Donald Trump, US President #47, US President #45, convicted felon, twice impeached, four times indicted, liable of rape, convicted for financial fraud, guilty of hiding hush money payments to porn actress in attempt to influence 2016 elections

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Forums › Politics › Donald Trump, US President #47, US President #45, convicted felon, twice impeached, four times indicted, liable of rape, convicted for financial fraud, guilty of hiding hush money payments to porn actress in attempt to influence 2016 elections

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networkn

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#3339127 4-Feb-2025 15:50

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gzt:

The market for fentanyl is very well established in USA. The suction power of that established market is immense, and fentanyl is very very concentrated making it easy to transport.

In any case, the sudden pivot to say the tariffs are really about fentanyl that is good PR work,

after crashing the markets first.. 📉

I guess that's one way to view it. I think it was the plan all along. It was a guaranteed way to bring those people to the bargaining table.

I am not one of the ones who prescribe to the Donald Trump is an Idiot mantra.

As I think was alluded to above, the question is whether he will try and milk Canada and Mexico for even more.

It was a big win for him, he should take that win.

neb

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#3339129 4-Feb-2025 16:02

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Bit of a generic link for Trump stuff, but the Leopards eating people's faces Reddit.

wellygary

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#3339137 4-Feb-2025 16:20

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neb:

Trump has just shut down USAID, one of the few genuinely good things the US government actually does.

As much as Trump is a bozo,

They are rolling USAID into the state department to give more political control over it...

FWIW: Its what NZ did in 2009

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/30780/ngos-against-mfat-control-of-foreign-aid

Also the birthright citizenship thing, again its exactly what NZ did in 2005,

https://www.dia.govt.nz/press.nsf/07bac755caadc0f8cc256c94000d3ed5/bf4575b86e9b8ab5cc2570d00016d05a!OpenDocument

networkn

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#3339188 4-Feb-2025 16:29

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tdgeek:

What you are saying does make a lot of sense. However, Trump assumes the problems are caused by Mexico and Canada. Both of those countries do things to combat fentanyl and immigration exports. What does the US do to combat fentanyl and immigration imports? As while its Mexico/Canada's "fault" that these two issues flow into the US, its also up to the US to combat them at the border.

Yes, he is and has always has been a marketing genius, albeit with pseudo force rather than the art of the deal

The problems don't need to be completely solved, just improved a measureable amount. 100% this reduces the problem a measurable amount.

It won't be the only measure being taken, but even on it's own, it's getting enforcement at little cost to the US.

Trump isn't stupid. Neither was Bush.

I wish he would stop his sentences about half way through them though. He would be a lot more Presidential that way. It's usually the second half of his sentences that get him into trouble.

tdgeek

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#3339193 4-Feb-2025 16:38

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networkn:

The problems don't need to be completely solved, just improved a measureable amount. 100% this reduces the problem a measurable amount.

It won't be the only measure being taken, but even on it's own, it's getting enforcement at little cost to the US.

Trump isn't stupid. Neither was Bush.

I wish he would stop his sentences about half way through them though. He would be a lot more Presidential that way. It's usually the second half of his sentences that get him into trouble.

Yes there will be a gain, My issue is, is Mexico and Canada weak at enforcement or is USA weak as well? Immigration as one example. there was to be a wall, a great wall, never happened. Arguably maybe the US is weak and thus allowing imports in of immigrants and drugs? If he continues as he always has done, all talk, no action, or in the example bully tactics, thats fine, a win for now probably/possibly. US wil be gradually weaned away as the reason for this examples Art of the Deal is that some countries are dependent on the US, so bully tactics can work. Good short term, poor long term outcomes IMHO as they seek other markets. Such as China, Europe, etc

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#3339195 4-Feb-2025 16:48

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neb:

SaltyNZ: Yeah, "fix" the "problem". But now they've given him an inch, he'll be back with more demands.

It depends which sort of "Peace in our time" it is. Historians will never stop debating this, but in 1938 Germany had a strong, experienced (via the Condor Legion), motivated military while Britain had an under-<everything the military needs> that was mostly set up for "pacifying" rebellious tribesmen. Buying off Hitler gave them two years for a crash rearmament, recruitment, and training program that they otherwise wouldn't have had.

Unfortunately neither Canada nor Mexico are going to be able to rearrange their economies to put the US at arm's length in a mere 30 days, let alone arm their militaries. At some point they will both have to either say 'no' to Trump and face the consequences or concede that they are, de facto, the 51st and 52nd states of the USA. States that are even worse than Puerto Rico, which gets citizenship even if it doesn't get a vote.

Personally, although I completely understand where they are coming from (and in no way am I suggesting it was an easy decision), I think they both made grave strategic errors in not publicly telling Donald Trump to get in the sea right from the start.

iPad Pro 11" + iPhone 15 Pro Max + 2degrees 4tw!

These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.

kingdragonfly

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#3339197 4-Feb-2025 17:04

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neb:
Trump has just shut down USAID, one of the few genuinely good things the US government actually does.

