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Bewildered
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  #3265674 29-Jul-2024 07:44
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If I recall correctly MTBF figures apply at a family/model level, not at a device level. Therefore a MTBF of 2.5M hours means that they expect one failure for every 2.5M hours of run time across the all the drives they've ever made of that specific type/generation. Typically MTBFs are calculated based on component design parameters and are then tuned with failure statistics, though that is somewhat sketchy as once the warranty lapses reports of failures typically do not make it back to the manufacturer - but outside of warranty is when you can expect the most failures!

 

Anyway, in practical terms this means that if you have 1,000,000 of these drives in operation around the world (just to keep the numbers simple) you can expect one drive failure every 2.5 hours.....because every 2.5 hours you will have achieved 2.5M hours of run time. 

 

You cannot apply fleet-level stats at a device level....no drive will last an average of ~300 years...  ;-)





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Dairusire
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  #3266269 30-Jul-2024 10:45
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I've had really good success with ServerPartDeals. 

They do Manufacturer recertified drives and offer 2yr warranties on said drives. 

 

Their prices are also quite competitive in the used drive/recertified drive market. 

 

Their packaging is also VERY good. Probably the best packaging I've ever had. Miles better than PB Tech, though that's not saying much lol. 


Bewildered
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  #3266277 30-Jul-2024 11:14
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ServerPartDeals looks good....but the shipping is insanely expensive. I put five 18TB drives in into the shopping cart and it tells me that there is a single shipping option and that it will cost $259 to ship to a wellington CBD address. Is that $60 of shipping and $200 of packaging? I double checked and then found the cost of sending it to a residential address in the suburbs was 'just' $125...this being the cheapest of the 6 options offered. I wonder why the shipping arrangements are so weird...either way, pick your delivery address with care as it seems to make a big difference...





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toejam316
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  #3266279 30-Jul-2024 11:19
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I've been ordering drives from East Digital, they have a shopify and an ebay page. Pretty solid prices, free delivery. Manufacturer refurb, new drives and as-is server pulls. I've gotten 2 18TB drives from them with a third on the way, and a colleague got a 12TB from them.





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amanzi
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  #3266282 30-Jul-2024 11:24
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After clicking through the link to the Amazon drives above, I discovered a whole section of Amazon Renewed drives with pretty good prices and most have free shipping to NZ.

 

Some example searches:

 

12TB: https://www.amazon.com/s?k=12tb&i=specialty-aps&srs=12653393011&crid=GZAB6FRXXLNI&sprefix=12t%2Cspecialty-aps%2C398&ref=nb_sb_noss_2 (from $150-ish)

 

18TB: https://www.amazon.com/s?k=18tb&i=specialty-aps&srs=12653393011&crid=39PQXN5YH27PK&sprefix=18t%2Cspecialty-aps%2C344&ref=nb_sb_noss_2 (from $280-ish)

 

 


Dochart
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  #3266315 30-Jul-2024 12:56
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toejam316:

I've been ordering drives from East Digital, they have a shopify and an ebay page. Pretty solid prices, free delivery. Manufacturer refurb, new drives and as-is server pulls. I've gotten 2 18TB drives from them with a third on the way, and a colleague got a 12TB from them.



https://east-digital.myshopify.com/

Is this the website you bought them from?

 
 
 

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toejam316
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  #3266318 30-Jul-2024 13:12
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Dochart:
toejam316:

I've been ordering drives from East Digital, they have a shopify and an ebay page. Pretty solid prices, free delivery. Manufacturer refurb, new drives and as-is server pulls. I've gotten 2 18TB drives from them with a third on the way, and a colleague got a 12TB from them.



https://east-digital.myshopify.com/

Is this the website you bought them from?

Yup, that's the one. The 18tb drive I mentioned has arrived today, too.




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Dochart
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  #3266331 30-Jul-2024 14:17
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Toejam316,

How long was shipping to NZ?

toejam316
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  #3266357 30-Jul-2024 15:23
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Ordered it on the 19th, it arrived today, which seems about right. My mates one arrived in just over a week.




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Handle9
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  #3267693 2-Aug-2024 18:59
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michaelmurfy:

amanzi:


Thanks for the heads-up - that's a pretty good deal. My gut feel is that the cost savings outweigh the risks, and if your NAS has sufficient redundancy then it reduces the risk further.


