Geekzone Rugby (Union) Discussion Thread

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#1407756 16-Oct-2015 11:32

networkn:
blair003:
networkn:
itxtme: Nope thats the "optimal" situation. Risk and reward, its worked well. our starting lineup and reserves is a very strong in-form team.

If NMS gets injured, then we move BS to Wing, Barrett to FB? Slade as backup to DC?

Would be interesting. If the rest of the back line is performing, I think they would just bring in Naholo for NMS and back him to perform. If for example DC had been under pressure/under performing they may rearrange the back line to bring in Barrett so they have a second play maker.

See this is what I mean, it's created a conundrum that doesn't happen, if you don't potentially have 2 players, in the squad underperforming, due to prior or ongoing injury. I don't see 2 "in form but injured" , or "previously inform and recovering from injury", players being the smart move.

I guess at the end of the day, let's hope no-one gets injured, or that perhaps Naholo finds international form if the worst occurs, I guess we will find out.

I am actually less worried about this, than I may actually seem, as I am less worried about the RWC than some, to me, it's far more important we are #1 the rest of the 4 years, but I'd still LOVE to win it.

Even if we lose on Sunday, I won't be calling for Hansen's head.

We have had 4 games, so we have seen enough of what we have going forward into the knock outs.

They have publicly stated the gamble they took naming the 31, or rather, dropping the 10. I think the gambles (in order of riskiness)
1 leave sopoaga and rely on carter
2 leave dagg and rely on barrett
3 leave piutau and rely on nms
4 leave jane (less injured) and take naholo (more injured)
Don't think there are any gambles on the forwards

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#1407761 16-Oct-2015 11:34

blair003:
networkn:
blair003:
networkn:
itxtme: Nope thats the "optimal" situation. Risk and reward, its worked well. our starting lineup and reserves is a very strong in-form team.

If NMS gets injured, then we move BS to Wing, Barrett to FB? Slade as backup to DC?

Would be interesting. If the rest of the back line is performing, I think they would just bring in Naholo for NMS and back him to perform. If for example DC had been under pressure/under performing they may rearrange the back line to bring in Barrett so they have a second play maker.

See this is what I mean, it's created a conundrum that doesn't happen, if you don't potentially have 2 players, in the squad underperforming, due to prior or ongoing injury. I don't see 2 "in form but injured" , or "previously inform and recovering from injury", players being the smart move.

I guess at the end of the day, let's hope no-one gets injured, or that perhaps Naholo finds international form if the worst occurs, I guess we will find out.

I am actually less worried about this, than I may actually seem, as I am less worried about the RWC than some, to me, it's far more important we are #1 the rest of the 4 years, but I'd still LOVE to win it.

Even if we lose on Sunday, I won't be calling for Hansen's head.

I think your expectations are too high. Naholo has been around for 5 minutes. He has bombed a try and scored a try nobody else in our team would have. He has not been tidy enough and was bundled into touch when he shouldn't have been. They haven't given him the space that they have given NMS, they have used him more in close a la Savea. Remember NMS bombed an easier try than the Naholo drop ball, and had you judged him on his performance in that game you would say hes not good enough and shouldn't have been selected.

Currently we have many players under performing - Read and Savea being the two most obvious examples. You are focusing on Naholo and TKB because you think it is their injuries causing them issues and therefore that is reason for them not to have been selected. Who cares why players are under performing? Is Read under performing because of earlier concussions? Should we have left him at home?

Tell you what. I've been having a whole week of withdrawal. Can't wait for Sunday and Monday.

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#1407763 16-Oct-2015 11:38

joker97:
They have publicly stated the gamble they took naming the 31, or rather, dropping the 10. I think the gambles (in order of riskiness)
1 leave sopoaga and rely on carter
2 leave dagg and rely on barrett
3 leave piutau and rely on nms
4 leave jane (less injured) and take naholo (more injured)
Don't think there are any gambles on the forwards

There is no way Sopoaga would of been taken in place of Carter, and rightly so.

blair003

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#1407768 16-Oct-2015 11:39

joker97:
blair003:
networkn:
blair003:
networkn:
itxtme: Nope thats the "optimal" situation. Risk and reward, its worked well. our starting lineup and reserves is a very strong in-form team.

If NMS gets injured, then we move BS to Wing, Barrett to FB? Slade as backup to DC?

Would be interesting. If the rest of the back line is performing, I think they would just bring in Naholo for NMS and back him to perform. If for example DC had been under pressure/under performing they may rearrange the back line to bring in Barrett so they have a second play maker.

See this is what I mean, it's created a conundrum that doesn't happen, if you don't potentially have 2 players, in the squad underperforming, due to prior or ongoing injury. I don't see 2 "in form but injured" , or "previously inform and recovering from injury", players being the smart move.

I guess at the end of the day, let's hope no-one gets injured, or that perhaps Naholo finds international form if the worst occurs, I guess we will find out.

I am actually less worried about this, than I may actually seem, as I am less worried about the RWC than some, to me, it's far more important we are #1 the rest of the 4 years, but I'd still LOVE to win it.

