfect recall and can do amazing feats of memory under some circumstances, but it's fairly well established that our minds immediately discard most of the information received and that's just how they work. Unconsciously your brain is looking for threats and ignoring anything else for the most part.

 

 

 

There's a great documentary on netflix about the brain and perception (that I forget the name of :)) that very entertainingly demonstrates just how little we take in by asking you to count the number of dancers in a short video that enter a circle of light and are wearing a particular colour (red or blue). When it's over they ask if you noticed the guy in the gorilla suit who strolled across the stage, and then you go back and look for it when you don't believe them :)

 

There's also a sequence with a guy doing a card trick who changes several items of clothing, and has assistants walk around changing the scenery in the background, all while you watch the trick, and you see none of it until replaying it later. It's not hidden, you are just focused on the trick.


LostBoyNZ

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  #2534586 4-Aug-2020 15:48
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BlueShift:

 

I found out the same about myself after a Twitter thread earlier this year. It hasn't affected my love of reading, fiction especially. I can imagine things, but i just don't get a 'visual' image of it in my mind. It may explain my mild face blindness, when I think about a person, I don't 'see' an image of them in my head, which may be why I have trouble recognising faces sometimes.

 

I do dream, and I recall seeing images in my dreams, but I have a vague suspicion that either I dream less than some people, or recall them less, as on the odd occasion when dreaming comes up in conversation, others seem to have a more active dream-life than I do. That could be entirely unrelated though.

 

 

That didn't take long to find someone else :)

 

Interesting to know it hasn't affected your love of reading, that's good!! I haven't personally noticed I have trouble with recognising faces, but that's really interesting. Was it kind of comforting to know this might be the reason for mild face blindness?

 

I'm the same with my dreams I think, as in other people seem to have a more active dream-life than me. They also seem to be affected by their bad dreams more than me. I wouldn't say I've never had a nightmare, but I think it would be very rare.





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geekiegeek
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  #2534588 4-Aug-2020 15:51
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Reminds me of a discussion I saw some time ago about people who have no internal dialogue - I can't imagine life without it, in the same way, I can't imagine not seeing images in my mind and dreams etc. I guess its just because that's the way its been for me for 49 years. For the OP, you have just lived without images and of course, thought that was what everyone was like. 

 

The mind is a strange and wonderful thing.


LostBoyNZ

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  #2534589 4-Aug-2020 15:51
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GSManiac: Wow, I wish I'd seen that already. But absolutely I'm number 5. For anyone who doesn't click the link, it's "This is still blowing my mind lol Close your eyes and imagine an apple. What do you see?"

 





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fearandloathing
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  #2534591 4-Aug-2020 16:02
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I was always told to count sheep jumping a fence to help me sleep. It wasn't until a few years ago did I realise why that concept made no sense to me.


 
 
 

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dafman
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  #2534593 4-Aug-2020 16:04
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The first thing I asked myself was - what is a mental image?

 

For example, if I imagine a palm tree, am I actually seeing it, or just thinking about what one looks like?

 

Is your thinking about your wife's hairstyle the same thing as what someone else would describe as a mental image?

 

I found this on the web: "The research has raised a number of questions. One is whether aphantasia exists at all. Could people who think they are not making mental images simply be describing their images differently from the way other people do? After all, surveys elicit subjective descriptions, not objective measures of what is going on in the brain." https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/when-the-minds-eye-is-blind1/

 

I'm not saying it's not a thing, but in the absence of an objective measure of a 'mental image', I have no idea if I have it or not.


LostBoyNZ

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  #2534597 4-Aug-2020 16:18
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fearandloathing: Counting sheep, YES! That never worked for me (obvious why not now haha), I thought it was a really bizarre suggestion.

 

dafman: Good question about what is a mental image? It's hard for someone to truly describe I guess. From what I've heard of asking other people at work here and my wife, if they see a mental image of something, they can see it as clearly as they would with their eyes, but it's in their head.

 

Whereas for me if I'm thinking of a palm tree, I can think ok it has leaves at the top and it has coconuts which are round, brown maybe with some holes in them... etc... almost like I'm breaking it down into rules about what makes a palm tree a palm tree, if that makes any sense. But it's completely different to when I see a palm tree with my eyes, where I'm looking at it and noticing texture, colour, more detailed shapes etc. It sounds like other people can see a palm tree, and they can observe the details on it.

 

If the apple example a couple of posts up is accurate, if people who choose #1 for example see the apple with that much detail in their mind, as it it was a photo in their mind, then I'd certainly say mine is #5.

 

It's a really good question though, what is a mental image, and I wonder if anyone can more accurately answer that.





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lurker
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  #2534621 4-Aug-2020 16:50
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Very interesting. Also made me wonder about blind people, I guess it must be similar for them (if blind from birth) 


Eva888
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  #2534873 4-Aug-2020 22:40
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Interesting and makes you ponder your own imagery. You’ve lived with it all these years and managed Ok. Don’t feel diminished by it, revel in your uniqueness.

Found this: If you think you have aphantasia or hyperphantasia and would like to be involved in Prof Zeman's research he is happy to be contacted at a.zeman@exeter.ac.uk

The Prof May be quite chuffed to hear from some Kiwis.


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