USA school gun incidents / student anti-gun protests / arming teachers

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kingdragonfly

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#236157 20-May-2018 16:33

May 2018 Texas shooting marks 23rd school gun incident in U.S. since Florida tragedy in February 2018.

I doubt school shootings will end when Trump leaves.

There's also related issues of student protest to politicians "thoughts and prayers", but no action.

Lastly there's a lot of discussion around arming teachers.

So I have created this separate thread

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#2019419 20-May-2018 17:07

Presidents have in practice opposed and avoided anything on the federal level. Looks like it is up to the individual states to continue making changes and implementing safe storage where the population supports that requirement. In the case of youth misadventure tradgedy and school shootings it's generally parental weapons used. NRA should be educating on that also.

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kingdragonfly

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#2019426 20-May-2018 17:57

Time Magazine
'The Time Is Now.' This New Coalition of Celebrities and Activists Just Pledged to Take on the NRA

"A new coalition of celebrities and activists, including actor Alyssa Milano and Parkland student David Hogg, announced plans Friday to take on the National Rifle Association and elected officials who accept money from the powerful gun advocacy group.

In an open letter to NRA Executive Vice President Wayne LaPierre, which was first obtained by TIME, the more than 100 members of the newly formed NoRA Initiative — short for No Rifle Association — pledge to reduce the NRA’s influence in American politics through a series of voter registration drives, nationwide art campaigns, demonstrations and boycotts.

http://time.com/5248072/nora-coalition-celebrities-nra/

https://noranow.org/
Our Values

#NoRA Dedication

Our action was inspired by the Parkland school shooting covered in some detail below. However, this action is dedicated to, inclusive of, and in support of all victims of gun violence in all communities. This includes direct and indirect victims of gun violence, their families and friends, and their communities as they define them.

Mission

To hack the culture and shine a bright light on the bloody hands of the NRA and the politicians they purchase; and to inform, register, and mobilize voters to reject NRA-funded candidates for office; and to raise funds for partner organizations who share our vision for a changed narrative and freedom from fear of gun violence.

Nonviolent Action

We commit ourselves to nonviolent action to build a healthier, safer world as the violence enabled and perpetuated by the NRA, its officials and the elected officials it owns is already more than we can bear.

Ethics

Our guiding principles are those of inclusion and empowerment. We strive to be an intersectional community of action which hears all voices, uplifts all persons – especially in communities of color, women, the disabled, and survivors of gun violence – and to be a place of safety and nonviolence where all committed to the mission can work together effectively and in a spirit of love and comradery.

amiga500

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#2019431 20-May-2018 18:10

As I said in the other thread the least bad solution could be airport style security, schools surrounded by high razor wire fences, a police guard on each school bus, and armed police at the security check point. Some say it's impractical because of the numbers but this could be mitigated by having the kids arriving at different time windows. In NZ terms Yr9 arrive at 8.15 am; Yr10 at 8.30 and so on. Maybe by use of psychological profiling some students could be allowed to bypass screening. Kids could be rewarded for arriving at the right times by various means including going into draws for new Iphones and so on.

I am 100% in favour of strict gun controls but it's never going to happen in the USA, plus they have around 300 million guns in circulation already. Sure these measures would cost a huge amount of money but so do walls on the Mexican border, 14 billion dollar aircraft carriers, & un-winnable wars in the Middle East.

Implementing airport style security at schools is something the Democrats and Republicans could do without it costing them votes or funding from the NRA.

Arming teachers is a terrible idea and just pandering to the NRA.

Fred99

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#2019435 20-May-2018 18:27

Texas school had a shooting plan, armed officers and practice. And still 10 people died.

kingdragonfly

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#2019516 20-May-2018 20:34

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/apr/23/youtube-alex-jones-sandy-hook-media-matters-video

"YouTube under fire for censoring video exposing conspiracy theorist Alex Jones"

"Platform removed a video exposing Jones’ harmful lies about the Sandy Hook massacre [when 20-year-old Adam Lanza fatally shot 20 children between six and seven years old, as well as six adult staff members] , but has yet to censor Jones himself – raising questions about its approach to fake news

Alex Jones, who runs Infowars, has used YouTube to build a massive audience for his videos claiming the Sandy Hook shooting was faked.

YouTube’s algorithm has long promoted videos attacking gun violence victims, allowing the rightwing conspiracy theorist Alex Jones to build a massive audience. But when a not-for-profit recently exposed Jones’ most offensive viral content in a compilation on YouTube, the site was much less supportive – instead deleting the footage from the platform, accusing it of 'harassment and bullying'.

Media Matters, a leftwing watchdog, last week posted a series of clips of Jones spreading falsehoods about the 2012 Sandy Hook elementary school massacre, a newsworthy video of evidence after the victims’ families filed a defamation lawsuit against the Infowars host. But YouTube, for reasons it has yet to explain, removed the video three days after it was published, a move that once again benefitted Jones, who is now arguing that the defamation suit has defamed him.

The video was censored for several days, but reinstated Monday after the Guardian’s inquiry and backlash on social media. Still, the case offered yet another stark illustration of the way tech companies and social media algorithms have failed to distinguish between fake news and legitimate content – while continuing to provide a powerful platform to the most repugnant views and dangerous propaganda.

'This just shows the capriciousness and arbitrariness by which they are enforcing these standards,' said Angelo Carusone, the president of Media Matters.