Musk, Trump Prosecutor Targeting People Who Divulge Identities of DOGE Staff: Rolling Stones

As a cabal of Elon Musk flunkies works around the clock to infiltrate and sabotage various federal agencies is warning along with Washington allies that the consequences for publicly naming these staffers may be severe.

On Sunday, with Musk’s Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE) seizing control of the United States Agency for International Development (USAID) and the billionaire vowing to eliminate it altogether, Wired reported the identities of six software engineers with jobs in his wrecking crew. They span in age from 19 to their mid-twenties and have minimal government experience (if any), though most have connections to either Musk or his onetime PayPal colleague Peter Thiel, another right-wing Silicon Valley billionaire whose data analytics firm Palantir holds valuable U.S. defense contracts.
...
These young men have been involved in Musk’s sweeping efforts to gain access to the communication systems, personnel files, and other sensitive information at agencies including USAID, the Treasury Department, the Office of Personnel Management, the General Services Administration, and the Small Business Administration, in certain cases freezing employees out of their work accounts and putting others on leave.
...
On Monday, the agency’s staffers were locked out of the building, triggering a protest outside that was attended by Democratic lawmakers.
...

kingdragonfly

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#3339205 4-Feb-2025 17:10

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These are good acts that USAID has done in Elon Musk's hometown, Pretoria, the Capital of South Africa

USAID helped regional and international organizations to combat HIV/AIDS by providing quality treatment and prevention services, strengthening health systems, and supporting orphans and vulnerable children.

The USAID Southern Africa Trade and Investment Hub, based in Pretoria, worked to increase international competitiveness, intra-regional trade, and food security in Southern Africa.

The USAID Tuberculosis South Africa Project focuses on TB prevention and treatment efforts.

And this is only good acts they've performed in Elon Musk's hometown.

networkn

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#3339208 4-Feb-2025 17:30

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tdgeek:

Yes there will be a gain, My issue is, is Mexico and Canada weak at enforcement or is USA weak as well? Immigration as one example. there was to be a wall, a great wall, never happened. Arguably maybe the US is weak and thus allowing imports in of immigrants and drugs? If he continues as he always has done, all talk, no action, or in the example bully tactics, thats fine, a win for now probably/possibly. US wil be gradually weaned away as the reason for this examples Art of the Deal is that some countries are dependent on the US, so bully tactics can work. Good short term, poor long term outcomes IMHO as they seek other markets. Such as China, Europe, etc

If the problem was that the US was weak on enforcement, over many presidencies it could have been addressed, it's easier to do it yourself than get others to do it. This is something new and different, and it makes sense to get the source to do it. This is just a different take on a wall. You can't stop it, but they can slow it down, make it harder. It's a good move IMO.

I have been hearing the 'people who don't like the US way of doing business, will move away from dependance on the US', for decades, there hasn't really been a material shift from the US as the central super power in all that time. 4 Years is a drop in the bucket. People (including me) predicted the sky would fall during Trumps last term, and the world is still turning.

I am not saying he isn't a massive threat to some peoples way of life, but 4 years from now, the world will still be here. The majority of Americans won't be severely impacted either way.

ezbee

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#3339221 4-Feb-2025 18:16

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I think you might be underestimating the scale and wealth of the fentanyl and drug business, its not that easy.

The logistics chain that it meeting this Fentanyl demand is so well resourced that 10K Mexican solders wandering randomly about the boarder.
They won't be kitted out as well as USA's top DEA agents with all the expensive gear either.

It does not have a distinctive strong smell making it difficult to detect and easy to disguise in the large volumes of materials and food crossing.

Its more likely for people working behind screens trying to trace communications and the money trail.
Though spying on your own citizens is a tricky issue.

Who did Trump pardon, Mr Silk-Road of course.
The Coiner and NFT President is also helping empower more ways to make that money harder to follow.

USA seems to not even have the capability to control its own armories that supercharge the drug cartels power to compete with Mexican military.
Some get caught but how much does not.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/mexico-demands-investigation-into-u-s-military-grade-weapons-being-used-by-drug-cartels

USA handicaps actions to limit weapons supply.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/the-american-guns-that-mexican-cartels-covet-a-visual-guide/ar-AA1rJ5qh

""
On Friday, the U.S. Supreme Court agreed to hear a gun-industry bid to quash a lawsuit filed by the Mexican government alleging American firearms manufacturers have illegally flooded the country with weapons used by drug cartels. Mexico sued companies including Smith & Wesson Brands; Beretta U.S.A.; Glock; Sturm, Ruger & Co.; and Colt’s Manufacturing. The gun makers said the lawsuit is a stalking horse for gun-control advocates in the U.S.
""

USA does have a good deal of responsibility for the power of drug cartels, arming them as well as financing.

This is just a show of force, a Barnum and Bailey sideshow of strength, hiding weakness, he had to back down.

networkn

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#3339275 4-Feb-2025 18:45

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ezbee:

I think you might be underestimating the scale and wealth of the fentanyl and drug business, its not that easy.

--Snip--

This is just a show of force, a Barnum and Bailey sideshow of strength, hiding weakness, he had to back down.

You believe whatever works for you, I am taking this at face value. I seriously doubt a little market wobble (in the grand scheme of things) wouldn't deter an action like this. I am absolutely not underestimating the scale and wealth of either of those things.

