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TLD



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Topic # 226202 25-Dec-2017 11:08
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I thought this worth sharing in case it helps anyone.  My 2001 3.5 petrol Pajero GLS suddenly developed a severe judder a while back.  The sort of thing you'd associate with throwing a wheel balance weight.  All four wheels were rechecked, and found to be OK.  The front and back wheels were rotated fronts to the back, backs to the front, and if anything, it was worse.  The judder only happened under neutral throttle, so would kick in when the cruise control was activated.  speeding up or slowing down would stop it immediately.

 

So it went to the shop that does my repairs — Instant Autos in Blenheim — and they checked everything and could find nothing wrong.  Next it went to Tyreland and their very fancy geometry gizomo where they found a bit of toe-in on the back wheels which was adjusted out.  Everything else was OK, and the judder continued.

 

Next it went to a 4x4 specialist who also couldn't think of anything, and the problem persisted.  It got weird here, as after a round trip to Nelson and few Ks local, the issue has got a lot better all by itself, and is definitely livable with now, so I can only put it down to tire wear.  The tires are a half way on and off road tread and of good quality.  They cost me $250 each.  So my conclusion at this stage is that these tires are not a good match for the Pajero.  I can't tell you what they are at the moment, because my wife has taken the Paj to work (yes it's Christmas day, but she works at Wairau hospital.   I'll put up a picture of the tires later if I remember.





Trevor Dennis
Rapaura (near Blenheim)

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  Reply # 1924953 25-Dec-2017 12:14
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We had a lightly modified 4x4 (with aftermarket rims & tires) that would occasionally experience severe judder/death wobble/wheel hop - right at 105km/h
Suspension/alignment all measured within spec, we rebalanced the wheels, tweaked the suspension & replaced several parts, even installed new control arms.

 

Borrowed a different set of tires & rims and it went away immediately. Harmonics have a lot to answer for.


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  Reply # 1925171 26-Dec-2017 09:18
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The judder only happened under neutral throttle, so would kick in when the cruise control was activated.  speeding up or slowing down would stop it immediately.

 

This really doesn't sound like alignment or a wheel balance issue to me. More like a drive train/ prop shaft issue (universal joints etc), or possibly transmission.

 

That said I've had issues with AT 4WD LT tyres going out of round to the point that I've had to turf them when they've had plenty of tread left as they couldn't be balanced, and also vibration/shimmy caused by worn suspension bushes (panhard in that case) that felt exactly like a wheel out of balance, and defied diagnosis as the free-play in the bush was small and couldn't be easily felt for with the suspension loaded up.  That was very annoying as vibration/shimmy kicked in between 90-100kmh - the speed you're at on the open road most of the time.  


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  Reply # 1925185 26-Dec-2017 09:48
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Yes I was thinking drive train for a while, but the fact that it has almost gone away as more Ks have been done, brought me back to tires.  The car is outside again now, so I'll grab a picture of the tires later





Trevor Dennis
Rapaura (near Blenheim)

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  Reply # 1925217 26-Dec-2017 10:52
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Does it have manual or auto freewheeling hubs on the front wheels? They can sometimes cause similar issues if 'stuck' in the wrong setting.






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  Reply # 1925235 26-Dec-2017 11:26
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Had a fleet car once that started getting a terrible feel through the wheels. A sort of thrumming at a certain speed. They checked the balance of the tyres etc and a few other things. Everything was supposed to be ok, but the problem continued. Finally the mechanic ran his hands around each tyre and found one tyre had quite a flat spot (in wasn't quite round). Turned out they had started using some cheap ars*d second hand Japanese tyres. Presumably one of the tyres had been sitting somewhere for a while before being extracted and exported here.




Nothing is impossible for the man who doesn't have to do it himself - A. H. Weiler

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  Reply # 1925251 26-Dec-2017 11:52
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robjg63: Had a fleet car once that started getting a terrible feel through the wheels. A sort of thrumming at a certain speed. They checked the balance of the tyres etc and a few other things. Everything was supposed to be ok, but the problem continued. Finally the mechanic ran his hands around each tyre and found one tyre had quite a flat spot (in wasn't quite round). Turned out they had started using some cheap ars*d second hand Japanese tyres. Presumably one of the tyres had been sitting somewhere for a while before being extracted and exported here.

 

 

 

I wonder if a tire like this might balance OK at the speeds they use in the tire shop, but distort and go out of balance at different speeds?  My issue has always been at its worse around the 70kph mark, but it has also shown up around 50kph.  The tires are made by Crosswind, and on the chunky side of All Terrain.  Google tells me they come from China, which gives me pause for thought. Most of the Google hits seem to be for eBay, which also tells me something — possibly that my tire fitter had a decent mark up at $250 a tire.  I won't be using them again.





Trevor Dennis
Rapaura (near Blenheim)

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  Reply # 1925303 26-Dec-2017 12:50
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Tire was balanced but definitely had quite a flat bit across one area. The mechanic was very proud he had worked it out and got me to feel it. As I said, only very noticeable at a certain speed. Sounds like you had some suspect tires.




Nothing is impossible for the man who doesn't have to do it himself - A. H. Weiler

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