Jones, who has faced numerous lawsuits accusing him of spreading harmful misinformation, has skyrocketed to international fame by fueling a range of conspiracy theories that suggest high-profile mass shootings in America may have been “false flags” or hoaxes, in which the government and 'crisis actors' staged the tragedies to push new gun laws."

gzt

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#2019540 20-May-2018 21:01

amiga500:
As I said in the other thread the least bad solution could be airport style security, schools surrounded by high razor wire fences, a police guard on each school bus, and armed police at the security check point. Some say it's impractical because of the numbers but this could be mitigated by having the kids arriving at different time windows. In NZ terms Yr9 arrive at 8.15 am; Yr10 at 8.30 and so on. Maybe by use of psychological profiling some students could be allowed to bypass screening. Kids could be rewarded for arriving at the right times by various means including going into draws for new Iphones and so on.

It seem to me that easy access to a parent's guns was the key to this tragedy. School aiport security and barbed wire is likely to move the location for the issue in that case, but unlikely to prevent tragedy. I agree it could reduce the numbers a bit, but the number of kids killed and injured in homes with a parent's gun far far exceeds those numbers anyway. I don't see what's wrong with some kind of public gun safely campaign like drink driving and so on to reduce the numbers.

Fred99

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#2019738 21-May-2018 12:47

From NRA president Ollie North offering some sincere advice:

Speaking on Fox News Sunday just two days after 10 were gunned down at Santa Fe High School, North said the “disease” causing such rampages is not firearms but “youngsters who are steeped in a culture of violence” and who have “been drugged in many cases.” “If you look at what has happened to the young people, many of these young boys have been on Ritalin since they were in kindergarten,” North said. “I am certainly not a doctor, I’m a Marine, but I can see those kinds of things happening.”

kingdragonfly

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#2019832 21-May-2018 14:42

Ritalin: side effects may include dizziness, nausea, headaches, and an urge to kill?

Stan

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#2019968 21-May-2018 17:25

amiga500:

As I said in the other thread the least bad solution could be airport style security, schools surrounded by high razor wire fences, a police guard on each school bus, and armed police at the security check point. Some say it's impractical because of the numbers but this could be mitigated by having the kids arriving at different time windows. In NZ terms Yr9 arrive at 8.15 am; Yr10 at 8.30 and so on. Maybe by use of psychological profiling some students could be allowed to bypass screening. Kids could be rewarded for arriving at the right times by various means including going into draws for new Iphones and so on.

I am 100% in favour of strict gun controls but it's never going to happen in the USA, plus they have around 300 million guns in circulation already. Sure these measures would cost a huge amount of money but so do walls on the Mexican border, 14 billion dollar aircraft carriers, & un-winnable wars in the Middle East.

Implementing airport style security at schools is something the Democrats and Republicans could do without it costing them votes or funding from the NRA.

Arming teachers is a terrible idea and just pandering to the NRA.

I agree it's far too late not to mention strict gun control would be hard to implement and political suicide.

Honestly I don't think anything can be done

Geektastic

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#2020141 21-May-2018 22:50

It’s a tricky one.

I presume that if your aim is to kill a bunch of children, you do not need a gun to achieve that, so arguably, banning firearms won’t do anything but change the method adopted by the killer from gun to say Ford Mercury or Peterbuilt truck.

gzt

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#2020149 22-May-2018 06:04

I doubt these kids have any clear aims.

Paul1977

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#2020213 22-May-2018 09:52

Geektastic: It’s a tricky one.

I presume that if your aim is to kill a bunch of children, you do not need a gun to achieve that, so arguably, banning firearms won’t do anything but change the method adopted by the killer from gun to say Ford Mercury or Peterbuilt truck.

I agree that if someone wants to commit a crime like this, there is very little that will stop them. However, if the individual has no ability to obtain a firearm they are generally not able to inflict nearly as much damage.

While not a school shooting, take the Las Vegas shooting as an (admittedly extreme) example. Firearms are probably the only way someone could kill 59 and injure an additional 527 in a single incident.

6FIEND

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#2020220 22-May-2018 10:10

Recent commentary from Texas:

It's illegal to bring a firearm onto school grounds

It's illegal to saw the barrel off a shotgun

It's illegal for a 17 year old to possess a gun

It's illegal to carry without a permit in Texas

It's illegal to discharge a weapon in public

It's illegal to bring ammo onto school grounds

It's illegal to shoot and injure people

It's illegal to violate someone's civil rights

It's illegal to shoot and murder people

It's illegal to conceal your weapon without a permit

But yeah, we just need one more law. That'll do it.

MikeB4

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#2020234 22-May-2018 10:29

These dreadful incidents are a symptom of a very deep seated problem in the US. Officially and by attitude the US society is an uncaring society. The US needs to look at the root causes and these are extremely complex and deeply imbedded in their society. Saying that they need to bring in stricter gun laws will not address those root causes, it is simply a too simplistic attempt at a solution. They need to address the issues that makes a person pick up the gun and use it.

Stan

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#2020238 22-May-2018 10:44

MikeB4:

These dreadful incidents are a symptom of a very deep seated problem in the US. Officially and by attitude the US society is an uncaring society. The US needs to look at the root causes and these are extremely complex and deeply imbedded in their society. Saying that they need to bring in stricter gun laws will not address those root causes, it is simply a too simplistic attempt at a solution. They need to address the issues that makes a person pick up the gun and use it.

Incels are being blamed for this somewhat its a rather sad phenomenon.

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