Nissan GTR vs Tree

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#1452936 18-Dec-2015 12:22

Fred99:
Dingbatt: I wonder if their families will try and sue Nissan like Paul Walker's family are with Porsche?

Maybe since there weren't any innocent third parties affected (apart from the tree) it can be chalked up to Darwinism in action.

I wonder if like Porsche, assorted data is retained in the ECU, which if able to be recovered might help the serious crash unit to prove beyond doubt what an idiot the driver was - when he's probably going to try and defend himself by saying that he lost control when he served to avoid a cat or whatever.

I'd imagine the computer in that car would have all sorts of data. Not sure how much it keeps though. The GT-R is a very technical beast.

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#1452942 18-Dec-2015 12:25

TimA:
My little audi S4. 10K of car, 340HP/600NM and would walk any jap import. I got some seriously fast quarter miles and top speeds on Hampton for the money.
I paid $1700 a year for insurance.

What sort of times? Think Puke is a better bet for a top speed crack!

Talkiet

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#1452949 18-Dec-2015 12:31

Come on guys - we know nearly nothing about this apart from some preliminary comments by police. Exactly the same accident could have occurred in a 20 year old BMW 5 series, or a ten year old Subaru Legacy.

Very high performance cars also (usually) have safety features to match, the brakes in the GTR would be better than those on the cars of 99% of us, the stability control would have been better than most of us have etc. Even the crash structures are better than most of us drive.

To have an accident like that in a car like that seems very strange. I would say there was some ridiculous speed involved or some seriously lacking talent, or perhaps even a mechanical failure (probably at an illegal speed anyway)

To use this as an example for why we should restrict high power cars to new drivers, or for compulsory insurance is silly. I happen to agree with both ideas, but this is an accident it likely wouldn't have stopped.

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

Paul1977

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#1452950 18-Dec-2015 12:34

xpd:
UHD: This has nothing to do with the car and everything to do with the driver. I can get an old Nissan Sunny up to 120/130 and wrap myself around a tree if I wanted to.

My thoughts exactly, I had a GT Legacy and was overtaken by a 1L Nissan March on the motorway.

Its the driver not the car, and a lot of people think because they're in a performance car, that they should be able to drive like a race car driver. I never drove like an idiot in my Legacy, it was my pride and joy, there was no way I was going to risk losing it, myself or someone else.

If I wanted to drive like a race car driver, I'd be sensible and head to Hampton Downs or Pukekohe, not the local back street..... (never got the chance to goto either tho :( )

JC once said, "its not speed that kills, its the sudden stop"

These guys almost learnt that......

Waste of a car.

Yes, but having a high performance car is more likely to make the driver want to make use of the extra power/performance, especially if he/she has a passenger they are trying to impress. And as you said it can make them think they can drive it "like a race car driver".

I was recently taken for a drive in a Lamborghini Gallardo Superleggera, and it is frightening the sort of speed an power some road legal cars are capable of. I had a bit of a drive myself, but was far too scared to take it anywhere how the owner was driving it. Obviously this car is outside virtually anyones price bracket, but there are still plenty of more affordable cars out there that are essentially road legal track cars. And allowing inexperienced and untrained drivers behind the wheel surely contributes to the road toll.

WyleECoyoteNZ

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#1452951 18-Dec-2015 12:34

Fred99:
WyleECoyoteNZ: I'm probably going to cop some flak for this, but here goes.

The first 2 posts are suggesting that the driver is either young and inexperienced.

As the stuff story doesn't give the ages of the drivers. It is entirely conceivable that the driver was an older driver. This could well be a case of money doesn't buy talent.

I've always liked the idea of a power restriction for new drivers on a Learners or Restricted license, how this would be enforced is the difficultly. Hell, a 2006 Honda civic 1.8 only has 103kW, but still can get you into some high speeds once the VTEC kicks in.

And as for the compulsory insurance? That would stop young people owning high performance vehicles, yes, but it wouldn't stop those with more money than talent wrapping themselves around a tree or slamming into someone else.

"both men were wearing boardshorts and appeared to be in their 20s or 30s"

People making comments about how you can do the same in a honda civic or corolla have clearly never been in a Nissan GTR to see how fast things can happen in a car of that performance class.
These will migrate down to boy-racer affordability, then next issue is that with turbo/injector upgrade and preferably upgraded DSG clutchpacks, figures of >1000 wheel hp and >800Nm torque can be achieved.

Ah. Missed that in reading the story.

The GT-R is already affordable. Although the car involved in this incident is a Nissan GT-R (type R35), it's predecessor the Nissan Skyline GT-R (Types R32, R3 and R34) are reasonably affordable and quite capable of Big horsepower numbers. You'd almost struggle to find a Skyline GT-R that is still factory standard in terms of engine modifications.

Fred99

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#1452952 18-Dec-2015 12:40

Talkiet:
To have an accident like that in a car like that seems very strange.

Absolutely not. Search Youtube for "<supercar brand of choice> fail" and there's plenty there to entertain yourself for days.

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Paul1977

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#1452953 18-Dec-2015 12:41

Talkiet: Come on guys - we know nearly nothing about this apart from some preliminary comments by police. Exactly the same accident could have occurred in a 20 year old BMW 5 series, or a ten year old Subaru Legacy.

Very high performance cars also (usually) have safety features to match, the brakes in the GTR would be better than those on the cars of 99% of us, the stability control would have been better than most of us have etc. Even the crash structures are better than most of us drive.

