How has Christchurch changed you?

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Forums › Politics › How has Christchurch changed you?

Rikkitic

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#248681 5-Apr-2019 13:37

I think enough time has passed to have this discussion. Christchurch has changed me. I used to be opposed to all forms of censorship. Now I no longer am. I believed no-one had any right to snoop on me. Now I think there can be exceptions.

There have been plenty of terrorist atrocities elsewhere in the world, but they didn’t change me the way Christchurch has. I’m not sure why. Maybe because they were further away. Maybe because the terrorist usually wasn’t someone from my own culture. Maybe because a certain critical mass of outrage had to be reached before the switch clicked over. I hope not.

Whatever the reason, this obscenity has changed me. I no longer believe my right to privacy trumps everything else. I am no longer opposed to censorship in certain circumstances. Some of my core beliefs have changed. How about you?

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GV27

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#2211370 5-Apr-2019 14:38

I think I am more ...aware? I don't know if that's the right word - of the scale of the push back . I know of the gun lobby and the far right conspiracy theorists and their madness, but seeing New Zealand thrown around as a political football by people overseas with their own barrows to push has made me deeply uncomfortable.

I'm also somewhat frustrated by the type of attitudes I've seen from some people that we've joked about before here; the rabid British nationalism and jingoistic side of things which has until usually just manifested as blind support for the All Blacks or other equally harmless sporting pageantry.

Comments like "Every memorial lets the terrorists win" or "This is still a Christian country" on Facebook with literally hundreds of likes, from your stereo-typical middle-aged New Zealander whose only experience with freedom of speech issues is not being able to find Newstalk ZB on their radio once in a while have been hugely disappointing. There is a huge lack of self-awareness from many Kiwis and even worse, many seem to want to buy into the British "we only tolerate you here but we don't really want you here" attitude towards any Muslims is downright disgraceful.

Despite the PM's protestations, this is very much us and I guess if I have changed, it is that I am more comfortable to be judged for telling people stuff that like that isn't on, nor is it welcome.

Varkk

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#2211391 5-Apr-2019 15:16

I am more vocal about casual racism etc you see everyday. Before when someone said something stupid about "Those people" etc in the break room, I would just ignore it or move to another conversation, now I challenge people on that. Small things here and there hopefully chip away at this sort of thing. I am thinking of Popper's paradox of tolerance so am taking a policy of zero tolerance for intolerance.

Handle9

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#2211424 5-Apr-2019 16:36

Varkk:
I am more vocal about casual racism etc you see everyday. Before when someone said something stupid about "Those people" etc in the break room, I would just ignore it or move to another conversation, now I challenge people on that. Small things here and there hopefully chip away at this sort of thing. I am thinking of Popper's paradox of tolerance so am taking a policy of zero tolerance for intolerance.

Yip, me too.

BarTender

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#2212276 7-Apr-2019 13:08

My journey down right wing twitter was ultimately a frightening one. Sure there is your casually racist uncle was someone you would tolerate to get through the family event.

These days I am less tolerant of that sort of BS. Also call out colleagues at work or onsite with customers when things I find uncomfortable are said.

MikeB4

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#2212812 8-Apr-2019 13:23

I am angry, sad and powerless.

I have backed away from social media, even my activity on Geekzone has diminished considerably.

BTR

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#2219722 17-Apr-2019 10:14

I am annoyed that the govt acted so quickly with the gun law changes, I am not against some of the changes but the whole process seemed to happen for to quickly.

I felt this was very heavily politically movtivated in an attempt to seek a second term as PM. Hundreds of people die every year as the govt ignores medication to help cancer victims and there is no haste made to change this.

I feel the PM has a feeling of guilt after all she is the one who relaxed gun laws late last year.

I do feel for the people who were affected and their families but I also feel there has been a lot of knee jerk reactions and people letting emotions cloud their judgement.

Yes I do wish for a safer world but being 100% safe is not realistic, are we going to ban cars or alcohol the next time a drunk driver kills someone?

Yes we can minimise risk, we as humans do that every day but banning something affecting a large amount of responsible firearms owners so quickly without much consideration seems wrong.

An interesting fact, a bolt action rifle usually holds more ammunition that the standard magazine on a large calibre semi auto rifle.

I do agree that large capacity magazines and miltary styled rifles should be banned but a simple semi auto rifle with an internal 4 shot magazine doesn't pose anymore risk than a bolt action rifle

Fred99

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#2219757 17-Apr-2019 11:13

BTR:

I felt this was very heavily politically movtivated in an attempt to seek a second term as PM. Hundreds of people die every year as the govt ignores medication to help cancer victims and there is no haste made to change this.

I don't think so, and the 119:1 vote in parliament suggests the same.

There have been a couple of threads that dead-ended themselves in this forum, where "the devil in the detail" was discussed and argued, with no agreement, going around in circles with people just getting angrier (me included).

The longer the change to laws was debated, the greater the chance the changes would have been watered down to be less effective, especially as there would have definitely been outside influence from the US NRA interfering, as they have done before, here and in Aus.

Yes, it's inconvenient for some, and probably not perfect, but it's a hell of a lot better than no action.

As far as the comparison with (cost of funding) some cancer drugs, that's really just false equivalence argument. Start a thread in the health and fitness forum if you want to discuss medical specifics, or another thread in this forum if you want to discuss the political background. As a general comment, I suspect that the real numbers of people who could be helped by some new therapies may be exaggerated and outnumbered by those who probably couldn't be helped - but are desperate for hope, and unless there's an unlimited budget to pay to pharmaceutical companies who'd like to charge as much as they can possibly get away with, then we're always going to be relying on the ability of Pharmac to negotiate some discount terms with suppliers. The whole health system is underfunded - ask anyone working in it. Prices for some of the new therapies are also outrageous, geared to the small minority of the US private healthcare insured who'd have plans to cover the cost.

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Rikkitic

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#2219781 17-Apr-2019 11:38

BTR:

I am annoyed that the govt acted so quickly with the gun law changes, I am not against some of the changes but the whole process seemed to happen for to quickly.

Not really on topic. The shooting was a major tragedy that profoundly affected a lot of people. I started this thread for those who wanted to reflect on their emotional response to it. There was another thread for those who wanted to discuss gun issues but that was deleted, probably because it it turned into a squabble about the qualities of different kinds of guns, instead of about the horrific thing that had been done with them.

Something truly terrible happened, yet some people cannot seem to see past the limits that have been placed on their 'freedom' to enjoy their particular hobby. The Christchurch massacre has changed us. Things that used to be taken for granted no longer can be. Our Muslim neighbours have made a terrible sacrifice, for doing nothing more than attending a religious service in their place of worship. In response those who enjoy guns are also being asked to sacrifice something. It is a lot less than what the victims gave up.

The issue is not whether it will make a real difference or not, or whether those with diseased minds will find other weapons. The issue is that no civilised society actually needs these kinds of weapons for anything, and having them available at all creates the risk that they may fall into the wrong hands, as did indeed happen. There seems to be an element of petulance in complaints that this or that piece of kit will no longer be allowed, or the changes are inconsistent, or too rushed. The changes are a necessary response to a national tragedy. They are not intended to appease gun hobbyists, who will just have to man up and get over it. When toys are abused, they get taken away.

If you want to continue this discussion, please start another thread. This is not the place.

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