Formula 1 2025 Season Discussion

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#3392659 10-Jul-2025 11:13

thermonuclear:

Asteros:

I think it would be hilarious if Horner goes to Alpine. He would have to supplicate himself to Toto and Mercedes which would surely cause him much angst.

I really hope Max comes to Mercedes. I'm not confident because this surely increases the odds of him staying with Red Bull.

The move on Horner has to be motivated by ensuring Verstappen stays at Red Bull doesn't it? There's little to be gained by sacking Horner now if Max has already indicated he's walking at the end of the season.

Could definitely be taken that way, but also there was just so much baggage around Horner and where the teams headed in the last few years.
It may even be Max's departure that was the final straw if you view it in a slightly diffferent perspective as well.

tdgeek

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#3392734 10-Jul-2025 12:32

Jaxson:

thermonuclear:

Asteros:

I think it would be hilarious if Horner goes to Alpine. He would have to supplicate himself to Toto and Mercedes which would surely cause him much angst.

I really hope Max comes to Mercedes. I'm not confident because this surely increases the odds of him staying with Red Bull.

The move on Horner has to be motivated by ensuring Verstappen stays at Red Bull doesn't it? There's little to be gained by sacking Horner now if Max has already indicated he's walking at the end of the season.

Could definitely be taken that way, but also there was just so much baggage around Horner and where the teams headed in the last few years.
It may even be Max's departure that was the final straw if you view it in a slightly diffferent perspective as well.

I agree. Red Bull has been awesome, but they are downward slide, exacerbated by the departures of top talent. New power plant 2026. They had their day, others caught up, and then they lose talent, only one way to go. None of this helps RB21 lap times. Time to rebuild, and Max ain't waiting 5 years for that.

Max to Mercedes could have been the last straw.

thermonuclear

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#3392735 10-Jul-2025 12:32

Jaxson:

thermonuclear:

The move on Horner has to be motivated by ensuring Verstappen stays at Red Bull doesn't it? There's little to be gained by sacking Horner now if Max has already indicated he's walking at the end of the season.

Could definitely be taken that way, but also there was just so much baggage around Horner and where the teams headed in the last few years.
It may even be Max's departure that was the final straw if you view it in a slightly diffferent perspective as well.

Yes, I can see that, it's likely to be one of those two scenarios at any rate. I read somewhere that the former PA's day in court is now imminent. I can't imagine that's going to go well for Horner, given how steadfast and determined the PA has been in seeking redress and justice.

Will be checking out the Goodwood coverage on YouTube tonight, I will assume they have the live stream as in previous years. It will be interesting to see who is there representing Red Bull, perhaps Mekies will have to face the music. They are going to run the RB7 up the hill in VCARB livery apparently. Lawson will be behind the wheel at some point as well as David Coulthard and Patrick Friesacher.

I can't imagine Lawson will be too keen to be around the assembled media, given all this and his demonstrated ability to put his foot in his mouth sometimes.

langi27

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#3392737 10-Jul-2025 12:35

May be an image of text that says "HULKENBERG LANDO PIASTRI imgfital.com AA HULKENBERG 2"

tdgeek

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#3392738 10-Jul-2025 12:37

langi27:

Did you know that the Hulk has scored more points than Max since Spain? There would be a similar metric re Racing Bulls vs Red Bull I would think

thermonuclear

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#3392741 10-Jul-2025 12:50

Sauber/Audi are turning that franchise around, the recent speed has been impressive. Got a lot of time for Binotto, thought he was made a scapegoat for Ferrari's "italian way of doing things", I'm pleased to see him running the cutter and seemingly getting development of the car back on the right track. Hulkenberg could become the driver Alonso wants to be next year if Audi hits the ground running, the driver who would be challenging for the title if only he had the right equipment.

thermonuclear

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#3392743 10-Jul-2025 13:03

tdgeek:

Max to Mercedes could have been the last straw.

