Roading Infrastructure Nonsense

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allan

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#282694 6-Mar-2021 15:04

Wellington specific, but: what's with the completely idiotic decision by NZTA not to build a slip road at what will be the new Transmission Gully/SH1 interchange because apparently they couldn't find a contractor to build it!!! What sort of excuse is that? Do we never build infrastructure properly in this country? Instead they are saying "they are looking at other options to ensure safety at the merge point, including variable message signs and CCTV cameras".

This is the Wellington "Smart Motorway" debacle all over again and some years before that, the SH2 River Road bypass being build as as two lane road that then had to have passing lanes tacked onto it immediately afterwards.

This is going to be a shambles.

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#2669068 6-Mar-2021 15:58

Waka Kotahi (NZTA) are well overdue for thorough top down independent review. Everything they tough is a shambles. During the time of Ministry of Works many huge projects were completed without the catastrophes that occurs under Waka Kotahi.

Handle9

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#2669072 6-Mar-2021 16:25

MikeB4: Waka Kotahi (NZTA) are well overdue for thorough top down independent review. Everything they tough is a shambles. During the time of Ministry of Works many huge projects were completed without the catastrophes that occurs under Waka Kotahi.

The Clyde dam was quite the success for the ministry of works.

eracode

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#2669103 6-Mar-2021 17:37

Handle9:
MikeB4: Waka Kotahi (NZTA) are well overdue for thorough top down independent review. Everything they tough is a shambles. During the time of Ministry of Works many huge projects were completed without the catastrophes that occurs under Waka Kotahi.

The Clyde dam was quite the success for the ministry of works.

Don’t know much about the Clyde Dam, so I just read a bit about it online. I’m still not sure if your comment is serious or TIC - because it seems to have been a success but had issues during construction.

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allan

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#2669104 6-Mar-2021 17:42

I forgot to link the Stuff article in my original post - https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/124441486/another-speed-bump-for-transmission-gully-merge-lane-at-linden-on-hold

snnet

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#2669112 6-Mar-2021 17:55

It kinda sounds like they never really intended to build the slip road and always wanted to do the smart motorway instead

Handle9

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#2669113 6-Mar-2021 18:01

eracode:
Don’t know much about the Clyde Dam, so I just read a bit about it online. I’m still not sure if your comment is serious or TIC - because it seems to have been a success but had issues during construction.

Clyde went 50% over budget and generates 25% under design capacity.

It's a classic infrastructure project gone bad.

In all seriousness complex infrastructure projects routinely go pear shaped everywhere. The reasons are fairly complex but usually it's a client side issue that flows down through the entire project.

Fred99

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#2669365 7-Mar-2021 10:11

Handle9:

Clyde went 50% over budget and generates 25% under design capacity.

How much of that cost overrun was due to "discovery" of unknown geotechnical issues after the project was commenced?

(I guess the question could be framed another way - if this had been a private enterprise led project, then would the geotechnical issues have been discovered at the design stage - before commencement of the project?)

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old3eyes

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#2669428 7-Mar-2021 12:49

As there could be lots on congestion if this slip lane doesn't go ahead just do what NZTA does in Auckland, put a set of traffic lights on it.

Regards,

Old3eyes

Jase2985

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#2669535 7-Mar-2021 16:54

How long do you think this piece of road has been laid? what about asphalt piece next to it?

Handle9

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#2669538 7-Mar-2021 16:59

Fred99:

Handle9:

Clyde went 50% over budget and generates 25% under design capacity.

How much of that cost overrun was due to "discovery" of unknown geotechnical issues after the project was commenced?

(I guess the question could be framed another way - if this had been a private enterprise led project, then would the geotechnical issues have been discovered at the design stage - before commencement of the project?)

It didn't really matter who delivered it, the project would have been a relative failure.

The point was that the Ministry of Works wasn't infallibale - far from it. Large, complex infrastructure projects all around the world routinely go significantly over budget and time.

The delivery model is almost immaterial in predicting this.

MikeB4

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#2669546 7-Mar-2021 17:05

Off/on topic The Ngaio Gorge today. There are light for traffic control were timing wrong. The up traffic from Hutt Road had a queue from Hutt Road halfway up the Gorge to the lights. The up traffic would get 4-5 cars through on the ground and the down traffic would get through about 10-15 then a huge time lag before the lights changed. The distance of the single lane was about 100 meters.

Infuriating

dfnt

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#2669570 7-Mar-2021 18:11

Jase2985:
How long do you think this piece of road has been laid? what about asphalt piece next to it?

Probably several years ago if Karori is anything to go by

So many roads around Karori like that, on one of them they just dumped extra rocks over areas where the chip seal has been damaged due to summer heat. They’ve never bothered to sweep up the excess rocks either

Every time I drive around that area you can hear stones peppering the underside of the car

snnet

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#2669572 7-Mar-2021 18:17

they're re-doing the main road where I am ... again

It was probably last done 9 months ago.. stripped right back and redone. It probably did need doing, there were potholes in places, I just wish they could do something a little better (lnger lasting). I was still surprised to see it done again so soon, as the destination doesn't lead to anywhere else but dead ends (30-40 min drive away) though that probably makes it an easier road to repair

mattwnz

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#2669573 7-Mar-2021 18:23

allan:

Wellington specific, but: what's with the completely idiotic decision by NZTA not to build a slip road at what will be the new Transmission Gully/SH1 interchange because apparently they couldn't find a contractor to build it!!! What sort of excuse is that? Do we never build infrastructure properly in this country? Instead they are saying "they are looking at other options to ensure safety at the merge point, including variable message signs and CCTV cameras".

This is the Wellington "Smart Motorway" debacle all over again and some years before that, the SH2 River Road bypass being build as as two lane road that then had to have passing lanes tacked onto it immediately afterwards.

This is going to be a shambles.

IMO the river road is a mess, I always avoid it.I remember going on it when it was being built. I thought it was still just two lane, but has a number of long overtaking lane on each side at different places. But there are bottlenecks, one being the curved bridge, which is narrow and two lanes. They needed another bridge to be built alongside or an entirely new bridge. Likewise the two busy intersections on each side of it get very busy and had had lot of accidents in the past. IMO, some places on it need to be reduced to 50 to make it safe, and it needs a lot of work done to it.

It was always supposed to be a bypass, but many people want to bypass UH, so it got very busy. Also it is really just became an extension of the SH2 motorway from Lower Hutt.

Jase2985

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#2669578 7-Mar-2021 18:49

@dfnt:
Jase2985:

How long do you think this piece of road has been laid? what about asphalt piece next to it?

Probably several years ago if Karori is anything to go by

So many roads around Karori like that, on one of them they just dumped extra rocks over areas where the chip seal has been damaged due to summer heat. They’ve never bothered to sweep up the excess rocks either

Every time I drive around that area you can hear stones peppering the underside of the car

Chip seal was done 3 weeks ago, its worse now than it was before they did it.

The asphalt was done 3 years ago and looks like new.

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