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687 posts

Ultimate Geek


#265449 22-Jan-2020 09:32
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Hello,

 

We have a late 2013 Mazda CX5 (70,000kms), We have owned it since, new, had it serviced continually by the dealer, and the car has only been used as a suburban vehicle (ie no offroading etc). 

 

Recently the steering has started "knocking" while going over bumps and when it was in getting services we asked the dealer to check and they said the intermediate shaft needs to be replaced. 

 

I found this a little weird as its not something that I have heard of needing to be replaced on such a young car with not a massive amount of mileage. 

 

So I am trying to find out what is "reasonable" in relation to an item like this - it feels like it is not reasonable to have such a significant component need to be replaced after such a short duration (in all our previous cars, rwd, fwd, 4wd, older cars, newer cars, performance cars, shopping basket cars, family cars, etc; I have never had to replace such an item, even with cars getting over 200,000kms). 

 

I have asked for AA's advice, but they have just responded with the normal politicians answer of "it depends and its hard to say"...further diluting the value of the AA :( 

 

Any thoughts on this are greatly appreciated. 


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849 posts

Ultimate Geek

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  #2403390 22-Jan-2020 09:54
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When I was still on the tools (back in my day, sonny jim!), the only time I ever replaced a steering shaft component was a recall of a certain vehicle's intermediate shaft. And it was a job that sucked balls.

 

Under normal operation, I would have expected it to last longer than that. Unless they can prove that the component failed as a result of exacerbated wear-and-tear, and especially since you have a) owned it since new and b) serviced it with a dealer since new, I would at the very least be trying to get it done under a good-will out-of-warranty repair. 

 

Not familiar with the design, but I would expect it to be literally a piece of steel with splines on each end, and maybe a u-joint in between?


10316 posts

Uber Geek


  #2404417 22-Jan-2020 10:51
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May not necessarily solve the "how long should it last" question, but if it happened to me I'd be taking it to a power-steering specialist for an opinion.  Some franchise workshops have a reputation for swapping out parts when repair is possible. 


 
 
 
 




687 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #2490837 25-May-2020 08:10
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For what its worth; and after significant amount of back and forth with the dealer (got various service providers correspondence to confirm it is not a usual part to need replacement this early on; including a very surprised response from a Mazda agent themselves), we have come to "an arrangement" where we will be paying 50% of the cost and the dealer will pick up the other 50%. So thought I would just update this thread for completeness.  


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  #2490839 25-May-2020 08:17
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That should out last the car!

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  #2490842 25-May-2020 08:27
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I'd get an opinion from another garage as to exactly *what* is wrong. I'd have guessed that it would be a CV joint. Or maybe a suspension component that had come loose. I'm not a mechanic.

 

Potholes/bumps on which side of the car cause the noise?

 

 




687 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #2490866 25-May-2020 09:00
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Its not a CV joint; it certainly is the steering. It is both audible and felt through the steering wheel itself and has been confirmed. The issue is not questioned. Its (was) the cost of replacement/remediation that was the point of contention in this instance :) Given the age and mileage - even though as stated above it should outlast the car - I feel that a 50:50 split is a good compromise. 


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  #2490944 25-May-2020 10:52
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Do you have a parking spot that needs a lot of manoeuvring? I started driving well before power steering and learnt to have the car moving when turning the wheel. Now it is easy to get the into bad habit of cranking on the wheel with the car stationary. This would put a lot of strain on the steering.

The seems to be a history of various Mazda models having problems with a splined coupling on the intermediate shaft that is fixed by lubricating the splines. Some posts refer to "the new super grease". Maybe your splines needed more grease some time back and are now worn.

Edit: not accusing the Mazda agent but I've always got the "very surprised" response from car dealers even if you show them evidence of an overseas recall for the problem. Their first instinct is to deny or that your case is the first they've heard of.