Even if we lose on Sunday, I won't be calling for Hansen's head.

I think your expectations are too high. Naholo has been around for 5 minutes. He has bombed a try and scored a try nobody else in our team would have. He has not been tidy enough and was bundled into touch when he shouldn't have been. They haven't given him the space that they have given NMS, they have used him more in close a la Savea. Remember NMS bombed an easier try than the Naholo drop ball, and had you judged him on his performance in that game you would say hes not good enough and shouldn't have been selected.

Currently we have many players under performing - Read and Savea being the two most obvious examples. You are focusing on Naholo and TKB because you think it is their injuries causing them issues and therefore that is reason for them not to have been selected. Who cares why players are under performing? Is Read under performing because of earlier concussions? Should we have left him at home?

Tell you what. I've been having a whole week of withdrawal. Can't wait for Sunday and Monday.

Ahh gutted, I had thought the game was tomorrow! Yes looking forward to it as well. Even if France do a France, I am interested to see if we have an answer.

blair003

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#1407772 16-Oct-2015 11:41

joker97:
networkn:
blair003:
networkn:
itxtme: Nope thats the "optimal" situation. Risk and reward, its worked well. our starting lineup and reserves is a very strong in-form team.

If NMS gets injured, then we move BS to Wing, Barrett to FB? Slade as backup to DC?

Would be interesting. If the rest of the back line is performing, I think they would just bring in Naholo for NMS and back him to perform. If for example DC had been under pressure/under performing they may rearrange the back line to bring in Barrett so they have a second play maker.

See this is what I mean, it's created a conundrum that doesn't happen, if you don't potentially have 2 players, in the squad underperforming, due to prior or ongoing injury. I don't see 2 "in form but injured" , or "previously inform and recovering from injury", players being the smart move.

I guess at the end of the day, let's hope no-one gets injured, or that perhaps Naholo finds international form if the worst occurs, I guess we will find out.

I am actually less worried about this, than I may actually seem, as I am less worried about the RWC than some, to me, it's far more important we are #1 the rest of the 4 years, but I'd still LOVE to win it.

Even if we lose on Sunday, I won't be calling for Hansen's head.

We have had 4 games, so we have seen enough of what we have going forward into the knock outs.

They have publicly stated the gamble they took naming the 31, or rather, dropping the 10. I think the gambles (in order of riskiness)
1 leave sopoaga and rely on carter
2 leave dagg and rely on barrett
3 leave piutau and rely on nms
4 leave jane (less injured) and take naholo (more injured)
Don't think there are any gambles on the forwards

All of the "gambles" you list would have been equally gambles had the other selection been made.

The biggest gamble was in the forwards - taking 3 specialist locks instead of 4. It remains to be seen how that will pan out.

networkn

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#1407773 16-Oct-2015 11:41

I think your expectations are too high. Naholo has been around for 5 minutes. He has bombed a try and scored a try nobody else in our team would have. He has not been tidy enough and was bundled into touch when he shouldn't have been. They haven't given him the space that they have given NMS, they have used him more in close a la Savea. Remember NMS bombed an easier try than the Naholo drop ball, and had you judged him on his performance in that game you would say hes not good enough and shouldn't have been selected.

Currently we have many players under performing - Read and Savea being the two most obvious examples. You are focusing on Naholo and TKB because you think it is their injuries causing them issues and therefore that is reason for them not to have been selected. Who cares why players are under performing? Is Read under performing because of earlier concussions? Should we have left him at home?

Comparing Read's selection to that of NMS and Naholo isn't really fair. Read has a proven track record, a lot of years experience, and is a pretty handy second choice as captain. Leaving him at home would have been MUCH worse for the team than leaving behind an injured TKB and Naholo. (I would potentially have taken 1 not 2).

Anyways both opinions have been put forward, I guess we need to wait and see what happens long term.

I actually still consider NMS a 75% certain choice as a long term winger for the AB's. He has done some good stuff, but for me very little that other wings historically have not. A good test this weekend will cement him for me, more. I generally am pretty slow to trust new players, 10 solid test performances is about my point.

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#1407776 16-Oct-2015 11:45

I don't see it as a matter of a "gamble" necessarily, as that implies you're only focused on the potential upside.

Part of selecting the squad (or most for of judgement, like buying a house or car), is considering both sides of the equation. It's not always a matter of what choice has the biggest (potential) upside, but also what has the lesser downside if it doesn't come off.

Regardless, the challenges of selecting a team are trying to predict and account for as many scenarios as you can - and give these considerations appropriate weighting relative to likelihood.

At least until Doc Browns arrives in a few days and we can see the future.

E + R = O

blair003

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#1407777 16-Oct-2015 11:47

networkn:

I think your expectations are too high. Naholo has been around for 5 minutes. He has bombed a try and scored a try nobody else in our team would have. He has not been tidy enough and was bundled into touch when he shouldn't have been. They haven't given him the space that they have given NMS, they have used him more in close a la Savea. Remember NMS bombed an easier try than the Naholo drop ball, and had you judged him on his performance in that game you would say hes not good enough and shouldn't have been selected.

