Should cyclists pay road taxes ?

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#2727844 13-Jun-2021 12:10

Instead of taxing cyclists wouldnt it just be easier to put a toll on the new bridge?

Link it to the hop card that is already in use for public transport, this could also be used to collect usage data so we would know exactly how many people actually use it and at what times of the day. Once it has been paid for the toll can be removed.

User pays, seems pretty fair to me.

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#2727845 13-Jun-2021 12:30

mattwnz:

Yeah, that toddler riding their tricycle down the footpath should definitely be paying. Toddlers don't even pay taxes.

most of my mates' wives don't pay taxes either

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#2727983 13-Jun-2021 15:51

not only will OP have to fund cyclists he will also have to fund EVs. unless he drives an EV then he gets funded

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/the-feebate-govt-confirms-rebates-for-buyers-of-electric-cars-but-petrol-car-buyers-will-cop-it/TEJ3V5CF72YFTT5NPQTOWJ3AAE/

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#2727986 13-Jun-2021 16:11

mattwnz:

Yeah, that toddler riding their tricycle down the footpath should definitely be paying. Toddlers don't even pay taxes.

Ugh, and they're snotty little germbags too. Total drain on society.

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blackjack17

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#2728012 13-Jun-2021 17:27

SaltyNZ:

mattwnz:

Yeah, that toddler riding their tricycle down the footpath should definitely be paying. Toddlers don't even pay taxes.

Ugh, and they're snotty little germbags too. Total drain on society.

Have you seen the number of playgrounds being used around the country that have absolutely no charge to them?

The kids are just playing for free.

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#2728045 13-Jun-2021 17:44

blackjack17:

Have you seen the number of playgrounds being used around the country that have absolutely no charge to them?

The kids are just playing for free.

not as much as the free pathways outside houses where people walk across my house. those are free too. toddlers ride trikes on them, adults walk on them, and dogs crap on them. once i even found some guy thought it was free to park there.

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#2728098 13-Jun-2021 18:29

Batman:

not only will OP have to fund cyclists he will also have to fund EVs. unless he drives an EV then he gets funded

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/the-feebate-govt-confirms-rebates-for-buyers-of-electric-cars-but-petrol-car-buyers-will-cop-it/TEJ3V5CF72YFTT5NPQTOWJ3AAE/

Nope, the EV new fees etc are only on the purchase price for new/import vehicles.

This will make sweet FA difference to the majority of people.

I am not sure how people take pride in not paying.

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#2729395 16-Jun-2021 00:16

blackjack17:

SaltyNZ:

Ugh, and they're snotty little germbags too. Total drain on society.

Have you seen the number of playgrounds being used around the country that have absolutely no charge to them?

The kids are just playing for free.

This is an outrage. I'm off to start a facebook group to protest

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#2729545 16-Jun-2021 11:09

Daynger:

Instead of taxing cyclists wouldnt it just be easier to put a toll on the new bridge?

Link it to the hop card that is already in use for public transport, this could also be used to collect usage data so we would know exactly how many people actually use it and at what times of the day. Once it has been paid for the toll can be removed.

User pays, seems pretty fair to me.

I actually did a back-of-the-napkin calculation on page 3 of this thread...tolling will be difficult and expensive:

HD:

Perhaps the only way to do that is to toll the cycleway to repay over 40 years...lets assume there's a thousand people use it a day (won't happen): $800m over 40 years is $20m per annum to collect in tolls.

$20m per annum split between 365k users is $109.60 per trip. Who's keen to ride the path now?

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SaltyNZ

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#2729640 16-Jun-2021 13:47

Handsomedan:

$20m per annum split between 365k users is $109.60 per trip. Who's keen to ride the path now?

You forgot to factor in taxpayer savings from things like fewer serious/fatal accidents, reduced pollution, reduced congestion.

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Handsomedan

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#2729642 16-Jun-2021 13:49

SaltyNZ:
Handsomedan:

$20m per annum split between 365k users is $109.60 per trip. Who's keen to ride the path now?

You forgot to factor in taxpayer savings from things like fewer serious/fatal accidents, reduced pollution, reduced congestion.

Hard to quantify and as I said…was a back of the napkin exercise, just to show how hard tolling would ultimately be.

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#2729645 16-Jun-2021 13:54

Handsomedan:
Hard to quantify and as I said…was a back of the napkin exercise, just to show how hard tolling would ultimately be.

OK, fair enough. :-)

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#2729649 16-Jun-2021 14:06

SaltyNZ:

Handsomedan:

$20m per annum split between 365k users is $109.60 per trip. Who's keen to ride the path now?

You forgot to factor in taxpayer savings from things like fewer serious/fatal accidents, reduced pollution, reduced congestion.

Or not build anything, then you can factor in the billions in construction costs saved, + interest + maintainence.

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#2729651 16-Jun-2021 14:12

SaltyNZ:

Handsomedan:
Hard to quantify and as I said…was a back of the napkin exercise, just to show how hard tolling would ultimately be.

OK, fair enough. :-)

On that note - I think tolling (unless it's kept to a small fee in the region of a couple of bucks each way) would be a deterrent to use, as opposed to a real means to pay for the bridge/paths.

There does have to be a form of user pays somewhere, but how? That is for bigger brains than mine.

I just don't think the bridge idea has been well thought out and is missing the point. Good transport connections need to be fully inclusive - it needs to be mass-transit and bike/walk/scooter/wheelchair/hoverboard friendly.

That bridge design is not that.

But back on topic...many, many cyclists pay just as much, if not more in taxes as other road users...that sits about right with me. I'm not a regular road cyclist - I am a mountain biker. I pay to use decent bike parks with well-groomed trails. If I am using free ones. I contribute some other way, like joining dig days.

I think I have a bit of an issue (like many motorists) with the terrible attitudes of many cyclists on our roads - BUT you can't tar them all with the same brush...much like we have many hoons on the road, we also don't assume all drivers are utter pricks who shouldn't be using the infrastructure we pay for.

The way in which we address the road cycling fraternity is the important issue for me. Dumping bike-only lanes into already congested streets isn't the answer and causes a lot of resentment. By the same token, pedestrians also need to keep to their lane, so to speak: Beach Road in Auckland is a classic example, where pedestrians regularly walk in the cycle lane, oblivious to the wheeled traffic that the lanes are designed for. I can see why many serious cyclists don't use those cycle lanes and take their chances on the road...

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BlinkyBill

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#2729655 16-Jun-2021 14:20

I don’t think NZ should maintain a military; perhaps the military should fund themselves?

A key point of a democracy is to appoint a body to determine the collective good, and raise and disburse funding for stuff that benefits the collective. If you don’t like money spent on anything in particular, you should probably participate in that body and make decisions directly.

Having said that, I don’t think the cycle bridge is a good use of $1b .

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