MySky series link woes again

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JohnPorter

187 posts

Master Geek

#10736 7-Dec-2006 22:26

Series link is acting up again - perhaps a "south of Taupo" situation again?

There have been about one program per day for the last week that have come up "Failed: no signal". Of course, there was a signal. All the failed recordings were on TV1 and TV2. Tonight, at 6:15 One news was shown as to be recorded at 6pm, and the record light was off. Hmmm. I went to the EPG, found One News and hit record, and it started recording immediately. The Nanny and One News for tomorrow were both showing as "searching...". I turned off series link and turned it back on again. In both cases it said "looking for series link info" (or whatever that message is), then it said series link info was not available. The listing then changed to the program name instead of "searching...", with series link turned off. I deleted the listing, went to the EPG, selected the program again and hit series link, which then worked fine.

Is this the "multiple versions of TVNZ for different regions getting their series link info mixed up" problem again? Perhaps due to channels being reshuffled on the new satellite?

Is anyone else getting failed recordings on TVNZ lately?

BigFella

105 posts

Master Geek

#54966 7-Dec-2006 23:18

I'm experiencing the same issues - bloody frustrating that you can't trust these boxes to do what they're told...

Reon

69 posts

Master Geek

#54967 7-Dec-2006 23:19

I'd setup to record 2 movies last Sunday night on TV2 and noticed while watching another channel that the red recording light had not come on?

Looked at the planner and yes both movies were listed to be recored but it wasn't recording?

Rebooted still not recording so I manually started recording the movie and the one for latter and it entered 2 more recordings in the planner that were exactly the same as the existing 2, I suspect I'd get the "Failed: no signal" if I'd left the original ones there and checked them the next day.

Oh well at least MySky has stopped trying to dial out every 4 hours.

OrangeDrink

51 posts

Master Geek

#54979 8-Dec-2006 11:20

tell me about it... I seem to have to reset my series links every couple of weeks if it even remembers to record anything at all week to week. Had a great few weeks with series link and scheduled recordings. I selected all the Rugby Internationals a few weeks ago, Wales, England, Ireland, France, Scotland and Italy's home games. I made the mistake obviously of thinking about 4 or 5 days ahead. I went back on the following Friday to check I'd got them all and lo and behold they'd all disappeared from my list. Seems like Sky's schedules changed the name of the programmes in the EPG so it just threw out my scheduled recordings.

Tried to record Cracker this week. I was watching the Cricket at the time and thought "yeah that might fill in a couple of hours of insomnia later in the week..." so I'd set it to record at 8.30pm that night. 8.47 and the red light's still not on on the front so I check my Planner and lo and behold it's still there, still says it's going to record it, it just didn't seem to notice it was already past 8.30.

I'd had enough. I just bought myself a Tivo. I'll use that to record the important stuff and use MySky as an expensive backup for one off recordings and things I don't care about too much. At least I'll still be able to record 2 things at once that way! If MySky feels like it....

JohnPorter

187 posts

Master Geek

#55036 8-Dec-2006 18:40

I've heard that elsewhere about the sports channels. I don't record much sport now that NASCAR season is over. The other channels have been quite solid for me for quite a while. But now, all of a sudden - a TVNZ problem.

Does Tivo work here?

OrangeDrink

51 posts

Master Geek

#55040 8-Dec-2006 18:58

of course you can't even Series Link a ton of shows on things like the documentary channels...

Tivo works here but there's no official service, just a user supported community. You can find out more info here:

http://www.nztivo.net/index.php/Welcome_to_NZTivo

and here:

http://minnie.tuhs.org/twiki/bin/view

the second one's OzTivo which has been running a while, as I understand it NZTivo has less history but they've adapted most of the OZ stuff to NZ

I'll let you know how it goes here! Best bit is I should, with the network card installed in a Tivo be able to archive things like Rugby matches in DivX format via my computer so I can stash several games on 1 DVD-R... Not ideal of course, Tivo doesn't have COmponent capabilities (though there are hacks for the UK Series 1 Tivo to get Compnent Out, it still only does RGB In at best.... The US Series 1's I think are limited to S-Video but should be sufficient for my needs at the moment.

The good bit though should be a PVR which actually records what it's supposed to and can do things like record suggestions based on what things I like and don't like. Had Tivo back in the UK, I miss it tons..

