Government to spend $61m to lift bus driver wages

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lchiu7

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#302123 31-Oct-2022 10:40

A good start but they need to both spend more and allow bus drivers to be classified as a industry of importance (or whatever the term is) so that prospective drivers can come to NZ with minimal red tape

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/130321198/government-to-spend-61m-to-lift-bus-driver-wages

Just again having a bus be cancelled on me this morning in Wellington, even though I checked the Metlink app before I left home and the bus was showing as on time and then the status changed to cancelled while I was at the bus stop, more drivers would be very good.

But is $28/hour enough to entice people to become drivers?

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#2989946 31-Oct-2022 11:06

I think people underestimate how stressful bus driving can be, these days.

Not only are they constantly under time pressure, but with road speed limits reducing, less buses on the road due to driver shortages and increasing expectations on being timely etc, it makes it pretty hard for them to get excited aboiut going to work.

Add in the fact that there is the very real possibility of being assaulted by meth heads and yoofs & you have a very unattractive job.

They need to be paid well and then the weight of expectation and the dangers of the job are almost justifiable.

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frankv

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#2989954 31-Oct-2022 11:23

Not to mention shift work and weekends and all the rest.

Personally, I think that making it easier to import cheap labour from overseas is the wrong answer, at least long-term.

Firstly, it just allows the underlying issues to continue to fester. Only when it costs more to pay drivers due to the difficult working conditions will money be provided to improve those working conditions.

Secondly, once the imported drivers discover what it's really like, they will depart for other driving jobs (e.g. trucks) which are (I believe) better paid, or at least don't have the difficulties.

Thirdly, importing cheap labour just guarantees that NZ will continue to be a low-wage economy.

Geektastic

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#2989966 31-Oct-2022 11:29

Not sure ratepayers or taxpayers money is an appropriate source of funding for private sector employees.

Handsomedan

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#2989971 31-Oct-2022 11:34

Geektastic: Not sure ratepayers or taxpayers money is an appropriate source of funding for private sector employees.

I tend to agree - the private sector needs to pay well to attract the right talent and public sector needs to do what it can to encourage the public to use the public transport that is on offer.

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lchiu7

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#2989977 31-Oct-2022 12:10

Handsomedan:

Geektastic: Not sure ratepayers or taxpayers money is an appropriate source of funding for private sector employees.

I tend to agree - the private sector needs to pay well to attract the right talent and public sector needs to do what it can to encourage the public to use the public transport that is on offer.

Then maybe the answer is for the companies to pay the right wage and the ticket prices reflect this but the govt then subsidises the ticket prices to make it affordable. Who is carrying the cost of the 50% of the tickets at the moment?

elpenguino

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#2989978 31-Oct-2022 12:10

I think the long term answer is more to be found with rail, where one driver can move hundreds of passengers, or with automation.

Having said that, I see some of the big players have pulled out of driverless car development which shows it's a hard nut to crack.

In the meantime yeah, pay bus drivers more. I still wouldn't fancy the split shifts many drivers work.

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gzt

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#2989995 31-Oct-2022 12:37

There needs to be more effort and perhaps even legislation for
- Driver safety
- Toilet facilities
- Minimize or eliminate split shifts way too evil.

lxsw20

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#2990008 31-Oct-2022 12:55

elpenguino:

I think the long term answer is more to be found with rail, where one driver can move hundreds of passengers, or with automation.

Having said that, I see some of the big players have pulled out of driverless car development which shows it's a hard nut to crack.

In the meantime yeah, pay bus drivers more. I still wouldn't fancy the split shifts many drivers work.

That's great for the 2 cities in the country with a commuter rail network, what about the rest of NZ?

lchiu7

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#2990017 31-Oct-2022 13:18

gzt: There needs to be more effort and perhaps even legislation for
- Driver safety
- Toilet facilities
- Minimize or eliminate split shifts way too evil.

The other day the driver of my bus got out at the Wellington Rail depot and went into the staff room for a pit stop :-) We all just waited for him and passengers waiting to board were somewhat perplexed to see a bus with passengers but no driver.

gzt

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#2990020 31-Oct-2022 13:22

Absolutely fair. This used to be common practice between runs and at one or two strategic locations. There are many runs where drivers do not get the opportunity and the company seems unwilling to create it or facilitate it.

lchiu7

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#2990033 31-Oct-2022 13:40

gzt: Absolutely fair. This used to be common practice between runs and at one or two strategic locations. There are many runs where drivers do not get the opportunity and the company seems unwilling to create it or facilitate it.

Wasn't a criticism, just an observation :-)

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frankv

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#2990219 31-Oct-2022 17:10

Geektastic: Not sure ratepayers or taxpayers money is an appropriate source of funding for private sector employees.

I don't think ratepayers' or taxpayers' money is an appropriate source of funding for private sector companies.

I really don't understand how a company can provide a service (e.g. running the buses) to a city *and* make a worthwhile profit for less than the city doing it themselves with their own employees. It just seems a total abdication by the city management.

Likewise things like the feeding of hospital patients and doing the hospital laundry and maintaining the roads.

PolicyGuy

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#2990234 31-Oct-2022 17:43

frankv:

Geektastic: Not sure ratepayers or taxpayers money is an appropriate source of funding for private sector employees.

I don't think ratepayers' or taxpayers' money is an appropriate source of funding for private sector companies.

I really don't understand how a company can provide a service (e.g. running the buses) to a city *and* make a worthwhile profit for less than the city doing it themselves with their own employees. It just seems a total abdication by the city management.

Likewise things like the feeding of hospital patients and doing the hospital laundry and maintaining the roads.

You are both absolutely correct, but it was the policy of the former National Party government that it must be done that way - not 'can be done', or 'should be done', 'must be done'. This is enshrined in the "Public Transport Operating Model" that says how public transport that receives a subsidy from the government (usually through Regional Councils and/or Waka Kotahi) must be operated.

The current government introduced a change very recently which will allow local and regional councils to themselves directly provide public transport services in vehicles they own and using staff they employ. This will of course not have much effect until current contracts with private sector providers run out.
If in the meantime we have another ACT/National Party government, you may expect this policy to be overturned because (a) it was a Labour policy and (b) "private sector good, public sector bad"

wally22

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#2990235 31-Oct-2022 17:46

gzt: Absolutely fair. This used to be common practice between runs and at one or two strategic locations. There are many runs where drivers do not get the opportunity and the company seems unwilling to create it or facilitate it.

When I drove WCC big reds in the '70's there were locked toilets at each outer terminus and a key supplied to the drivers. Don't know if that is still a thing.

alasta

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#2990256 31-Oct-2022 19:28

There is an awful little outhouse style toilet at the bottom of Houghton Bay Road which is clearly intended to be used by the bus drivers using the terminus there. It looks like the sort of toilet where you wonder what might be lurking beneath the toilet seat waiting to bite you as soon as you sit down...

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