Watched a clip on CNN, the reporter says that the 737 went into a dive, levelled off at 10,000 feet, then dove again

tdgeek:

Video shows it last few hundred metres before impact

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Any failure of cabin pressurization above 10,000 feet (3,000 m) requires an emergency descent to 8,000 feet (2,400 m) or the closest to that while maintaining the Minimum Sector Altitude (MSA)

Oblivian: 10,000. Is safety zone (well, max one should endure) for rapid decompression to stop being knocked out/hypoxia

Believe auto failsafe and best place to work out wha-next.

Any failure of cabin pressurization above 10,000 feet (3,000 m) requires an emergency descent to 8,000 feet (2,400 m) or the closest to that while maintaining the Minimum Sector Altitude (MSA)

If the plane levelled out at 10K then it's unlikely pilot intentional suicide attempt I imagine. 

networkn:

 

If the plane levelled out at 10K then it's unlikely pilot intentional suicide attempt I imagine. 

 

There may have been a struggle in the cockpit, similar to the EgyptAir 767 crash. We simply won't know until some reliable evidence has been gathered. 

alasta:

 

networkn:

 

If the plane levelled out at 10K then it's unlikely pilot intentional suicide attempt I imagine. 

 

 

There may have been a struggle in the cockpit, similar to the EgyptAir 767 crash. We simply won't know until some reliable evidence has been gathered. 

 

The CNN clip showed that rather than levelling out at 10K (which would suggest that control was regained for a period of time) it stopped diving and immediately climbed to about 12K then dived again. You might assume that the change to climbing was an intentional thing, but it's also possible that it was a result of damage to the control surfaces due to overspeed in the dive... e.g. an elevator or tailplane partially separated in the dive and jammed in a position to raise the nose which caused the plane to come out of the dive and begin climbing, but then broke off completely when the aircraft slowed down.

But I'm leaning towards it being a pilot suicide. But, yes, we won't know until the investigation is done.

frankv:

 

But I'm leaning towards it being a pilot suicide. But, yes, we won't know until the investigation is done.

 

I remember across most of the developed world in the aftermath of the GermanWings crash that procedures were changed so that a single pilot can never be alone in the cockpit during flight. I wonder whether this policy was applied within Chinese airlines?

The level off or climb shown on FR24 may actually be pressure differences sensed by the pitot/static system caused by pressure waves due to the aircraft going supersonic in the descent. Taking the FR24 data on it's own isn't giving the whole picture.

There were three crew on the flight deck so it's unlikely for there to be just one pilot on the flight deck.

There have also been suggestions it may have hit a UAV, pure speculation I'd say.

The investigation could be hampered some what by the Chinese MIQ requirements that currently require up to 3 weeks of quarantine for people entering the country. This will impact the ability of Boeing, the FAA and the engine manufacturer to get representatives on site to help with the investigation.

alasta:

 

frankv:

 

But I'm leaning towards it being a pilot suicide. But, yes, we won't know until the investigation is done.

 

 

I remember across most of the developed world in the aftermath of the GermanWings crash that procedures were changed so that a single pilot can never be alone in the cockpit during flight. I wonder whether this policy was applied within Chinese airlines?

 

Even if this is the case, it only requires the suicidal pilot to incapacitate the other, easy enough to do, to have control of the cockpit.

Technofreak:

 

The investigation could be hampered some what by the Chinese MIQ requirements that currently require up to 3 weeks of quarantine for people entering the country. This will impact the ability of Boeing, the FAA and the engine manufacturer to get representatives on site to help with the investigation.

 

An exception will almost certainly be made, especially given insurance conditions probably require a manufacturer's representative to be able to inspect the site and wreckage within x number of hours.

networkn:

 

Technofreak:

 

The investigation could be hampered some what by the Chinese MIQ requirements that currently require up to 3 weeks of quarantine for people entering the country. This will impact the ability of Boeing, the FAA and the engine manufacturer to get representatives on site to help with the investigation.

 

 

An exception will almost certainly be made, especially given insurance conditions probably require a manufacturer's representative to be able to inspect the site and wreckage within x number of hours.

 

 

 

One might think so, but remember this is China we're talking about, the CCP play by their own rule book. The aircraft and possibly the engines are of US manufacture, in the current political climate over the Ukraine and Taiwan the Chinese may have reason to play hard to get.

Technofreak:

 

One might think so, but remember this is China we're talking about, the CCP play by their own rule book. The aircraft and possibly the engines are of US manufacture, in the current political climate over the Ukraine and Taiwan the Chinese may have reason to play hard to get.

 

I wouldn't expect it's an option. I expect on top of insurance, a number of CAA/FAA/Federal requirements for flying into other countries that require you to meet specific timeframes in the event of an Air Crash, or you could find yourself suspended from flying internationally. 

Time will tell, but I expect China will allow whomever they are required to in, pretty quickly.  I don't see there being any reason for them to be obstructive about unless it was shot down.

IIRC China invited the NTSB, but I think they have to as its an American made aircraft. It appears that common sense prevails. Its a China and US accident

Not ideal

The investigation is being led by China but the United States was invited to take part because the plane was designed and manufactured there.

However, the U.S. National Transportation Safety Board said on Wednesday it had not determined if investigators would travel to China given strict visa and quarantine requirements, and Chinese officials declined to say whether or when NTSB officials would be invited.

"Our work priority is still on search and rescue, and at the same time, carrying out evidence collection and fixation work in the early stage of accident investigation," said Zhu Tao, the CAAC's head of aviation safety.

"However, when we enter the accident investigation stage, we will invite relevant parties to participate in the accident investigation according to relevant regulations," he said.