There is however, no way that 10K soldiers won't have a material impact. It won't end it of course, there is a lot of motivation to evasion, however, there is no downside from the US standpoint. 10K people they don't have to pay hanging out near the border will undoutably make things harder for the bad guys.

tdgeek

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#3339326 4-Feb-2025 19:23

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SaltyNZ:

Unfortunately neither Canada nor Mexico are going to be able to rearrange their economies to put the US at arm's length in a mere 30 days, let alone arm their militaries. At some point they will both have to either say 'no' to Trump and face the consequences or concede that they are, de facto, the 51st and 52nd states of the USA. States that are even worse than Puerto Rico, which gets citizenship even if it doesn't get a vote.

Personally, although I completely understand where they are coming from (and in no way am I suggesting it was an easy decision), I think they both made grave strategic errors in not publicly telling Donald Trump to get in the sea right from the start.

Agree. Right now they are what I bolded. So little need to negotiate for the long term good, hammer it now. Short term a great strategy. Long term they can be out on their own. Having said that a 4 year term, when a normal President, right or left, will right the wrongs, but what a waste of 8 years +

tdgeek

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#3339329 4-Feb-2025 19:45

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networkn:

tdgeek:

Yes there will be a gain, My issue is, is Mexico and Canada weak at enforcement or is USA weak as well? Immigration as one example. there was to be a wall, a great wall, never happened. Arguably maybe the US is weak and thus allowing imports in of immigrants and drugs? If he continues as he always has done, all talk, no action, or in the example bully tactics, thats fine, a win for now probably/possibly. US wil be gradually weaned away as the reason for this examples Art of the Deal is that some countries are dependent on the US, so bully tactics can work. Good short term, poor long term outcomes IMHO as they seek other markets. Such as China, Europe, etc

If the problem was that the US was weak on enforcement, over many presidencies it could have been addressed, it's easier to do it yourself than get others to do it. This is something new and different, and it makes sense to get the source to do it. This is just a different take on a wall. You can't stop it, but they can slow it down, make it harder. It's a good move IMO.

I have been hearing the 'people who don't like the US way of doing business, will move away from dependance on the US', for decades, there hasn't really been a material shift from the US as the central super power in all that time. 4 Years is a drop in the bucket. People (including me) predicted the sky would fall during Trumps last term, and the world is still turning.

I am not saying he isn't a massive threat to some peoples way of life, but 4 years from now, the world will still be here. The majority of Americans won't be severely impacted either way.

Fair points. The recent POTUS's were the same. GOP or Democrats, they are the same. Little boat rocking, make a bit here, lose a bit there.

IMO I see today as different. Trump is an idiot, thats my opinion, which you disagree with and thats fine. Todays reign he has gained confidence due to maybe picking up some experience. Got the votes (despite going hard against those voters) Doesnt matter, he won, they and we are democracies. But despite his poor CV he was voted in, fine.

The sky didnt fall in his last term as he said a lot but did nothing. This time around he is more potent. Yes, 4 years is nothing, the rest of the world who are very dependent will fold, as we have seen. Europe etc wont as to them its an opportunity to forge real partnerships. When Trump is out in 4 years time, that may not change, the reduction of dependence that Canada and Mexico are locked into. In other news China is lashing back. Chine is dependent on the US as is US dependent on China. But its a different ball game. Trump like others in the past roll on news and emotions, Asia is more cultural, they will roll on honour, as Japan did at their detriment decades ago. I can see Asia, not just China working on real partnerships, as having a lot or some dependence on a top country like the US, given the political leader instability they have, is best to focus on friends and partnerships, that individuals, companies do. China has some struggles, big enough to wear it. US is facing infrastructure, water, transport, etc. Who pays? The masses. They cannot make that go away. That's when you need friends and partnerships so everyone grows. When Trump is out, will all that go back to normal? Possibly, but a smart leader will diversify, just as individuals and companies do. Put those eggs in a few baskets, friendly baskets. A good US president arrives? Cool, but too much risk to roll with that, spread the load, so if you need to THEY (not US) have leverage, which Trump now has.

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#3339332 4-Feb-2025 19:55

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https://edition.cnn.com/2025/02/04/politics/trump-blinks-trade-war-analysis/index.html

A more objective view of the bizarre showdown with America’s neighbors suggests a blunter truth: Trump blinked.

The president vowed as recently as last week that there was nothing that Canada or Mexico could do to avoid the tariffs he planned to impose.

But he pulled back on imposing them anyway.

As markets tanked on Monday morning, the potential consequences of a North American trade war were laid bare. The potential for tariffs to spike the grocery prices that Trump was partly elected to fix came into focus. There were fresh warnings that the auto industry — a cross-border concern — could seize up and that the price of a new vehicle could soon shoot up by $3,000.

And Canada and Mexico didn’t really give up that much.

neb

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#3339373 5-Feb-2025 01:38

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Just realised something, late last year Trump said:

We’re a dumping ground. We’re like a garbage can for the world. That’s what’s happened

And now that he's in power he's hard at work lighting it up into a dumpster fire.

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