EV (electric vehicle) News & Discussion

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#3090922 17-Jun-2023 11:04

@shk292

very unlikely in my view the Solterra or BZ4X AWD will be under $80K, what most non Chinese car manufacturers are doing with EVs is positioning the entry level spec below the rebate and higher spec e.g. AWD, LR etc above. That said the market is becoming more competitive e.g. Skoda dropped the Enyag $12K to get it below the rebate

Note the Solterra and BZ4X have slow AC charging

Obraik

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#3090936 17-Jun-2023 11:30

shk292:

Obraik: The Solterra and bz4x are good EVs...if the year was 2016. They absolutely are not worth the money Subaru and Toyota are trying to sell them for.

Why? Just the battery size and charge rate? They look otherwise good on paper provided they can stop the wheels falling off

My view is that they have a USP - AWD - which is otherwise not available in an EV without spending silly money. I guess they might find a price point below retail as is happening with "ex-demo" examples of Mazda's joke BEV

Based on US pricing they will likely be priced higher than much of their competing EVs (Model Y, Ioniq 5, EV6, Mach-E, etc). For that you get:

A 72kWh pack that can only get 360km
AC charging capped at 6.6kW
Drastic DC charging curve (looking at around 50kW at around 50% SoC, under 10kW once you get to 75% or higher)
Throttles DC charging rates if you try to DC charge back-to-back

You'd have to be a diehard Toyota/Subaru fan to want to put up with those limitations when you can get any of those mentioned competing vehicles that have already solved those problems.

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gzt

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#3090941 17-Jun-2023 12:06

My view is that they have a USP - AWD - which is otherwise not available in an EV without spending silly money.

What is that exactly?

shk292

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#3090945 17-Jun-2023 12:40

gzt:
My view is that they have a USP - AWD - which is otherwise not available in an EV without spending silly money.

What is that exactly?

Unique selling point is All Wheel Drive
Not sure what the next cheapest BEV with AWD is. For someone who goes skiing or other activities it may be important
I agree that it they price the base model near 80k without AWD then they're dreaming

xlinknz

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#3091042 17-Jun-2023 13:13

shk292

...I agree that it they price the base model near 80k without AWD then they're dreaming

Toyota for the present possibly rely on brand loyalty and perception of quality to command higher prices. In NZ one Tesla catches fire and its headline news in contrast to 1300 Corollas recalled in April due to fire risk but little mention

Scott3

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#3091770 18-Jun-2023 22:19

xlinknz:

@shk292

very unlikely in my view the Solterra or BZ4X AWD will be under $80K, what most non Chinese car manufacturers are doing with EVs is positioning the entry level spec below the rebate and higher spec e.g. AWD, LR etc above. That said the market is becoming more competitive e.g. Skoda dropped the Enyag $12K to get it below the rebate

Note the Solterra and BZ4X have slow AC charging

Subaru NZ have said (about a year old now), that they intend to only bring AWD models to NZ, and are aiming for one of the two trims they bring in to be under the $80k rebate cap.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/motoring/129326433/subaru-lands-first-solterra-ev-in-new-zealand

I think this is very ambitious given no other brands have yet managed to have an AWD EV break the $80k threshold, but I am rooting for subaru NZ to meet their aim...

AC charging is 6.6kW, which is which is pretty close to maxing out the most common home charging setup (32A single phase), and fast enough to fully charge the car in 11hr, 30 min according to EV-database.

It lags behind the 11kW 3 phase / 7.4kW single phase capability many competing cars. If one had three phase power at home, a EV6 LR could be charged in 8 hours only.

But frankly this AC charging fast enough for most use cases. If a Solterra returned home after a long day trip with just 20% left, as long as it was plugged in for just over 9 hours, it would be fully charged for the next day.

The big issues for the Solterra and BZ4X, are:

Weak performance in real world range tests.
DC fast charging lacks that of it's peers.

Minor issues:

Seems to have some issue where you can't do more than 3.8 consecutive fast charges (unlikely to be an issue a smaller country like NZ, unless the drivers is doing something that seriously increases range (adding a lot of windage via roof load or trailer).
Non-linear remaining battery read out.

Net result of the above is that the bZ4X took 11:50 on Bjorn's 100km challenge. (for comparison the EV6 AWD & Tesla Model Y RWD took 9:55.

BZ4X curve:

For comparison the Kia EV6 LR:

But for those that can live with the range and charging limitation, the Solterra has class leading ground clearance at 210mm (for comparison the Model Y has 167mm, and the EV6 has 155mm), which is a big factor when it comes to Light off-roading. And has the potential to be the cheapest new AWD EV by a big margin.

Dratsab

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#3091777 18-Jun-2023 22:45

arnies: Skoda Enyaq now $79k eligible for the $7k rebate. Deliveries Oct-Dec 2023. Maybe a better deal than the Model Y now?

Dingbatt: So I wonder what happens to the people that ordered it (Enyaq) at $94K?

Just catching up with this thread. It should be noted that it's only the first 600 vehicles arriving in NZ that will be at this price.

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Obraik

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#3092088 19-Jun-2023 15:46

The Cybertruck has landed in NZ...presumably for winter testing at the Southern Proving Grounds

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wellygary

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#3092096 19-Jun-2023 16:10

Dratsab:

Just catching up with this thread. It should be noted that it's only the first 600 vehicles arriving in NZ that will be at this price.

If they stick the price up by $12K after 600 units are sold they will tank sales... I doubt they will follow through on this

SaltyNZ

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2degrees

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#3092098 19-Jun-2023 16:11

Obraik:

The Cybertruck has landed in NZ...presumably for winter testing at the Southern Proving Grounds

I still think it looks like they ripped the a ute model out of a PlayStation game from 1994 and loaded it directly into a CNC machine.

iPad Pro 11" + iPhone 15 Pro Max + 2degrees 4tw!

These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.

Batman

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#3092106 19-Jun-2023 16:28

wellygary:

If they stick the price up by $12K after 600 units are sold they will tank sales... I doubt they will follow through on this

No they will release a spec that prices under the threshold.

Looking at the UK website it will either be an upmarket 60kWh or a poverty spec 80 kWh

xlinknz

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#3092185 19-Jun-2023 19:01

wellygary:

Dratsab:

Just catching up with this thread. It should be noted that it's only the first 600 vehicles arriving in NZ that will be at this price.

If they stick the price up by $12K after 600 units are sold they will tank sales... I doubt they will follow through on this

I wonder how many orders with the required 1K deposit Skoda NZ have had...

Batman

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#3092186 19-Jun-2023 19:06

xlinknz:

I wonder how many orders with the required 1K deposit Skoda NZ have had...

guy told me 50 in 2 days and now it's at 100

Obraik

2123 posts

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#3092295 19-Jun-2023 20:17

We have our first under $40k EV! Granted, that takes the rebate into account, but MG has announced that the MG4 will start at $46,990 before the $7015 rebate

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everettpsycho

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#3092302 19-Jun-2023 20:51

Obraik:
We have our first under $40k EV! Granted, that takes the rebate into account, but MG has announced that the MG4 will start at $46,990 before the $7015 rebate

Finally someone's gone lower than the magic $40k mark. All of the messaging for the mg4 was budget hero and that's why it was selling, then here their messaging was that but it was more than the z's which seemed a bit mad. Glad they've added an entry level to lower the barrier of entry a bit, but still behind my reach so will hope they find their way down to our hands ina. Few years on the second hand market.

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