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191 posts

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Topic # 191034 20-Jan-2016 16:38
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Heard this "rumour" about it a week or so ago, and it has been officially announced.  Singapore Airlines will launch a new, direct, same (wide body) plane service from Singapore to Wellington i, September, via Canberra.  It will apparently be the first international flight to/from Canberra International Airport, and the first direct, same plane service from Wellington to Asia.  

 

Flights will be operated 4 times a week, and times look great, allowing Wellingtonians (or anyone from around the centre of the Country really) to connect to it since it leave around 8:15pm.  Word across the Tasman have also suggested that with a 23:00 departure from Canberra to Singapore, some people from Sydney may even be interested to connect to it to get ti Singapore the next morning, ready for a full day of business/activities, given that SIA doesn't offer any late (evening/night) flights from Sydney to Singapore.

 

I for one will be excited to see a Singapore Airlines Boeing 777 at Welly airport. :)

 

News release: http://www.singaporeair.com/jsp/cms/en_UK/press_release_news/ne0316-160120.jsp

 

 

 

 

 

[Mod Edit: Moved to correct Sub-forum]


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BDFL - Memuneh
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  Reply # 1475716 20-Jan-2016 21:41
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  Reply # 1475730 20-Jan-2016 21:49
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freitasm:

How can it be a direct flight with a stop in Canberra?


 



Well, in airline / aviation terminology, direct flight means a same plane, service, using the same flight number throughout. Not to be confused with non-stop. Direct doesn't mean non-stop.

Take Air NZ's NZ1/2 from Auckland to London, via Los Angeles - that is a direct flight, but not non-stop.

 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 1475731 20-Jan-2016 21:52
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I was looking at flights to Canberra, because it looked like the only option to get my passport renewed for a while. And there was NO direct flights from NZ to Canberra. So I do believe that the Singapore Airlines flight will be the first.

 

Not a bad way to go to what looks like a pretty godforsaken city.





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  Reply # 1475751 20-Jan-2016 22:20
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wlgspotter:
freitasm:

 

How can it be a direct flight with a stop in Canberra?

 



Well, in airline / aviation terminology, direct flight means a same plane, service, using the same flight number throughout. Not to be confused with non-stop. Direct doesn't mean non-stop.

Take Air NZ's NZ1/2 from Auckland to London, via Los Angeles - that is a direct flight, but not non-stop.

 

Ooops, sorry. Missed the lack of non-stop.







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  Reply # 1475832 21-Jan-2016 07:24
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freitasm:

wlgspotter:
freitasm:


How can it be a direct flight with a stop in Canberra?




Well, in airline / aviation terminology, direct flight means a same plane, service, using the same flight number throughout. Not to be confused with non-stop. Direct doesn't mean non-stop.

Take Air NZ's NZ1/2 from Auckland to London, via Los Angeles - that is a direct flight, but not non-stop.


Ooops, sorry. Missed the lack of non-stop.



All good there Mauricio! :)

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  Reply # 1475845 21-Jan-2016 07:52
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It's something that's been on the cards for a long time, with a lot of media stories around over the 3-4 years about SQ wanting to start services to CBR and then fly to a NZ destination.

 

The big thing will really be if it has the support, there aren't a lot of reasons for people from Wellington (or anywhere else for that matter) to visit Canberra and trying to grow it as a tourist market will probably be pretty challenging. Pricewise flights aren't going to compete with direct flights to Sydney so it's not really going to be an option for a cheap way to get to Sydney.

 

It would be interesting to know a lot more details behind it, such as what freight loadings would be out of Wgtn (does anybody send products to Asia?) and whether there will be restrictions on pax or freight loadings due to the runway. Clearly on minimum fuel is required to get to Aussie, but on occasions even Qantas (and probably Air NZ) have put freight before passengers out of Wellington on 737's and bumped pax to carry freight.

 

I guess we'll just have to wait and see whether it gets support and stays..


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  Reply # 1475887 21-Jan-2016 09:06
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I lived in Canberra for several years in the late 80s/early 90s and wished there was a direct flight from Canberra to Wellington then. Now I'm struggling to think why anybody (apart from politicians perhaps) would be interested...


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  Reply # 1475909 21-Jan-2016 09:33
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sbiddle:

 

It's something that's been on the cards for a long time, with a lot of media stories around over the 3-4 years about SQ wanting to start services to CBR and then fly to a NZ destination.

