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Scott3
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  #2715233 29-May-2021 14:47
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I'm surprised with all this talk about EV tech, frankly it is not that hard, evidenced by people doing conversion's in their garage.

 

Take a bunch of battery cells, assemble them in a pack with a management system, get an electric motor, (plus little ones for the likes of air conditioning), a bunch of power electronics, and wire them all together.

 

Basically the same stuff that you would find in a brush-less drill for a few hundred dolars at a hardware store, but bigger.

 

 

 

Much of the stuff can be purchased from OEM's if automakers don't want to do it themselves. Generally the battery cells are made by (or in a joint effort) with companies that are specialist in that area in that like LG. Other bits can be purchased from OEM's like Bosch if the automaker doesn't want to do it in-house.

 

 

 

The reall challenge for automakers with EV's are:

 

  • Supply - getting their hands on enough bits (especially battery cells) to meet customer demand.
  • Getting it profitable - Batteries are expensive... Consumers demand lots of them for long range.



Obraik
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  #2715235 29-May-2021 15:13
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gzt:
Obraik: There's quite a few Model 3s being unloaded at the Auckland port this weekend:

Over 200 vehicles. Is that a price drop coming or just backlog of orders?

Tesla tends to do quarterly shipments, so these are orders that have been placed since around March. Another shipment came in a week or so ago of around the same amount so there should be 400ish new Model 3 registrations in June.

However, there was a decent price drop around a month ago that has likely helped these numbers.




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KiwiME
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  #2715280 29-May-2021 17:26
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One of the less-appreciated complexities of an EV is the braking system.  It has to combine and prioritise electrical regeneration with friction braking while faking the feel of a normal brake pedal with ESC and ABS functionality, all the while maintaining the expected level of safety and reliability of a convention braking system.  In the Kona and probably others this is done with a second motorised master cylinder and a heap of solenoid valves. 

 

Certainly the drivetrain side of an EV is little more than well-established 1980s servo motor and amplifier technology.




SaltyNZ
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  #2715596 30-May-2021 17:33
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KiwiME:

 

Certainly the drivetrain side of an EV is little more than well-established 1980s servo motor and amplifier technology.

 

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure the drive-train side is normally some type of variable-speed AC motor - either induction or synchronous. Never a stepper motor.





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Scott3
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  #2715850 30-May-2021 21:44
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KiwiME:

 

One of the less-appreciated complexities of an EV is the braking system.  It has to combine and prioritise electrical regeneration with friction braking while faking the feel of a normal brake pedal with ESC and ABS functionality, all the while maintaining the expected level of safety and reliability of a convention braking system.  In the Kona and probably others this is done with a second motorised master cylinder and a heap of solenoid valves. 

 

....

 

 

Yes, doing blended breaking is quite difficult, and is a driver pain point in quite a few hybrid cars.

 

Should note that this issue isn't EV specific, also applies to hybrids.

 

Also it is possible for EV's to side step the issue completly, and just have all regen controlled by the accelerator. I think Some Tesla models, and perhaps the BMW i3 took this approach.


RunningMan
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  #2716234 31-May-2021 15:46
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Scott3: [snip] Also it is possible for EV's to side step the issue completly, and just have all regen controlled by the accelerator. I think Some Tesla models, and perhaps the BMW i3 took this approach.

 

 

I3 does exactly this. Brake pedal is friction only; by the time your foot is off the accelerator you already have maximum regen so for the most part it can be driven as one pedal only.


 
 
 

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mattwnz
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  #2716259 31-May-2021 17:07
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Obraik:
gzt: 
Over 200 vehicles. Is that a price drop coming or just backlog of orders?

Tesla tends to do quarterly shipments, so these are orders that have been placed since around March. Another shipment came in a week or so ago of around the same amount so there should be 400ish new Model 3 registrations in June.

However, there was a decent price drop around a month ago that has likely helped these numbers.