Plenty of rumour but the only semi-concrete thing sighted is that Mercedes CEO Ola Kallenius has given a "green light" to pursue Verstappen's signature. It does suggest that any potential deal is a fair way from being done. The buyout on Verstappen's Red Bull contract is apparently 102 million Euros before you even start talking about what you would have to pay him. Kallenius is saying the 102 is "no obstacle" but, even so, Mercedes are going to have to sell a heck of a lot of extra cars to fund the move.

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Jaxson

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#3392797 10-Jul-2025 14:03

From memory there was a media ban on the case with Horny and PA, but from memory that's not going to be the case with the private case so could get messy in public.

Yeah quick check and: a Reporting Restriction Order (RRO) was issued, effectively barring British media from reporting on the case's latest development, presumably requested by Horner's legal team to control the narrative and prevent further public discussion or speculation surrounding the case.

Idea being it could sway the outcome, but this will eventually be lifted when the case is heard, unless they finally settle beforehand.
So whilst it went quiet for a while, it didn't go away. Just another tick against him alongside loss of talent and poor performance,

The huge Max buyout number is a strange one in an era of cost caps. Teams still seem to be able to spend alot related to the sport, but presumanly not part of the cost cap areas.

thermonuclear

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#3392804 10-Jul-2025 14:36

I wonder what the English bookies were paying on Horner to be sacked before Lawson. Might have funded us all a trip to Spa-Francorchamps at the end of the month!

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#3392808 10-Jul-2025 14:45

Jaxson:

The huge Max buyout number is a strange one in an era of cost caps. Teams still seem to be able to spend alot related to the sport, but presumanly not part of the cost cap areas.

Driver salary is not included, presumably neither is contract buy out

GV27

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#3392814 10-Jul-2025 15:00

Batman:

Driver salary is not included, presumably neither is contract buy out

Driver salaries are indeed excluded, as would be nominated key personnel (Newey, Horner etc would have all been nominated key personnel).

Bung

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#3392816 10-Jul-2025 15:04

tdgeek:

Time to rebuild, and Max ain't waiting 5 years for that.

Hasn't Max already said he has no interest in sticking around for that long even if winning. He's more likely to jump to a team with a front running car than wait around.

Ragnor

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#3392819 10-Jul-2025 15:27

The longer George doesn't have a contract the more likely Max to Mercedes was the final straw.

tdgeek

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#3392896 10-Jul-2025 17:42

Jaxson:

From memory there was a media ban on the case with Horny and PA, but from memory that's not going to be the case with the private case so could get messy in public.

Yeah quick check and: a Reporting Restriction Order (RRO) was issued, effectively barring British media from reporting on the case's latest development, presumably requested by Horner's legal team to control the narrative and prevent further public discussion or speculation surrounding the case.

Idea being it could sway the outcome, but this will eventually be lifted when the case is heard, unless they finally settle beforehand.
So whilst it went quiet for a while, it didn't go away. Just another tick against him alongside loss of talent and poor performance,

The huge Max buyout number is a strange one in an era of cost caps. Teams still seem to be able to spend alot related to the sport, but presumanly not part of the cost cap areas.

Im not familiar with the cost caps, but is that around racing costs and not driver costs?

tdgeek

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#3392944 10-Jul-2025 17:47

Bung:

tdgeek:

Time to rebuild, and Max ain't waiting 5 years for that.

Hasn't Max already said he has no interest in sticking around for that long even if winning. He's more likely to jump to a team with a front running car than wait around.

Yep. The issue is the gamble in 2026 given that the ICE is better for some cars than others, but electric power is up by 300%. Max can gamble that the RBR/Ford will be ok enough, no guarantee that McLaren,Mercedes and Ferrari will nail it. So he could take 2026 as on off year, then he can choose the best team and be happy to waste 2025, which is already wasted, and 2026. Or take a punt on a one year deal with Mercedes, at least that gives him a 1 in 4 or better of landing in a top team.

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