Changes to ACC levy in annual registration

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MikeAqua

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#2146498 17-Dec-2018 11:33

GV27:

Imports have to meet minimum frontal impact standards if they are newer than 20 years old. It's not just a total free-for-all.

But why not apply same requirement to a used import as a new vehicle?

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/108893086/vision-zero-older-cars-make-our-roads-less-safe-but-upgrading-presents-challenges

Why allow a 20 year old import that doesn't meet frontal impact standards to be registered at all?

If someone wants to import a classic or vintage car that's fine. Put it on a trailer, tow it to the track or show or ...

Mike

Lastman

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#2146516 17-Dec-2018 12:11

1/3 of all people killed on the roads are not wearing seatbelts. We are still not getting the basics right.

GV27

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#2146533 17-Dec-2018 13:33

MikeAqua:

GV27:

Imports have to meet minimum frontal impact standards if they are newer than 20 years old. It's not just a total free-for-all.

But why not apply same requirement to a used import as a new vehicle?

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/108893086/vision-zero-older-cars-make-our-roads-less-safe-but-upgrading-presents-challenges

Why allow a 20 year old import that doesn't meet frontal impact standards to be registered at all?

If someone wants to import a classic or vintage car that's fine. Put it on a trailer, tow it to the track or show or ...

...drive them on the road, because they're cars and meant to be driven? Because we have a vehicle enthusiast community, and also because there's probably quite a few jobs in servicing these old cars and keeping them running.

How many 20+ year old vehicles do you think are actually in good enough condition to pass entry certification?

We have a pretty well-functioning permit system. If you want all imports to be Euro V or better than you're just going to drive the price up of imports and people will have to keep their older cars even longer.

MikeAqua

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#2146547 17-Dec-2018 14:08

GV27:

Because we have a vehicle enthusiast community, and also because there's probably quite a few jobs in servicing these old cars and keeping them running.

Collateral damage and minor at that.

The vehicle simply enthusiast community don't justify the slack they are cut when it comes to vehicle imports. They are a reasonably small group of people using the public roads for their hobby.

Mike

GV27

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#2146557 17-Dec-2018 14:16

MikeAqua:

GV27:

Because we have a vehicle enthusiast community, and also because there's probably quite a few jobs in servicing these old cars and keeping them running.

Collateral damage and minor at that.

The vehicle simply enthusiast community don't justify the slack they are cut when it comes to vehicle imports. They are a reasonably small group of people using the public roads for their hobby.

I assume you have evidence of recently imported 20 year old + vehicles causing serious accidents with worse outcomes than modern vehicles that you're going to provide to back this up with?

You're gonna be pretty mad when you find out about cycling.

MikeAqua

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#2146578 17-Dec-2018 15:10

GV27:

I assume you have evidence of recently imported 20 year old + vehicles causing serious accidents with worse outcomes than modern vehicles that you're going to provide to back this up with?

Read the article I linked to in an earlier post. IIRC occupants of old cars are 60% more likely to be killed or seriously injured in an accident. These cars represent about 25% of the fleet.

I understand that if we tightened up on safety requirements we would still have plenty of older cars that are already on our roads to deal with. However you have to start somewhere.

We have way to many deaths and serious injuries and one significant opportunity for addressing this is improved vehicle safety standards.

Mike

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GV27

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#2146591 17-Dec-2018 15:37

MikeAqua:

GV27:

I assume you have evidence of recently imported 20 year old + vehicles causing serious accidents with worse outcomes than modern vehicles that you're going to provide to back this up with?

Read the article I linked to in an earlier post. IIRC occupants of old cars are 60% more likely to be killed or seriously injured in an accident. These cars represent about 25% of the fleet.

I understand that if we tightened up on safety requirements we would still have plenty of older cars that are already on our roads to deal with. However you have to start somewhere.

We have way to many deaths and serious injuries and one significant opportunity for addressing this is improved vehicle safety standards.

Our fleet's age problem is not because people with disposable incomes buy the odd R32 Godzilla Skyline that sits in their garage for 30 days a month.

The reason our fleet is so old is because people simply can't afford to upgrade their cars and drive them until they die.

Increasing the standards vehicles have to meet increases the cost of what is imported, making second-hand vehicles less affordable and means people hang onto their cars even longer.

MikeAqua

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#2147196 18-Dec-2018 15:41

GV27:

Our fleet's age problem is not because people with disposable incomes buy the odd R32 Godzilla Skyline that sits in their garage for 30 days a month.

The reason our fleet is so old is because people simply can't afford to upgrade their cars and drive them until they die.

Increasing the standards vehicles have to meet increases the cost of what is imported, making second-hand vehicles less affordable and means people hang onto their cars even longer.

I agree that enthusiasts cars aren't a big chunk of the problem - especially classics and vintage. But old cars generally are a problem, exceptions are expensive and it's easier to ban imports of everything that doesn't meet a certain standard.

I agree there is a risk that people will hold onto cars even longer, but that is mitigated by several things: -

1) Those older cars will succumb to structural or mechanical failure;

2) The cars coming into the top end are getting safer and safer. This will trickle down;

3) There is an increasing number of new vehicles on the market from cheaper manufacturers;

4) Imports will be available that meet improved standards.

Mike

GV27

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#2147205 18-Dec-2018 15:47

MikeAqua:

I agree that enthusiasts cars aren't a big chunk of the problem - especially classics and vintage. But old cars generally are a problem, exceptions are expensive and it's easier to ban imports of everything that doesn't meet a certain standard.

I agree there is a risk that people will hold onto cars even longer, but that is mitigated by several things: -

1) Those older cars will succumb to structural or mechanical failure;

2) The cars coming into the top end are getting safer and safer. This will trickle down;

3) There is an increasing number of new vehicles on the market from cheaper manufacturers;

4) Imports will be available that meet improved standards.

There's nothing stopping those factors from acting now and we still have an old fleet. It's a question of economics and incomes.

In fact, there are diminishing returns as a ten year old vehicle now is a lot safer than a ten year old vehicle was in 2000 - and that's a change we're seeing as a result of the current standards.

MikeAqua

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#2147213 18-Dec-2018 16:00

GV27:

a ten year old vehicle now is a lot safer than a ten year old vehicle was in 2000 - and that's a change we're seeing as a result of the current standards.

Agree with that ... except that our road toll is tracking up.

Mike

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#2147225 18-Dec-2018 16:49

Lastman: 1/3 of all people killed on the roads are not wearing seatbelts. We are still not getting the basics right.

There has to be an element of Darwinism at work there.

My parents drilled the seatbelt thing into us as children back in the 70's.

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Geektastic

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#2147226 18-Dec-2018 16:51

MikeAqua:

GV27:

a ten year old vehicle now is a lot safer than a ten year old vehicle was in 2000 - and that's a change we're seeing as a result of the current standards.

Agree with that ... except that our road toll is tracking up.

Perhaps we could look at what other places in the world do. The Australians (as a close example) seem to have reasonably well behaved drivers (based on casual observation not empirical evidence) so what do they do that we do not do?

Geektastic

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#2147233 18-Dec-2018 17:06

I note also that the government recently announced significant funding for road improvements.

However I see no funding for driver training improvements.

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