Our new coalition government.

To post in this sub-forum you must have made 100 posts or have Trust status or have completed our ID Verification

Forums › Politics › Our new coalition government.

1 | ... | 95 | 96 | 97 | 98 | 99 | 100 | 101 | 102 | 103 | 104 | 105 | ... | 182

5896 posts

Uber Geek

#2257272 13-Jun-2019 10:52

tdgeek:

One side has 9 years, =0. Lets see what happens here

It's not 0 years. It's almost 2.

By your logic, National's nine is really 7 because they had 9 years of the Clark Govt to unpick.

And then throw some earthquakes and other natural disasters into the mix. So be generous, and say we're down to six.

You can see how silly this gets when you're determined to make excuses for people over and over again.

Unfortunately for Labour, we have an election next year. Radical transformational government that has a three-year stick/stick/carrot cycle?

Nothing radical or transformational about that.

tdgeek

29740 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2257277 13-Jun-2019 11:09

GV27:

tdgeek:

One side has 9 years, =0. Lets see what happens here

It's not 0 years. It's almost 2.

By your logic, National's nine is really 7 because they had 9 years of the Clark Govt to unpick.

And then throw some earthquakes and other natural disasters into the mix. So be generous, and say we're down to six.

You can see how silly this gets when you're determined to make excuses for people over and over again.

Unfortunately for Labour, we have an election next year. Radical transformational government that has a three-year stick/stick/carrot cycle?

Nothing radical or transformational about that.

The quote was RMA is being reviewed now by both sides. One side has 9 years, =0. Lets see what happens here

The 0 is =0, which is the change made to the RMA in 9 years. Yes they did a tweak but that didnt change the flaws RMA has

EQ we apparently had plenty JK said. Wrong. But we borrowed, so all ok.

I wouldn't say excuses. Unless National can hide behind everything and use that to explain why everything remained stagnant? I cant say they didnt follow through their policies as they literally had none. They campaigned against Clark with literally no policies, just change

Right now Im prepared to see what happens. Transformational? Thats marketing. Now you say Radical Transformation? Hadn't read that yet :-) But there has been some clear social changes, compared to National thats probably somewhat transformational. But in any case, they are doing things, thats better than nothing. On would hope that from here on, they will become more steadier than past mistakes and fumbles has shown . Thats my hope.

GV27

5896 posts

Uber Geek

#2257283 13-Jun-2019 11:18

tdgeek:

Right now Im prepared to see what happens. Transformational? Thats marketing. Now you say Radical Transformation? Hadn't read that yet :-) But there has been some clear social changes, compared to National thats probably somewhat transformational. But in any case, they are doing things, thats better than nothing. On would hope that from here on, they will become more steadier than past mistakes and fumbles has shown . Thats my hope.

Call me cynical, but I can't pay my bills, feed a family or catch light rail to work instead of being stuck in congestion using 'marketing'.

When businesses do it, it's called 'Bait & Switch'.

Bluntz

29 posts

Geek
Inactive user

#2257309 13-Jun-2019 11:44

tdgeek:

GV27:

tdgeek:

One side has 9 years, =0. Lets see what happens here

It's not 0 years. It's almost 2.

By your logic, National's nine is really 7 because they had 9 years of the Clark Govt to unpick.

And then throw some earthquakes and other natural disasters into the mix. So be generous, and say we're down to six.

You can see how silly this gets when you're determined to make excuses for people over and over again.

Unfortunately for Labour, we have an election next year. Radical transformational government that has a three-year stick/stick/carrot cycle?

Nothing radical or transformational about that.

The quote was RMA is being reviewed now by both sides. One side has 9 years, =0. Lets see what happens here

The 0 is =0, which is the change made to the RMA in 9 years. Yes they did a tweak but that didnt change the flaws RMA has

EQ we apparently had plenty JK said. Wrong. But we borrowed, so all ok.

