marmel:

I love the line about the boat shoes and immigration too.

I didn't get that. :) 

Unsurprising Labour is losing the young urbanist vote considering it's the lifestyle most rapidly going backwards in terms of lifestyle and it's also the one they're having the most problems meeting policy goals for. 

Ah well. My take on it is if Jacinda loses next year, she loses, at least she had 2 terms as PM, and got us through a number of crises. Just a pity everything else didn't happen.

quickymart:

 

Ah well. My take on it is if Jacinda loses next year, she loses, at least she had 2 terms as PM, and got us through a number of crises. Just a pity everything else didn't happen.

 

To be fair little happens anyway in NZ, no matter who is in power.

I don’t think all the price increases are Labour’s fault, I’m just getting feed up with them finding ways of taking more money off people.

Also the latest is them standardising recycling across the country, and people having to take drink bottles back to the shops for bottle refunds, just seems to be adding a lot of red tape and bureaucratically. Shops will need to store returned bottles, staff to give refunds, not much cash held these days, people may need to do trips to shop unnecessary if they get  Groceries delivered.

What’s wrong with putting them in the recycle bin? They say that some get contaminated with wrong stuff in bin and can’t use it, yet milk containers are fine?

With standardising across the country there is probably a reason why something is ok with one council and not another.

Rightly or wrongly just finding myself disagreeing with a lot of changes they are making lately. And as pointed out they do seem to spend money without the good results.

rugrat:

 

 

 

 

 

What’s wrong with putting them in the recycle bin? They say that some get contaminated with wrong stuff in bin and can’t use it, yet milk containers are fine?

 

and of booze with ciggie ends in them

 

If the recycling bin always had what are accepted it would be fine. Many will have non suitable plastics, milk container lids, etc. Id favour a bottle/can bin, and a recycling bin where the packaging had a yellow R on it if its suiitable. From what little ive seen of recycling, its always the sae in the article/clip, they have too much non suitables in them

tdgeek:

 

rugrat:

 

 

 

 

 

What’s wrong with putting them in the recycle bin? They say that some get contaminated with wrong stuff in bin and can’t use it, yet milk containers are fine?

 

and of booze with ciggie ends in them

 

 

If the recycling bin always had what are accepted it would be fine. Many will have non suitable plastics, milk container lids, etc. Id favour a bottle/can bin, and a recycling bin where the packaging had a yellow R on it if its suiitable. From what little ive seen of recycling, its always the sae in the article/clip, they have too much non suitables in them

 

Simple, have a levy on products that use non suitable materials for recycling. That will see them phased out

Technofreak:

 

 

 

Simple, have a levy on products that use non suitable materials for recycling. That will see them phased out

 

Thats a very good idea.

Ardern may have been able to get away with pointing at National at the start of their term, but they have had 3 years in coalition and a total majority now. If she thinks pointing at their perceived failures, whilst sitting with a long list of her own, is going to continue to resonate with voters, I think she is dreaming. 

She (they) really needs to stop looking backward and start looking forward and providing the country with a solid plan (not a Kiwibuild and a Billions trees type fantasy plan), some results, and some indication they accept the responsibility they have been given and aren't going to look to blame others. 

I recall back in the day, that blaming National for what they left behind wasnt allowed?

Im sure Covid and the QE that followed hasn't helped. Is that an excuse for Labour?  If not, an even playing field.

tdgeek:

 

I recall back in the day, that blaming National for what they left behind wasnt allowed?

 

Im sure Covid and the QE that followed hasn't helped. Is that an excuse for Labour?  If not, an even playing field.

 

Every party blames their predecessor for a while, but at some point you need to put your big boy pants on and accept you have had control for long enough YOU are responsible for what happens next. Today Ardern spent most her time pointing at National. No-one cares (they are the opposition), we are waiting for the party who has the majority to show us how they intend to bring us past Covid into a long term sustainable future.

If National wasn't allowed to blame what they had come up during their for failures to deliver what people thought they should have, then Labour doesn't get to do it either. 

It's tough being in charge, they wanted a invite to the big dance, now they are there. 

Let's see some boogie.

networkn:

 

Every party blames their predecessor for a while, but at some point you need to put your big boy pants on and accept you have had control for long enough YOU are responsible for what happens next. Today Ardern spent most her time pointing at National. No-one cares (they are the opposition), we are waiting for the party who has the majority to show us how they intend to bring us past Covid into a long term sustainable future.

 

If National wasn't allowed to blame what they had come up during their for failures to deliver what people thought they should have, then Labour doesn't get to do it either. 