Currently we have many players under performing - Read and Savea being the two most obvious examples. You are focusing on Naholo and TKB because you think it is their injuries causing them issues and therefore that is reason for them not to have been selected. Who cares why players are under performing? Is Read under performing because of earlier concussions? Should we have left him at home?

Comparing Read's selection to that of NMS and Naholo isn't really fair. Read has a proven track record, a lot of years experience, and is a pretty handy second choice as captain. Leaving him at home would have been MUCH worse for the team than leaving behind an injured TKB and Naholo. (I would potentially have taken 1 not 2).

Anyways both opinions have been put forward, I guess we need to wait and see what happens long term.

I actually still consider NMS a 75% certain choice as a long term winger for the AB's. He has done some good stuff, but for me very little that other wings historically. A good test this weekend will cement him for me, more. I generally am pretty slow to trust new players, 10 solid test performances is about my point.

Every decision has risks and rewards. I think they got the balance right, you don't, fair enough. Whatever happens, we will never know how individual selections contributed to the result and whether other selections would have resulted in different outcomes.

networkn

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#1407782 16-Oct-2015 11:52

blair003:
networkn:

I think your expectations are too high. Naholo has been around for 5 minutes. He has bombed a try and scored a try nobody else in our team would have. He has not been tidy enough and was bundled into touch when he shouldn't have been. They haven't given him the space that they have given NMS, they have used him more in close a la Savea. Remember NMS bombed an easier try than the Naholo drop ball, and had you judged him on his performance in that game you would say hes not good enough and shouldn't have been selected.

Currently we have many players under performing - Read and Savea being the two most obvious examples. You are focusing on Naholo and TKB because you think it is their injuries causing them issues and therefore that is reason for them not to have been selected. Who cares why players are under performing? Is Read under performing because of earlier concussions? Should we have left him at home?

Comparing Read's selection to that of NMS and Naholo isn't really fair. Read has a proven track record, a lot of years experience, and is a pretty handy second choice as captain. Leaving him at home would have been MUCH worse for the team than leaving behind an injured TKB and Naholo. (I would potentially have taken 1 not 2).

Anyways both opinions have been put forward, I guess we need to wait and see what happens long term.

I actually still consider NMS a 75% certain choice as a long term winger for the AB's. He has done some good stuff, but for me very little that other wings historically. A good test this weekend will cement him for me, more. I generally am pretty slow to trust new players, 10 solid test performances is about my point.

Every decision has risks and rewards. I think they got the balance right, you don't, fair enough. Whatever happens, we will never know how individual selections contributed to the result and whether other selections would have resulted in different outcomes.

Well that's true. To be fair I don't think they got it horribly wrong, I don't suspect it's so bad it will cost us the Cup, and I agree, the issue with sport, is you can't easily see what the other side of a selection choice is.

I think it's probably less about a particular player (or even 2), and more about whether we execute, sync together and adapt in game, to the other sides tactics.

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#1407810 16-Oct-2015 12:27

Uh-Oh, http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11530264

Last thing the ABs need is a French side without a coach (WC2011 final coming back to haunt me).

Wonder if it is just mind games?

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#1407823 16-Oct-2015 12:46

It's all mind games. They have successfully screwed with the ABs in their heads before, so why not try again.
Now whether or not they show up to play on Sunday I don't think the French even know themselves. But if they do, they have enough in them to beat anyone. The ABs better play properly.

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#1407824 16-Oct-2015 12:46

trig42: Uh-Oh, http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11530264

Last thing the ABs need is a French side without a coach (WC2011 final coming back to haunt me).

Wonder if it is just mind games?

Could be, I can do with out another 8-7, toss a coin for the winner match.

networkn

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#1407825 16-Oct-2015 12:48

joker97: It's all mind games. They have successfully screwed with the ABs in their heads before, so why not try again.
Now whether or not they show up to play on Sunday I don't think the French even know themselves. But if they do, they have enough in them to beat anyone. The ABs better play properly.

Agreed. This is all static.

networkn

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#1407826 16-Oct-2015 12:49

tdgeek:
trig42: Uh-Oh, http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11530264

Last thing the ABs need is a French side without a coach (WC2011 final coming back to haunt me).

Wonder if it is just mind games?

Could be, I can do with out another 8-7, toss a coin for the winner match.

Yah one of the most stressful nights of my life. The other was the game that got us to the final in Cricket!

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#1407839 16-Oct-2015 13:05

clevedon:
joker97:
They have publicly stated the gamble they took naming the 31, or rather, dropping the 10. I think the gambles (in order of riskiness)
1 leave sopoaga and rely on carter
2 leave dagg and rely on barrett
3 leave piutau and rely on nms
4 leave jane (less injured) and take naholo (more injured)
Don't think there are any gambles on the forwards

There is no way Sopoaga would of been taken in place of Carter, and rightly so.

Apparently not, according to Justin Marshall's chin wag with Grant Fox.

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