I wouldn't say excuses. Unless National can hide behind everything and use that to explain why everything remained stagnant? I cant say they didnt follow through their policies as they literally had none. They campaigned against Clark with literally no policies, just change

Right now Im prepared to see what happens. Transformational? Thats marketing. Now you say Radical Transformation? Hadn't read that yet :-) But there has been some clear social changes, compared to National thats probably somewhat transformational. But in any case, they are doing things, thats better than nothing. On would hope that from here on, they will become more steadier than past mistakes and fumbles has shown . Thats my hope.

Your memory seems to be selective!

National tried many times to make adjustment to the RMA but could never get the numbers to pass legislation. They were a minority Government after all. It was one of the biggest frustrations Key faced (according to Key).

Bluntz

29 posts

Geek
Inactive user

#2257310 13-Jun-2019 11:46

GV27:

tdgeek:

Right now Im prepared to see what happens. Transformational? Thats marketing. Now you say Radical Transformation? Hadn't read that yet :-) But there has been some clear social changes, compared to National thats probably somewhat transformational. But in any case, they are doing things, thats better than nothing. On would hope that from here on, they will become more steadier than past mistakes and fumbles has shown . Thats my hope.

Call me cynical, but I can't pay my bills, feed a family or catch light rail to work instead of being stuck in congestion using 'marketing'.

When businesses do it, it's called 'Bait & Switch'.

I see Julie Anne Genter has backed down from her stance to reduce the speed on the majority of our state highways and is now proposing to dramatically increase the number of speed cameras. Makes me so confused as for a country our size to still only have 2 laned SH1 over a lot of the North Island is crazy in 2019.

tdgeek

29740 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2257322 13-Jun-2019 11:50

The election will be interesting. There needs to be detailed policies from both sides, something that National isn't comfy with, and unlike last campaign, Labour has to give detail on its next term

Yes, transformation is just a term, but also the days of what is your policy? We will provide growth to NZ. Great, how will you do that? We will provide growth to NZ. :-) Still makes me chuckle, as it does when a tricky question is asked, and we just get a smile. JK at his best. I think the people want more now, I think they want a plan, not wordy speeches that are just hopes and dreams. This goes for both sides.

But you cant fix everything

tdgeek

29740 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2257325 13-Jun-2019 11:55

Bluntz:

Your memory seems to be selective!

National tried many times to make adjustment to the RMA but could never get the numbers to pass legislation. They were a minority Government after all. It was one of the biggest frustrations Key faced (according to Key).

As you already know they had the option in at least the first term. Simon said not that long ago they should have done it then. Also, to have partners that stop you fixing a fatally flawed product is not great. Its not a left vs right issue, its a problem

Equinox IT

Cloud spending continues to surge globally, but most organisations haven’t made the changes necessary to maximise the value and cost-efficiency benefits of their cloud investments. Download the whitepaper From Overspend to Advantage now.

tdgeek

29740 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2257329 13-Jun-2019 11:58

Bluntz:

I see Julie Anne Genter has backed down from her stance to reduce the speed on the majority of our state highways and is now proposing to dramatically increase the number of speed cameras. Makes me so confused as for a country our size to still only have 2 laned SH1 over a lot of the North Island is crazy in 2019.

Our size? We are a VERY lightly populated country, exacerbated by being spread far and wide. We have a limited set of funds. We could have tolls on new road infrastructure but we don't want taxes we want tax cuts, which further adds to the problem

Bluntz

29 posts

Geek
Inactive user

#2257337 13-Jun-2019 12:06

tdgeek:

Bluntz:

Your memory seems to be selective!

National tried many times to make adjustment to the RMA but could never get the numbers to pass legislation. They were a minority Government after all. It was one of the biggest frustrations Key faced (according to Key).

As you already know they had the option in at least the first term. Simon said not that long ago they should have done it then. Also, to have partners that stop you fixing a fatally flawed product is not great. Its not a left vs right issue, its a problem

Wrong again. Their coalition partners refused to support a change.

tdgeek

29740 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2257342 13-Jun-2019 12:17

Couple of quotes, and I will look later for the article where Simon categorically said what I mentioned.

