The politicisation of NZ's covid response

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Forums › Politics › The politicisation of NZ's covid response

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#2867374 13-Feb-2022 09:27

Ge0rge: For a start, there are laws in NZ that prevent our military being used against our own population.

There are laws that say you can't ignore a trespass notice or gather in numbers without following the Covid rules too.

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#2867406 13-Feb-2022 11:20

Not to mention that they are allowed and in fact have been for some time used to assist the police. There's an entire section in one of the defense laws about it from memory

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#2867413 13-Feb-2022 11:54

In addition to the good story on Newsroom about alt-right taking over this demonstration, then we see the racist, alt-right Gadsden flag in the crowds:

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#2867453 13-Feb-2022 12:40

Just had an email alert from Metlink that the Wellington Railway Station toilets are out due to vandalism. How are they getting away with it?

GV27

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#2867463 13-Feb-2022 13:01

I'm just glad the consequences of not dealing with these dickheads when it was the Auckland Domain weekend after weekend is now falling on Wellington's shoulders, instead of being something that was only in Auckland and therefore out of sight, out of mind.

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#2867467 13-Feb-2022 13:12

Yeah but the image of Army/Police (which is what it will take) will get them more support, just like police rolling thru Auckland domain would have done. Let them burn themselves out with infighting and illness. I do chuckle tho that they 1 faction have implemented their own mandates at their anti-mandate protest:

[Edit (MF): This is from Canberra]

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#2867468 13-Feb-2022 13:14

Ge0rge: For a start, there are laws in NZ that prevent our military being used against our own population.

Can you tell us more about the details of this?

For example an armoured vehicle was used in the case of the Napier siege so it would appear army resources can be used in some circumstances.

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#2867469 13-Feb-2022 13:20

elpenguino:
Ge0rge: For a start, there are laws in NZ that prevent our military being used against our own population.

Can you tell us more about the details of this?

For example an armoured vehicle was used in the case of the Napier siege so it would appear army resources can be used in some circumstances.

It's a very fine line, and I'm not a lawyer.

In regards to the Napier event - yes, a LAV was used to recover the body of the murdered policeman. It wasn't used offensively against the gunman, moreover purely to provide cover to those going forward. The difference is subtle, but significant - the military was not used against an NZ citizen.

The Defence Act explains when are where the Military can provide assistance to a public service or civil power in more detail. and it involves a pretty significant step being taken by the PM:

(4) Where the Prime Minister or, if the Prime Minister is unavailable, the next most senior Minister available is satisfied, on information supplied by the Commissioner of Police or a Deputy Commissioner of Police,—

(a) either—

(i) that there is in New Zealand an emergency in which one or more persons are threatening to kill or seriously injure, or are causing or attempting to cause the death of or serious injury to, any other person, or are causing or attempting to cause the destruction of or serious damage to any property; or

(ii) that such an emergency is imminent; and

(b) that the emergency cannot be dealt with by the Police without the assistance of members of the Armed Forces exercising powers that are available to constables,—

the Prime Minister or the other Minister may authorise any part of the Armed Forces so to assist the Police in dealing with the emergency.

I freely admit my initial statement was not 100% correct.

(Edit - formatting)

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#2867482 13-Feb-2022 14:07

Beccara:

Yeah but the image of Army/Police (which is what it will take) will get them more support, just like police rolling thru Auckland domain would have done. Let them burn themselves out with infighting and illness. I do chuckle tho that they 1 faction have implemented their own mandates at their anti-mandate protest:

Not the highest level of literacy on display there even allowing for fat fingers on a small touch screen.

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#2867493 13-Feb-2022 14:30

Beccara:

Yeah but the image of Army/Police (which is what it will take) will get them more support, just like police rolling thru Auckland domain would have done. Let them burn themselves out with infighting and illness.

So in other words, not face any consequences for their actions? Nah, we've already tried that in the Domain. We ended up here. What's next?

I have vulnerable family members. This is not just a laugh to me. These is a bunch of people who are strongly and loudly opting out of social contract when it comes to knowingly spreading a communicable disease.

It's about time there were meaningful consequences for their actions. After all, what better way to reinforce their right to make a choice then upholding the consequences for choosing to be a dick.

Send in the tanks.

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#2867542 13-Feb-2022 14:40

GV27:

So in other words, not face any consequences for their actions? Nah, we've already tried that in the Domain. We ended up here. What's next?

I have vulnerable family members. This is not just a laugh to me. These is a bunch of people who are strongly and loudly opting out of social contract when it comes to knowingly spreading a communicable disease.

It's about time there were meaningful consequences for their actions. After all, what better way to reinforce their right to make a choice then upholding the consequences for choosing to be a dick.

Send in the tanks.

Rolling in brute force is not the answer, you think tanks make this go away? you think they are going to stop running no-mandate businesses? Some pepper spray and batons will make them put on a mask? Some if not alot are already seeing meaningful consequences; they lost jobs/friends and family. This whole convoy is the result of mandate consequences (excluding add-ons like FARC etc).

I'm in L4 restrictions currently for work and for compromised family, I've gone into known covid infected rooms for work. I dont like them but making them martyrs is not the answer

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#2867549 13-Feb-2022 14:50

Fails to adhear to these rules will mean that you might get enjected from the freedom camp.

I understand this to mean the freedom camp leaders will vaccinate all the rule breakers.

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#2867550 13-Feb-2022 14:53

Beccara:

I'm in L4 restrictions currently for work and for compromised family, I've gone into known covid infected rooms for work. I dont like them but making them martyrs is not the answer

How is consistently letting these idiots get away with it working out for us? All we're getting is escalation and one group of society increasingly evading the rule of law.

What is the end-game here? These people get to go away and feel like they only ever have to follow laws they like? How is that fair on Kiwis who have busted their asses trying to keep businesses afloat and obey lockdown rules?

If they want to matyr themselves for their own stupidity then let them. We spent over a hundred days locked down in Auckland, it boils my blood to see the hands-off approach being taken when criminal trespassers use parliamentary grounds as a platform for misinformation and our leaders are nowhere to be seen.

E: If melting down and civil disobedience is their response to the consequences of choices they've made by not getting vaccinated, then they're not protesting the mandates or freedom. They're protesting having to follow the same rules that were good enough for everyone else. They just don't like the consequences of their choice. They got to make a decision, they made it, they don't like the outcome.... well... tough.

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#2867603 13-Feb-2022 15:11

We didn't get here overnight and we won't get out of it overnight. This has been brewing in one form or another for a long time.

The "podium of truth" has been anything but and the actions we have seen over the last few days is partly a backlash to the inconsistencies that have come from that podium which in itself is a key part of the politicisation of the Covid response.

While I don't support them I believe some of the protesters have protested appropriately but the event has been hijacked by people with much more extreme objectives. I don't agree for one moment with the way this latter group have acted.

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#2867607 13-Feb-2022 15:29

Some decades in the future someone might use this as part of a comedy.

So a protest that is anti any number of public heath measures, including simply wearing a mask, in name of freedum.

Then they announce they will eject people from their camp not complying with their infection control measures !
No one dies of Footrot or Pinkeye ?

Of course vaccination center in the area had staff harassed as well as any business trying to support scanning and masking.
Having to close where past protests over years they were free to trade.

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