Tesla suing Chinese customers who complain for defamation

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dafman

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#318721 14-Feb-2025 17:36

Elon Musk loves to talk up free speech. But try complaining about Tesla safety issues in China and see how far you get …

Telsa has sued Chinese customers and journalists - and won almost every time

Her parents were injured in a Tesla crash. She ended up having to pay Tesla damages

Speaks volumes about the company you are dealing with when you purchase a Tesla.

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#3342986 14-Feb-2025 19:44

Brace yourself for the hysterical defensive responses from Tesla owners like this.

Handle9

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#3343071 14-Feb-2025 23:38

alasta:

Brace yourself for the hysterical defensive responses from Tesla owners like this.

It’s only a very small percentage of Tesla owners that are aggressive loonies. They just seem more vocal than many of the other people who mistake a product for a missing part of their personality.

michaelmurfy

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#3343076 15-Feb-2025 00:10

alasta: Brace yourself for the hysterical defensive responses from Tesla owners like this.

So something worth saying here... Something that people will find interesting is the majority of Tesla owners do not like Musk. I love my Tesla - the vehicle that many talented engineers built. I hate Musk.

But it's also important with any self driving / assistive technology to always be alert and ready to take control. We're not there yet with self driving from any company. This user was in the wrong here. The auto driving "assistive" features including full self driving are still in beta and I think the user knows that hence why "he still likes his car" and that is fine.

I however do not approve Tesla for basically stating it's full self driving right now and basically dismissing feedback. I believe it should be still as assistive feature. Yes, it's somewhat impressive but it isn't the only system out there. I've lost count with the amount of times I could have been killed if I didn't take control with Autopilot (note, not full self driving) doing something stupid and I'm sure full self driving mistakes are up there too all because Musk forced engineers to use cameras only while every other company are using Radar / Lidar. Cameras simply don't see as much as other sensors out there.

My car had radar when I bought it but this was disabled with firmware with a new feature "Tesla Vision" which is a simple way of saying "we're using the cameras only now". Having Radar I felt was important in situations where visibility is low eg, to see through fog and now the cars emergency assistance features are not as good from when I bought it. Disabling assistive features like radar should be outright illegal unless they can prove it doesn't reduce safety features.

Do I feel safe with my car? Yes. Is it better than any other car out there? No. But what matters to me is my wife who has experienced some trauma in the past preventing her from driving is now about to sit her restricted drivers license in the Tesla all because she feels safer in the Tesla than my previous cars. We both know it has its flaws but somehow, it's made her overcome her fear.

Anyway, that's my 2c on this. If a Tesla owner loves their car then so be it. I don't feel this is a defensive response and not all Tesla owners are fanboys.

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mdf

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#3343091 15-Feb-2025 08:34

I'm not a fan of Mr Musk or even particularly Tesla, but I found that Chinese defamation headline misleading. The article goes on to discuss things in more detail and it certainly wasn't just a case of simple comments of "my Tesla's brakes failed" = defamation lawsuit. Not dimishing her frustration or concern, but going full Karen and crashing a Tesla event to protest is a bit beyond "expressing concern". Even then, she sued Tesla first (twice) and lost both times. Tesla's lawsuit was a countersuit to hers.

The article mentions this has happened before. Personally, this particular case didn't strike me as especially egregious, but I don't know the facts of the others.

dafman

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#3343102 15-Feb-2025 09:38

mdf:

I'm not a fan of Mr Musk or even particularly Tesla, but I found that Chinese defamation headline misleading. The article goes on to discuss things in more detail and it certainly wasn't just a case of simple comments of "my Tesla's brakes failed" = defamation lawsuit. Not dimishing her frustration or concern, but going full Karen and crashing a Tesla event to protest is a bit beyond "expressing concern". Even then, she sued Tesla first (twice) and lost both times. Tesla's lawsuit was a countersuit to hers.

The article mentions this has happened before. Personally, this particular case didn't strike me as especially egregious, but I don't know the facts of the others.

Brake failure put her family in hospital. Tesla refused to hand over the pre-crash data she requested to prove her claim of brake failure, then Tesla sued her. Pretty sure even I’d go full Karen under these circumstances.

Extracts from the article:

Tesla has sued at least six car owners in China who had sudden vehicle malfunctions, quality complaints or accidents they claimed were caused by mechanical failures. The company has also sued at least six bloggers and two Chinese media outlets that wrote critically about the company.

It is not common practice for automakers — in China or elsewhere — to sue their customers. But Tesla has pioneered an aggressive legal strategy and leveraged the patronage of powerful leaders in China’s ruling Communist Party to silence critics, reap financial rewards and limit its accountability.