 

... there aren't a lot of reasons for people from Wellington (or anywhere else for that matter) to visit Canberra ...

 

 

 

 

Unless you work for the government

 

At the moment, going to Canberra for a meeting requires me to catch a 3pm flight (Shuttle pick-up from the office at noon) to Sydney in a squeezy-packed single aisle, suffer the hell that is Sydney International Arrivals, trek from Sydney International to Domestic, wait around and then catch a cramped and noisy turboprop to Canberra, arriving at dinner time. It's worse going the other way because the two-hour time difference works against you.

 

Now I will be able to put in a full day's work, then travel direct in a comfy widebody (Singapore are still running their 777s as 9-abreast in economy laughing), and arrive in Canberra in time for bed.

 

 

 

Yes Please!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


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  Reply # 1475957 21-Jan-2016 10:19
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PolicyGuy:

 

sbiddle:

 

It's something that's been on the cards for a long time, with a lot of media stories around over the 3-4 years about SQ wanting to start services to CBR and then fly to a NZ destination.

 

... there aren't a lot of reasons for people from Wellington (or anywhere else for that matter) to visit Canberra ...

 

 

 

 

Unless you work for the government

 

At the moment, going to Canberra for a meeting requires me to catch a 3pm flight (Shuttle pick-up from the office at noon) to Sydney in a squeezy-packed single aisle, suffer the hell that is Sydney International Arrivals, trek from Sydney International to Domestic, wait around and then catch a cramped and noisy turboprop to Canberra, arriving at dinner time. It's worse going the other way because the two-hour time difference works against you.

 

Now I will be able to put in a full day's work, then travel direct in a comfy widebody (Singapore are still running their 777s as 9-abreast in economy laughing), and arrive in Canberra in time for bed.

 

 

 

Yes Please!

 

 

 

 

 

That's fine for the small numbers of people that need that. How many people fit in that category? Under 5 per day? That's only another 250ish seats they need to sell on every flight to get a reasonable yield from the flight!

 

Based on stats from a couple of years ago the number of people connecting to Europe from Wellington via existing Air NZ services (going via AKL) was around 20 per day so you could conclude some will opt to fly via SIN. You'll also get some pax to SIN who would have flown via AKL or CHC that will not pick up the service but once again I'd be surprised if that exceeded 20 per day. There are still a lot of seats to fill.

 

Clearly lots of research goes into such a flight and you'd hope that the pax numbers are really there to keep it going.

 

 




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  Reply # 1475985 21-Jan-2016 11:17
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sbiddle:

 

PolicyGuy:

 

sbiddle:

 

It's something that's been on the cards for a long time, with a lot of media stories around over the 3-4 years about SQ wanting to start services to CBR and then fly to a NZ destination.

 

... there aren't a lot of reasons for people from Wellington (or anywhere else for that matter) to visit Canberra ...

 

 

 

 

Unless you work for the government

 

At the moment, going to Canberra for a meeting requires me to catch a 3pm flight (Shuttle pick-up from the office at noon) to Sydney in a squeezy-packed single aisle, suffer the hell that is Sydney International Arrivals, trek from Sydney International to Domestic, wait around and then catch a cramped and noisy turboprop to Canberra, arriving at dinner time. It's worse going the other way because the two-hour time difference works against you.

 

Now I will be able to put in a full day's work, then travel direct in a comfy widebody (Singapore are still running their 777s as 9-abreast in economy laughing), and arrive in Canberra in time for bed.

 

 

 

Yes Please!

 

 

 

 

 

That's fine for the small numbers of people that need that. How many people fit in that category? Under 5 per day? That's only another 250ish seats they need to sell on every flight to get a reasonable yield from the flight!

 

Based on stats from a couple of years ago the number of people connecting to Europe from Wellington via existing Air NZ services (going via AKL) was around 20 per day so you could conclude some will opt to fly via SIN. You'll also get some pax to SIN who would have flown via AKL or CHC that will not pick up the service but once again I'd be surprised if that exceeded 20 per day. There are still a lot of seats to fill.

 

Clearly lots of research goes into such a flight and you'd hope that the pax numbers are really there to keep it going.

 

 

 

 

 

 

All very valid points and arguments as to why the service would and wouldn't be a success.  SQ are an airline that has been known to no do it for "prestige" reasons, therefore they must have done their market surveys and research well and are comfortable with their offering.  Of course sometimes you wouldn't know until you start, and SQ has been known to make some "errors" and they quickly pull the plug ones a route is not to be not profitable  (i.e. SIN-HKG-LAS and SIN-AMS-ORD comes to mind, but that could be due partly to the Sept 2011 attacks that affected the airline travel industry as a whole).