I think that minister was Nick Smith. He was probably National’s biggest problem with failing RMA reform and letting the housing problems escalate.

Yet, all the while, right up to the eleventh hour, UnitedFuture and Act were putting up separate proposals to the Government for possible changes to streamline the way the RMA operated, and to remove perceived procedural roadblocks. UnitedFuture even suggested bringing the provision of affordable housing into the objectives of the RMA but that was rejected because we would not agree to National’s planned watering down of the RMA’s principles and objectives.

https://yournz.org/2019/02/05/bridges-urges-rma-reform-now-but-national-blew-it-while-in-government/

tdgeek

29740 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2257345 13-Jun-2019 12:19

He has also admitted that National should have done more to pass RMA legislation in its first term in Government between 2008 and 2011.

https://www.interest.co.nz/news/95366/opposition-leader-simon-bridges-says-national-will-have-%E2%80%98significant%E2%80%99-rma-bill-ready-some

Not the article I had read with more detail, but. Opportunity lost and all that

GV27

5896 posts

Uber Geek

#2257347 13-Jun-2019 12:22

tdgeek:

He has also admitted that National should have done more to pass RMA legislation in its first term in Government between 2008 and 2011.

https://www.interest.co.nz/news/95366/opposition-leader-simon-bridges-says-national-will-have-%E2%80%98significant%E2%80%99-rma-bill-ready-some

Not the article I had read with more detail, but. Opportunity lost and all that

You were just arguing we can't judge the current govt after nine years of National. Which is it?

tdgeek

29740 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2257354 13-Jun-2019 12:29

GV27:

tdgeek:

He has also admitted that National should have done more to pass RMA legislation in its first term in Government between 2008 and 2011.

https://www.interest.co.nz/news/95366/opposition-leader-simon-bridges-says-national-will-have-%E2%80%98significant%E2%80%99-rma-bill-ready-some

Not the article I had read with more detail, but. Opportunity lost and all that

You were just arguing we can't judge the current govt after nine years of National. Which is it?

I said they spent 9 years for zero result on RMA. Someone said they could not have changed RMA as they were a minoroty Govt, Ive just shown they could have, but they didnt. And their partners who get blamed wanted more but National wanted the watered down version.

GV27

5896 posts

Uber Geek

#2257459 13-Jun-2019 15:32

tdgeek:

I said they spent 9 years for zero result on RMA. Someone said they could not have changed RMA as they were a minoroty Govt, Ive just shown they could have, but they didnt. And their partners who get blamed wanted more but National wanted the watered down version.

You're excusing Labour for not following through on their promises, despite having a majority Government because they're only two years in.

You don't seem to want to give National the same opportunity to get their feet under the desk. Their first term was from 2008 to 2011; during which there were two stonkingly massive earthquakes.

I thought you couldn't expect Governments to fix everything immediately after "nine years of neglect"?

tdgeek

29740 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2257463 13-Jun-2019 15:42

GV27:

tdgeek:

I said they spent 9 years for zero result on RMA. Someone said they could not have changed RMA as they were a minoroty Govt, Ive just shown they could have, but they didnt. And their partners who get blamed wanted more but National wanted the watered down version.

You're excusing Labour for not following through on their promises, despite having a majority Government because they're only two years in.

You don't seem to want to give National the same opportunity to get their feet under the desk. Their first term was from 2008 to 2011; during which there were two stonkingly massive earthquakes.

I thought you couldn't expect Governments to fix everything immediately after "nine years of neglect"?

Im not excusing Labour. I have often admitted missteps etc. RMA was an apparently big deal. If there were 2 EQ's that doesn't mean everything is shelved. Particularly of they didn't have any hard policies that they have to deal with. And as my looks showed, their partners wanted RMA, but National wanted the watered down version, that covers off 2011 onwards. I assume as that affects their business voters. In reality it was National that faltered, and over their entire reign. They didnt want it in fact.

1 | ... | 95 | 96 | 97 | 98 | 99 | 100 | 101 | 102 | 103 | 104 | 105 | ... | 182