To have an accident like that in a car like that seems very strange. I would say there was some ridiculous speed involved or some seriously lacking talent, or perhaps even a mechanical failure (probably at an illegal speed anyway)

To use this as an example for why we should restrict high power cars to new drivers, or for compulsory insurance is silly. I happen to agree with both ideas, but this is an accident it likely wouldn't have stopped.

Cheers - N

You're right, there is not enough info about this particular incident to draw any conclusions; but that doesn't nullify the argument.

You're also right that these cars do have more safety features etc which is potentially the only reason the occupants survived.

But regardless of the cause of this particular crash, I still maintain that the faster and higher performance a car is, the more people will be enticed use those capabilities.

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#1452955 18-Dec-2015 12:46

mudguard:
TimA:
My little audi S4. 10K of car, 340HP/600NM and would walk any jap import. I got some seriously fast quarter miles and top speeds on Hampton for the money.
I paid $1700 a year for insurance.

What sort of times? Think Puke is a better bet for a top speed crack!

Best ever was a 12.8 trapped at 180ish

I have had it in a straight line up to 270. Ran out of space.

6FIEND

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#1452962 18-Dec-2015 13:08

TimA:
mudguard:
TimA:
My little audi S4. 10K of car, 340HP/600NM and would walk any jap import. I got some seriously fast quarter miles and top speeds on Hampton for the money.
I paid $1700 a year for insurance.

What sort of times? Think Puke is a better bet for a top speed crack!

Best ever was a 12.8 trapped at 180ish

I have had it in a straight line up to 270. Ran out of space.

Given that there's not a track in NZ where a car with a trap speed of 180 can achieve a terminal velocity of 270... Is it wrong for me to be mentally lumping you into the same pigeon hole as the two subjects/victims of this article?

Talkiet

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#1452964 18-Dec-2015 13:10

6FIEND:
TimA:
mudguard:
TimA:
My little audi S4. 10K of car, 340HP/600NM and would walk any jap import. I got some seriously fast quarter miles and top speeds on Hampton for the money.
I paid $1700 a year for insurance.

What sort of times? Think Puke is a better bet for a top speed crack!

Best ever was a 12.8 trapped at 180ish

I have had it in a straight line up to 270. Ran out of space.

Given that there's not a track in NZ where a car with a trap speed of 180 can achieve a terminal velocity of 270... Is it wrong for me to be mentally lumping you into the same pigeon hole as the two subjects/victims of this article?

Chuckle. I have called people out on that before...

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

mudguard

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#1452966 18-Dec-2015 13:14

TimA:
Best ever was a 12.8 trapped at 180ish
I have had it in a straight line up to 270. Ran out of space.

That is insane for Hampton Downs. I've been a passenger in a road car that did 263 at Puke. Only we weren't able to stop for the hairpin... So I'm not sure what a proper top speed would be.
It had more power and less weight than S4 I think too.
Anything under a 13 second quarter is pretty sharp. Mind you I know a few FWD Honda can get into the 13's without too much work. But 12's. Very few.
I suspect the Camry I drive would take its sweet time getting there.

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Fred99

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#1452971 18-Dec-2015 13:17

TimA:
mudguard:
TimA:
My little audi S4. 10K of car, 340HP/600NM and would walk any jap import. I got some seriously fast quarter miles and top speeds on Hampton for the money.
I paid $1700 a year for insurance.

What sort of times? Think Puke is a better bet for a top speed crack!

Best ever was a 12.8 trapped at 180ish

I have had it in a straight line up to 270. Ran out of space.

You're claiming that your heavily modified audi "would walk any jap import".
Unmodified (except disable the speed limiter) R35 GTRs are two seconds faster than that 1/4 mile, and are available as jap imports.
Completely different performance class - and price of course.

mudguard

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#1452975 18-Dec-2015 13:25

A lot of the Euro's are limited to 250k as well. Even the Jap Import GTR's are limited to 180! As an old boss of mine found out Pukekohe. He called me out of the office one day to help install a little plastic box under the steering wheel. I'm assuming it did something to speed limiter. Beat working for an hour.

Talkiet

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#1452976 18-Dec-2015 13:30

Meh.. top speed is for showing off... You want a faster car? Do the following...

- Learn to drive
- Invest in better tyres
- Better brakes
- Better suspension

If it's still not fast enough after you've done those things- sure, get something "faster"

Personally I race a 1600cc car with about 150HP and regularly win or come in the top 3 at sprints and autocrosses against high horsepower EVOs, Porsches, GTRs, V8s etc.

Interestingly the 4 points above are going to help you on the road as well, without being in illegal license losing territory. Top speed gets you in trouble and dead.

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

mudguard

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#1452999 18-Dec-2015 13:40

Talkiet: Meh.. top speed is for showing off... You want a faster car? Do the following...

- Learn to drive
- Invest in better tyres
- Better brakes
- Better suspension

If it's still not fast enough after you've done those things- sure, get something "faster"

Personally I race a 1600cc car with about 150HP and regularly win or come in the top 3 at sprints and autocrosses against high horsepower EVOs, Porsches, GTRs, V8s etc.

Interestingly the 4 points above are going to help you on the road as well, without being in illegal license losing territory. Top speed gets you in trouble and dead.

Cheers - N

These are good points. I don't how useful high horsepower is in Autocross. However I'm surprised that someone could do 270k at Hampton Downs. Of course it may have been somewhere else, but I don't know anywhere faster than Pukekohe?

Besides, 1600CC is good for 240k!

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