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#291858 9-Dec-2021 10:39
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Ding Ding Ding Ding Ding : Ice cream man , Ice cream man


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wellygary
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  #2829286 9-Dec-2021 10:43
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It is, and the article is very badly written

 

I think what they are trying to saying the limit will change annually, so that it will become under 15 next year, under 16 the year after than and the age limit keeps rising as those under 14 keep getting older,  In 10 years time is will be no under 24yr olds able to buy smokes, 

 

EDIT: its being done by birth date, ie people who are born after XX date will not be able to buy smokes 


  #2829293 9-Dec-2021 10:52
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wellygary:

 

It is, and the article is very badly written

 

I think what they are trying to saying the limit will change annually, so that it will become under 15 next year, under 16 the year after than and the age limit keeps rising as those under 14 keep getting older,  In 10 years time is will be no under 24yr olds able to buy smokes, 

 

 

Ah thanks for that I should have read it more closely.





Ding Ding Ding Ding Ding : Ice cream man , Ice cream man


MadEngineer
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  #2829302 9-Dec-2021 10:56
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I remember this coming up a while back. This is fantastic news.




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trig42
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  #2829303 9-Dec-2021 10:58
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My read of it was that the age (currently 18) will go up by a year every year. So if you are currently 14 or under, you'll never reach an age that you'll be able to buy tobacco legally.

 

A good thing, but there will be an even bigger black market.


SATTV
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  #2829305 9-Dec-2021 11:00
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Does not stop them from growing it or vaping it which is still perfectly legal.

 

This will probably increase the black market sadly, those who want to smoke will smoke.

 

John





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Zeon
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  #2829307 9-Dec-2021 11:03
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At the end of the day if people want to smoke, it's their choice. They are covering the healthcare costs with the massive taxes and smokefree rules stop 2nd hand smoke... It's going to cut off a big chunk of taxes for the government, well not this government but future governments...

 

I'm sure the government leaders will enjoy basking in international "praise" after weeks of tough local headlines....





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alavaliant
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  #2829310 9-Dec-2021 11:10
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As much as I don't agree with smoking. I don't think this law change is a good idea. There already is a tobacco black market and this is in my opinion only going to make the demand for black market tobacco higher and make it more profitable. So I'm seeing it probable that crime will increase while at the same time there will be tax income to cover tobacco related heath problems.

 




vexxxboy
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  #2829321 9-Dec-2021 11:34
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alavaliant: As much as I don't agree with smoking. I don't think this law change is a good idea. There already is a tobacco black market and this is in my opinion only going to make the demand for black market tobacco higher and make it more profitable. So I'm seeing it probable that crime will increase while at the same time there will be tax income to cover tobacco related heath problems.

 

this is a stupid argument, you cant do what is right just because the criminal black market might become more profitable .





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wratterus
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  #2829329 9-Dec-2021 11:45
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Hmm....I have never smoked & think frankly it's a bit of a stupid thing to do, but maybe this is going a little far. 

 

 

 

Edit - I'd not considered that it costs the government more in healthcare than they get back in taxes. 


vexxxboy
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  #2829336 9-Dec-2021 11:56
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Zeon:

 

At the end of the day if people want to smoke, it's their choice. They are covering the healthcare costs with the massive taxes and smokefree rules stop 2nd hand smoke... It's going to cut off a big chunk of taxes for the government, well not this government but future governments...

 

I'm sure the government leaders will enjoy basking in international "praise" after weeks of tough local headlines....

 

 

again the argument about the taxes doesnt stand up, studies have been done to show that the govt spends more on smoking related health care than they ever take in taxes . In other words if smoking is banned there would be more money to spend on the health system.

 

 

 

sorry just looked into it , we take in about $1.72 billion in taxes from Tobacco and spend around 3.8 billion on Tobacco related health care.





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Kookoo
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  #2829526 9-Dec-2021 15:01
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vexxxboy:

 

this is a stupid argument, you cant do what is right just because the criminal black market might become more profitable .

 

 

The fallacy of your argument is that you think that something that makes the black market more profitable is actually "right". It's not. The same argument applies to recreational drugs, but ironically most people fail to see the parallel.

 

The "war on drugs" has been failing for years, globally because it tries to enforce prohibition instead of applying regulation. This makes the the black market extremely attractive to the criminal element. Here is a good video about it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_TV4GuXFoA

 

Now the government is effectively prohibiting smoking. It doesn't take a genius to figure out what's going to happen next.

 

For context - I neither smoke nor use recreational drugs, so my only skin in this game is how to minimise the impact of this scourge. Growing the black market and strengthening the gangs that operate it - just isn't the right way.

 

 





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Zeon
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  #2829571 9-Dec-2021 16:42
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vexxxboy:

 

Zeon:

 

At the end of the day if people want to smoke, it's their choice. They are covering the healthcare costs with the massive taxes and smokefree rules stop 2nd hand smoke... It's going to cut off a big chunk of taxes for the government, well not this government but future governments...

 

I'm sure the government leaders will enjoy basking in international "praise" after weeks of tough local headlines....

 

 

again the argument about the taxes doesnt stand up, studies have been done to show that the govt spends more on smoking related health care than they ever take in taxes . In other words if smoking is banned there would be more money to spend on the health system.

 

 

 

sorry just looked into it , we take in about $1.72 billion in taxes from Tobacco and spend around 3.8 billion on Tobacco related health care.

 

 

I'm not 100% sure I buy the health spending figure. If there are 464,000 daily smokers that is $8,100 healthcare spend per smoker per year. What's the bet that many have other health problems (overweight etc.) that could be exacerbated by smoking?





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Handsomedan
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  #2829573 9-Dec-2021 16:44
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I remember as a nipper going to the dairy for bread, milk and smokes for the old man. Nobody batted an eyelid. And I spent less than a dollar in total for all of that. 

 

God I'm old. 





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mdooher
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  #2829611 9-Dec-2021 19:12
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Interesting how will it stand up in court in a few years when someone says they are discriminating on the grounds of age.

 

What about tourists etc?

 

 





Matthew


MadEngineer
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  #2829616 9-Dec-2021 19:50
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^ hah yeah that's gonna be a tough one for tourists.  NZ will be the first country to ban smokes.





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