 

It's tough being in charge, they wanted a invite to the big dance, now they are there. 

 

Let's see some boogie.

 

Agree

In this thread, blame National for what they left behind wasnt fair. So if National wins, I guess the posters here cannot blame the last two terms either? That's fair

Yes you can put "big boy pants on" and say that over the last x years, its been fine so no excuses. Both parties.

"Today Ardern spent most her time pointing at National." Thats politics. it works both ways as any Opposition party will know and have used daily

"has the majority to show us how they intend to bring us past Covid into a long term sustainable future." Id look at sustainable future ahead of Covid. The former is why National lost the election. Covid is an anomaly. The future isnt. 

Its not about lefties/commies, strikers vs National, its about Progressive vs Conservative.

tdgeek:

 

networkn:

 

Every party blames their predecessor for a while, but at some point you need to put your big boy pants on and accept you have had control for long enough YOU are responsible for what happens next. Today Ardern spent most her time pointing at National. No-one cares (they are the opposition), we are waiting for the party who has the majority to show us how they intend to bring us past Covid into a long term sustainable future.

 

If National wasn't allowed to blame what they had come up during their for failures to deliver what people thought they should have, then Labour doesn't get to do it either. 

 

It's tough being in charge, they wanted a invite to the big dance, now they are there. 

 

Let's see some boogie.

 

 

Agree

 

In this thread, blame National for what they left behind wasnt fair. So if National wins, I guess the posters here cannot blame the last two terms either? That's fair

 

Yes you can put "big boy pants on" and say that over the last x years, its been fine so no excuses. Both parties.

 

"Today Ardern spent most her time pointing at National." Thats politics. it works both ways as any Opposition party will know and have used daily

 

"has the majority to show us how they intend to bring us past Covid into a long term sustainable future." Id look at sustainable future ahead of Covid. The former is why National lost the election. Covid is an anomaly. The future isnt. 

 

Its not about lefties/commies, strikers vs National, its about Progressive vs Conservative.

 

 

 

 

 

If you ask me it's about getting the balance between progressive and conservative right. Both have their merits.

tdgeek:

 

In this thread, blame National for what they left behind wasnt fair. So if National wins, I guess the posters here cannot blame the last two terms either? That's fair

 

It's inevitable that at the *start* of a term, some of what the new government will do is talk about what it has to 'fix' from the prior Governments term(s). 

We are a full term and a half in and our PM still spends more than half her time talking about what National did and what she thinks National would do, in Parliament, and very little time talking about what she will do. I think it says a lot about their focus and concerns me.

In Nationals last term, they pretty much ignored Labour. Not totally, but Labour were in disarray and weren't an effective opposition. They had nothing to fear.  

Obviously approaching an election the focus changes.

 

Thats politics. it works both ways as any Opposition party will know and have used daily.

 

Separated to get around the quote limit!

 

The former is why National lost the election.

 

 

 

I disagree. The oppositions entire focus is pretty much holding the Government to account. They oppose. It's in the name. Look at the number of things Labour opposed which they are now doing the same things for?

At the right time the opposition should deliver it's vision for how it would run the country so voters can choose.

The Government should be spending the VASTEST majority of it's time executing the policy it promised, and running the country. When the Government regularly spends more time focused on the opposition, their priorities are skewed and right now the country needs all the Governments focus to be on NZ Post Covid. If the Government delivers on it's goals, is innovative or at least show they have a coherent and plausible plan,  they shouldn't need to worry too much about the opposition. 

The problem for the Government, is that if you take away Covid, and Terror attacks, then what is left? People start looking at what was promised vs delivered, what the current state of the country is.  I suspect that is why the government is so focused on what National did or didn't do. 

They won't win another election bagging National. 

We have very different versions of why National lost the election obviously. 

My opinion:

National lost in 2017 because after three terms of John Key and co, people wanted a change, and a lot of people saw that in Jacinda (young, fresh, etc). Plus Winston was the kingmaker then, and he wasn't interested in going with National as (from memory) they treated him poorly re his pension (or was it tax returns?) etc.

National lost in 2020 because the Government did a fantastic job managing the coronavirus pandemic, and we had (and still have) one of the lowest death tolls in the world. Plus, their leader at the time was highly polarising and was not personable enough to appeal to the majority of the public. In fact, I think Judith put a lot of voters off National, and they went elsewhere.

As to 2023? I really think it could go either way, to be honest. But as you say, a lot of time still to pass between now and then. Anything could happen.