 

What I find interesting is that they've gone for a slightly more premium heavy config of using their retrofitted Regional B772ERs vs an A330.  I'm also guessing that the 777 has more belly cargo haul capability compared to an A330, but not sure if there will be any restrictions placed of loadings (and MTOW) coming out of Wellington, especially on a given windy day.

 

 

 

Only time will tell how successful the route will be I guess.  I do find it intriguing, but exciting at the same time! :)


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  Reply # 1476018 21-Jan-2016 11:45
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wlgspotter:

 

hat I find interesting is that they've gone for a slightly more premium heavy config of using their retrofitted Regional B772ERs vs an A330.  I'm also guessing that the 777 has more belly cargo haul capability compared to an A330, but not sure if there will be any restrictions placed of loadings (and MTOW) coming out of Wellington, especially on a given windy day.

 

 

I would suspect there would be, as WLG runways are actually too short to support takeoff of a fully laden 777.

 

My understanding from reading business news on this one is that SQ are hoping to pitch Canberra and Wellington as "different" destinations to Asians who are growing bored of visiting Sydney/Melbourne/Gold Coast. The CBR-WLG was because it was the only way they could make the numbers stack up and the route viable. (The 777 choice was definitely because of the greater number of J class seats. Or C rather, because it's *A). On another note, this is the only way to get to Canberra on Star Alliance flights, and moreover to actually get status points out of it. I'm curious how many APD/SP you'll get on this flight (Air NZ haven't loaded it into the Points calculator yet). And as an added bonus, you can convert Velocity points to KrisFlyer miles so you can actually fly direct CBR-WLG on an award ticket.

 

Shiny.

 

 




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  Reply # 1476049 21-Jan-2016 12:21
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Kyanar:

 

wlgspotter:

 

hat I find interesting is that they've gone for a slightly more premium heavy config of using their retrofitted Regional B772ERs vs an A330.  I'm also guessing that the 777 has more belly cargo haul capability compared to an A330, but not sure if there will be any restrictions placed of loadings (and MTOW) coming out of Wellington, especially on a given windy day.

 

 

I would suspect there would be, as WLG runways are actually too short to support takeoff of a fully laden 777.

 

My understanding from reading business news on this one is that SQ are hoping to pitch Canberra and Wellington as "different" destinations to Asians who are growing bored of visiting Sydney/Melbourne/Gold Coast. The CBR-WLG was because it was the only way they could make the numbers stack up and the route viable. (The 777 choice was definitely because of the greater number of J class seats. Or C rather, because it's *A). On another note, this is the only way to get to Canberra on Star Alliance flights, and moreover to actually get status points out of it. I'm curious how many APD/SP you'll get on this flight (Air NZ haven't loaded it into the Points calculator yet). And as an added bonus, you can convert Velocity points to KrisFlyer miles so you can actually fly direct CBR-WLG on an award ticket.

 

Shiny.

 

 

 

 

True re the "MTOW" - I shouldn't have used MTOW "as-is" as I know WLG can't support a fully laden 777 taking off from its sub 2000m runway, otherwise a non-stop WLG-SIN (or Asia) flight would have been possible.  I was more referring to what is the maximum takeoff weight possible on a B777 from WLG's runway complete with the fuel load to CBR...

 

Anyway, yes re the 2nd part of your post in APD/SP - it will be interesting to see the numbers for those indeed.


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  Reply # 1476068 21-Jan-2016 12:35
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Guess this will now be the excuse to extend the wellington airport runway.  Who's gonna pay??





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  Reply # 1476128 21-Jan-2016 13:31
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Interesting reading that press release as we were told yesterday that they'd be using A330's. There's been a lot of activity going on at the airport recently to monitor pax flow through AvSec/Customs (departures) and Customs/MPI (arrivals) which I've no doubt will be related to this. Also, the expansion work being undertaken is going to see a number of areas reconfigured over the next year.

 

In terms of the "not many will go to Canberra" argument, possibly not, but plenty already go to Singapore and a direct service to there will quite likely end up being well utilised. Singapore is also a cheap gateway into other parts of Asia.


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  Reply # 1476364 21-Jan-2016 19:51
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A significant portion of parts dispatch from SG. Maybe they will make it up in airfreight.

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