 
 
 
 




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Ultimate Geek


  #2490945 25-May-2020 10:59
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Thanks for your comments; as this is interesting to read. While this could very well be part of the problem (but no the car is not in tight circumstances needing a lot of swinging on the wheel). If the steering components can't cope with being used for what they were intended then they really are not fit for purpose. Even if the super grease should have been applied, given the car has been serviced since day 1 at the same dealer it was purchased from, this should have been picked up....this is all leading towards my initial impression that this fault really implies either the part is not fit for purpose or the servicing has been negligent to some degree and not done what was necessary to ensure premature wear was not an end result....

 

All good comments (thank you), and hopefully if someone else runs into this same situation this might be of some value, for now we are just looking forward to having this fixed in the near future *phew*


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  #2491498 26-May-2020 07:55
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Bung: Do you have a parking spot that needs a lot of manoeuvring? I started driving well before power steering and learnt to have the car moving when turning the wheel. Now it is easy to get the into bad habit of cranking on the wheel with the car stationary. This would put a lot of strain on the steering.

 

The CX5 have electric power steering, so no.


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  #2491502 26-May-2020 08:20
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I have never seen an intermediate shaft fail.  When I say never, I've managed R&M for a fleet of rental cars, most of which would have ended up with more than 70,000kms before being moved out of the fleet.

 

It's reasonable to expect that part to last the life of the car.  It isn't subject to stresses the way a e.g. CV joint is.  It takes some very rough driving to abuse the intermediate shaft.  Other things would be showing damage first, especially in a Mazda SUV which is really a 'soft-roader'.   It's not like you have been boulder bashing your way up a river bed.  The fact it has failed suggests a material or installation defect IMO. 

 

As the from new owner and at only 7 years and 70,000 km you could reasonably expect replacement under the CGA without costing you a cent.

 

You have reached a deal with Mazda that you are happy with so all good.  I'd still be asking them what caused the failure. 





Mike



687 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #2491515 26-May-2020 08:57
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Thanks Mike, I don't disagree at all with what you are saying and this was my sentiment when starting out on this path. The difficulty was getting people to provide that clarity from an independent expert perspective to give substance to a case to take through the legal channels so that the judge could make an informed decision. Everyone (incl AA who I thought were supposed to be an independent expert association) would only give generalities with lots of maybes and depends (no one would commit one way or another), except for (ironically enough) the Mazda service agent I contacted to get verification on the expected cost. So while I would love to have had this covered entirely, it is to some degree I fall on my sword and accept this outcome.

 

Hopefully if it happens to someone else then this might be helpful for them too. 


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  #2491519 26-May-2020 09:14
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I did a search on mazda steering intermediate shaft and found clunking noises from steering involving mazda 2, 6 and bt50.

The common cure was greasing the splines that allow for steering column adjustment.

"I know this is an old thread, but I fixed this on a 2011 Mazda2 that I bought for my daughter. I replaced the intermediate shaft and the noise was gone. The new intermediate shaft is slightly different but is still the same basic design. For fun, with the old shaft out of the car, i pulled the shaft to its longest length and lubricated the exposed splines with lithium grease. And surprise, the clunk was gone.
I think the design change in the new shaft improves the grease retention, or flow, perhaps, so I am leaving the new one in."

The super grease mentioned in some threads is an orange colour.

It's not just a Mazda problem, change the search to Toyota and

"Applicable Models:
2003-’06 Camry
2004-’05 Highlander
2004-’06 Solara
2005-’06 Avalon
2006 Highlander HV

Some customers may hear a clunk pop or knock-type noise when turning the steering wheel left or right. Use the following procedure to lubricate the intermediate shaft and address customer concerns."


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  #2491629 26-May-2020 10:42
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Hope Mazda don't charge half of a replacement then just do a grease!!




687 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #2491633 26-May-2020 10:47
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linw:

 

Hope Mazda don't charge half of a replacement then just do a grease!!

 

 

Some things you just never can be sure of; but if it fails or exhibits these same symptoms in the future, I will be going at them with both barrels. 


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  #2491709 26-May-2020 11:50
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linw:

 

Hope Mazda don't charge half of a replacement then just do a grease!!

 

 

If concerned , mark the part before the job is submitted.


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