 

 

 

How are people outside Auckland buying these with out even test driving them? Or are they going up to Auckland to test drive them?


afe66
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  #2716276 31-May-2021 18:01
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One chap I know, drove a relatives model 3 to get a feel then ordered.

 

 

 

I bought my leaf 4 years ago after 15 minute test drive...... not regretted it but bit of a risk in hindsight..

 

 


Obraik
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  #2716358 31-May-2021 19:19
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mattwnz:

 

How are people outside Auckland buying these with out even test driving them? Or are they going up to Auckland to test drive them?

 

 

There is a Model 3 to test drive at the Christchurch service centre, however many drop by the Model 3 Facebook group with questions and someone local to them will offer to show them their car. Tesla kinda encourages this with the referral program- both owner and buyer can get 1500km worth of supercharging credit.

 

Having said that, I never test drove a Model 3 before I picked mine up.





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DjShadow
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  #2727841 13-Jun-2021 11:53
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EV Discounts are now a thing - Government offers $8625 discount on EVs, reviving policy killed by NZ First | Stuff.co.nz

 

It'll help with the Nissan Leaf I feel but won't make a Tesla feel much cheaper


BlinkyBill
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  #2727847 13-Jun-2021 12:36
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Only applies to new/imported cars up to the value of $80k; rate is reduced for a variety of permutations so should say ‘govt offers up to $8k discount …’

 

Also includes additional fees for new/imported gas-powered vehicles.


 
 
 

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SirHumphreyAppleby
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  #2727848 13-Jun-2021 12:36
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DjShadow:

 

It'll help with the Nissan Leaf I feel but won't make a Tesla feel much cheaper

 

 

Very disappointing to see the $80k limit still in place. I can see no reason for it, other than the green-eyed monster which taints so much of government policy.


Obraik
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  #2727858 13-Jun-2021 13:22
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DjShadow:

 

EV Discounts are now a thing - Government offers $8625 discount on EVs, reviving policy killed by NZ First | Stuff.co.nz

 

It'll help with the Nissan Leaf I feel but won't make a Tesla feel much cheaper

 

 

A Model 3 SR+ will now be $61k. A top of the line Toyota Camry is around $51k. When you then add on the cost benefits of having an EV, a Model 3 is now a competitive option against the Camry.





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wellygary
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  #2727860 13-Jun-2021 13:29
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Obraik:

 

DjShadow:

 

EV Discounts are now a thing - Government offers $8625 discount on EVs, reviving policy killed by NZ First | Stuff.co.nz

 

It'll help with the Nissan Leaf I feel but won't make a Tesla feel much cheaper

 

 

A Model 3 SR+ will now be $61k. A top of the line Toyota Camry is around $51k. When you then add on the cost benefits of having an EV, a Model 3 is now a competitive option against the Camry.

 

 

 

 

The kicker is that ( at least for the first 6 months- sounds like rushed policy) the rebate is a "mail in" i.e you need to stump up with the full $$$ and then subsequently apply to the government to get the money back after it is "assessed and approved"

 

see slide 3

 

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/the-feebate-govt-confirms-rebates-for-buyers-of-electric-cars-but-petrol-car-buyers-will-cop-it/TEJ3V5CF72YFTT5NPQTOWJ3AAE/

 

 


Obraik
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  #2727861 13-Jun-2021 13:54
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wellygary:

 

The kicker is that ( at least for the first 6 months- sounds like rushed policy) the rebate is a "mail in" i.e you need to stump up with the full $$$ and then subsequently apply to the government to get the money back after it is "assessed and approved"

 

see slide 3

 

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/the-feebate-govt-confirms-rebates-for-buyers-of-electric-cars-but-petrol-car-buyers-will-cop-it/TEJ3V5CF72YFTT5NPQTOWJ3AAE/

 

 

 

 

That's true, but there's also nothing stopping EV sellers from giving "Pay X now and give us $8625 when the rebate comes in" sort of deals.





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