That's my thinking. Years ago I bought and shucked WD external drives that had WD "white label" drives inside, helium filled, almost the same as the WD Reds for twice the price. They're still going strong.


My server can have a single drive fail without data loss and the most important data is backed up anyway. I don't care if I lose my Linux ISO's as they're backed up online anyway.


But for when I need to upgrade I'll likely upgrade with reconditioned drives as these appear to be lasting well for people.



I run my production server with a hodge podge array of consumer and NAS drives which have had varying degrees of reliability. I've recently created a backup server using reconditioned enterprise drives. Given it's going to probably spin the drives up for 12 hours a week after the initial backup is done I think it's a perfectly reasonable compromise.

I had a 6 month old N300 drive fail yesterday, high quality drives fail as well. I''ll be sending it back for RMA but using new drives doesn't guarantee reliability.

Everything critical is backed up offsite to Backblaze. I'd rather have a proper 3 2 1 strategy using reconditioned drives than rely on "good" drives but not have a strong backup.

prob

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  #3267827 3-Aug-2024 11:17
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OP here. About returns. I purchased two drives from Amazon through the link in my original post. The promise from Amazon was free returns, viz:

 

 

 

Return this item for free

 

Free returns are available for the shipping address you chose. You can return the item for any reason in new and unused condition: no return shipping charges.

 

 

 

A poster above PM'ed me to say that Amazon only agreed to contribute $20 towards return post when one of his drives failed. 

 

 

 

Confusing. The situation may vary according to which Amazon site you use. Also, I got free delivery...


 
 
 
 

Shop now for Dell laptops and other devices (affiliate link).
Bewildered
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#3279640 7-Sep-2024 10:34
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I ordered three "factory refurbished" drives off ServerPartDeals.com directly. 

 

All three arrived in excellent condition and well packaged. All had had their SMART data full reset so no idea how long they've been running or if there had been any issues - so not ideal as it would have been nice to at least know the likely condition of the drive because it shouldn't report like a 'new' drive because it isn't new. 

 

Drives pre-cleared in Unraid (single pass, took long enough) and they ran fine for a week or so until I replaced my old SATA expansion card for an e-bay sourced LSI 9300-16i 16-Port 12Gb/s SAS/SATA HBA in IT Mode card (bought from bitsquad, fitted with Aliexpress cables so I could get the length/type I needed). This massively improved performance and is hands down the best $150 I've spent on this machine so far - can definitely recommend!

 

But, after a day of that card being installed one of the drives started throwing read errors, including SMART reporting that there were "uncorrectable errors". Unless I'm mistaken that points to a drive issue rather than a SAS/SATA issue...because this looks like a permanent physical sector-level thing rather than an intermittent fault like a dodgy cable. Plus, by this time it had written over 2TB already via the HBA so if there were material problems I would have expected a lot more issues right from the start, and or errors across multiple drives....and none should result in sectors being marked as bad. 

 

Anyway, the drive has been failed out and I am currently rebuilding the array on a spare drive. The failed drive is currently clearing and then I will send the drive back under RMA since I've had it for two weeks, expect that this will cost ~$100....free returns is only in North America.

 

Hopefully after that they will replace and return....apparently they will "conduct our intense in-house testing/inspection to determine the root cause of the issue" - so we shall see. 

 

Will keep you posted. 

 

 





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Bewildered
111 posts

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  #3285415 23-Sep-2024 12:53
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Just heard back from ServerPartDeals - drive was faulty and a refund has been arranged....shortly thereafter I got a notification from PayPal that $307 was on it's way back to my card.

 

There is no refund for the shipping back to the US, but the repayment is about 1/3 of the value of the order so it looks like there was a partial shipping refund for the original order. I'm left $62 out pocket of which $50 will be the shipping costs the US for the return, and the other $12 will be exchange rate differences and PayPal taking a BIG FAT cut of the FX transaction because they are about the worst when it comes to that!

 

Of course this doesn't replace the drive, and buying a new one will require paying for shipping again so that is only worth it if you buy several units at once! So, assuming the other drives last the distance that can wait until I run low on space again.

 

All in all a good experience I think - no quibble return, fast service, good communication, and money back. 😃

 

 





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Why does this always happen to me?


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