tdgeek:

 

I'm saying that I cannot see anything online that states that the energy used to out a litre of petrol at my pump is less than what I get. It may be, it may be similar, it may not be now. Then I am saying that this doesn't matter as our human energy is in fact money. As oil is harder to find, and deeper, and less, that clearly makes it more energy use to obtain, than many many decades ago. Again ,the relationship between energy used and energy obtained is meaningless. We have proven that by continuing to mine oil, no matter what, as we MUST have it. All those inefficiencies get soaked up in oil prices. That makes it work for us.

 

I think I understand what you're trying to say.

My view is that we increasingly live in an energy economy. The price of any good or service is more and more a reflection of the energy used to produce and deliver it, with less and less being dependent on the man-hours. Raw materials are also increasingly dependent on energy costs of extraction. So, to some extent, the price of something is a reflection of the energy used to make it.

That makes it easy to be green, and make green decisions... spend less. :)

There are exceptions to this, notably anything which does environmental damage. Historically that damage has just been accepted. Dump trash and waste in the ocean and rivers, destroy the ozone layer, warm the planet, bury nuclear waste, deplete fish supplies, dry up the aquifers. In these cases, someone in the future will pay a lot of the cost. That artificially low price produces a distorted market, and we over-use all the things that in the end damage the environment. Which is why we need carbon taxes and so on to ensure that (a) the price we pay is an accurate reflection of the actual cost, and (b) there are funds available to do the cleanup.