RunningMan

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#3343122 15-Feb-2025 12:37

dafman:Brake failure put her family in hospital. Tesla refused to hand over the pre-crash data she requested to prove her claim of brake failure, then Tesla sued her. Pretty sure even I’d go full Karen under these circumstances.

Except that's not all of what the article linked says. It also says that:

1) Tesla did hand over the data, albeit with a significant delay and that data showed the brakes did slow the car

2) The police determined the crash was caused by not maintaining a safe following distance

The claim that brake failure put her family in hospital is just that, a claim and not proven, at least as far as that article is concerned. There's not enough info in that article to determine which factor or factors actually caused the crash. No idea if there is more info or crash data available publicly though.

The data apparently says the car was travelling at 120km/h before the crash. I can only see one photo of the crash site and don't know the location but it doesn't look like an area with a speed limit that would be that high. An alternative explanation is the car was being driven too fast for the area and the brakes in any car wouldn't have been able to stop it in an emergency situation.

Ultimately, there's just not enough info there to say that brake failure put her family in hospital. Even in just the linked article there's enough info to suggest the cause could also have been speeding or driver error.

My impression is Tesla sued because she went "full Karen", not the other way around.

Senecio

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#3343246 15-Feb-2025 19:51

Honest question here. Could an insurance company decline a claim with full self driving active if it could be shown that the driver failed to take control of the car?

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Handle9

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#3343248 15-Feb-2025 20:10

Senecio:

Honest question here. Could an insurance company decline a claim with full self driving active if it could be shown that the driver failed to take control of the car?

Potentially. Like most insurance stuff the details would matter a great deal.

mattwnz

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#3345025 20-Feb-2025 17:42

michaelmurfy:

So something worth saying here... Something that people will find interesting is the majority of Tesla owners do not like Musk. I love my Tesla - the vehicle that many talented engineers built. I hate Musk.

There is a bumper sticker that some Tesla owners are getting to put on their car that says. "I purchased this before Musk went crazy"

If I owned a Tesla I would be putting one on my car. https://www.etsy.com/market/i_bought_this_before_elon_went_crazy

jonathan18

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#3345046 20-Feb-2025 20:11

mattwnz:

There is a bumper sticker that some Tesla owners are getting to put on their car that says. "I purchased this before Musk went crazy"

If I owned a Tesla I would be putting one on my car. https://www.etsy.com/market/i_bought_this_before_elon_went_crazy

This is the one exception I’d make for the ‘no stickers on my car’ rule - must get around to ordering one! Then again, I think it should read ‘… before Musk totally jumped the shark’…

Obraik

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#3345294 21-Feb-2025 14:39

I don't think it's really necessary in NZ. Your number plate (assuming it's not a custom one) gives away the year you purchased it.

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RunningMan

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#3345302 21-Feb-2025 14:47

Obraik:

Your number plate (assuming it's not a custom one) gives away the year you purchased it.

Huh? Licence plates don't have to change at every change of ownership.

Obraik

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#3345309 21-Feb-2025 15:00

RunningMan:

Huh? Licence plates don't have to change at every change of ownership.

Maybe you have misunderstood. You don't need a sticker saying you purchased the car prior to Elon's facade dropping, your number plate shows when the car was first registered. Eg, slapping the sticker on a car with a number plate starting with R invalidates the sticker - likewise sticking one on a car with a numberplate that starts with M is kind of redundant

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RunningMan

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#3345310 21-Feb-2025 15:07

Obraik:. You don't need a sticker saying you purchased the car prior to Elon's facade dropping, your number plate shows when the car was first registered.

Yeah but when the car was first registered and when you bought it will only ever be the same for the first owner of the car, and also assumes that car hasn't had multiple plates. Plates can be changed for several reasons, and owners change all the time.

It would be a minority of cars on NZ roads where the date of first registration and date of most recent ownership change were the same.

Obraik

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#3345312 21-Feb-2025 15:11

RunningMan:

Yeah but when the car was first registered and when you bought it will only ever be the same for the first owner of the car, and also assumes that car hasn't had multiple plates. Plates can be changed for several reasons, and owners change all the time.

It would be a minority of cars on NZ roads where the date of first registration and date of most recent ownership change were the same.

Most cars never change their plate, so yes, the plate is the biggest giveaway to how old the car is - no sticker required.

If you're slapping the sticker on your secondhand Tesla, the older plate still acheives what you're trying to do. Besides, someone buying a secondhand Tesla isn't giving any money to Tesla/Elon.

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