If anyone's interested there's some useful newbie bits on both those websites and a responsive set of users hanging around the forums on both.

cyril7

9058 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

Trusted

Subscriber

#55054 8-Dec-2006 20:50

John might I suggest that as a result of a major tracking system failure at Avalon last sunday Sky moved everyone south of Taupo off the Kordia/TVNZ mux and over to the Auckland TV1/2 feeds that are uplinked from Mt Wellington. Thus there was a disruption in PID details that would have totally confused any threaded series links that MySky uses.

If what I postulate is correct I think you just have to count this event (and probably a knock on effect for sometime) as one of those things that happen when complex technology goes a wrong. I think all involved at the broadcast end did there best to restore services (that were out for some time due to the uplink antenna tracking motor control failure) and create workarounds, what you are seeing is just some of the outfall from this fault.

When MySky was first introduced there was problems with series links in particular when connected with TVNZ channels, this was fixed, but as a result of this major system failure at TVNZ the wheels have for a period fallen off.

Clear any existing TVNZ based series links and recreate them, and hopefully they will all come right!

Cyril

JohnPorter

187 posts

Master Geek

#55066 8-Dec-2006 22:06

Interesting theory, Cyril, thanks for sharing. If it is the case, then there would be two discontinuities in the pids - one at the emergency switchover, and another when switching back. I assume it has been switched back? And theoretically any series links left intact over the whole time may come right, but any set during the time (like I did) would have to be deleted and redone. To be safe, I plan to rebook all of them - the TVNZ ones that is.

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manaia

272 posts

Ultimate Geek

#55080 9-Dec-2006 07:02

Cyril7 has it bang on in his explanation. SKY broadcast separate series link IDs for each TVNZ programme for each of the three regions. (Not doing this gives you the "..searching" problem from the early days where MySKY is looking for three instances of each programme to record but can only ever see one.) When the whole country moved to the Northern feed anyone with links depending on the Southern IDs would not get any more recordings. As John says, the only way forward is to record a new instance of the TVNZ programme and then series link off that to get the new ID. To my knowledge SKY has not switched back to the regionalised feeds but there would, as John says, be a second case of the same problem at that time.

JohnPorter

187 posts

Master Geek

#55087 9-Dec-2006 09:52

Thanks for that, Manaia. So we should be vigilant for when it happens again. Perhaps I should call customer services and ask them to warn me when they are about to switch back.

I'm sure they would be happy to oblige. If they used electronic notification systems, eg email or MySky messages, they woudn't cost anything. For that matter, a "network status" page on the website. They already have an email service for sports and movies. Why not MySky issues?

If this affects all the regionalised feeds, it includes the Sport channels and SkyBet?

Come to think of it, there could be two or more discontinuities when they switch back to regionalised broadcasts, as the changes in broadcasts have to be coordinated with the the changes in the EPG. If those changes are not timed right, there will be a mismatch when one changes, then another mismatch when the other changes.

OrangeDrink

51 posts

Master Geek

#55104 9-Dec-2006 16:01

Hmmm I think Rupert Murdoch hates me, which is fine the feelings mutual ;)

Just started watching Heineken Cup Rugby Live and it seems to be 2 hours of Bass Fishing instead. Hey at least it recorded something for a change though right? ;)

manaia

272 posts

Ultimate Geek

#55131 10-Dec-2006 07:04

JohnPorter: If they used electronic notification systems, eg email or MySky messages, they woudn't cost anything. For that matter, a "network status" page on the website. They already have an email service for sports and movies. Why not MySky issues?

That's a bloody good idea. This isn't 20th Century TV any more.

If this affects all the regionalised feeds, it includes the Sport channels and SkyBet?

No, I don't think so. Only TVNZ is truly regionalised.

Come to think of it, there could be two or more discontinuities when they switch back to regionalised broadcasts, as the changes in broadcasts have to be coordinated with the the changes in the EPG. If those changes are not timed right, there will be a mismatch when one changes, then another mismatch when the other changes.

The EPG data is just chugging along as before. If a programme has ID 1 in Auckland, 2 in Wellington and 3 in Chch, then your problem is that you linked to '3' but we now have you in a bouquet that only provides '1'. The first thing to do is to re-record the programme and link it again so your link is a '1'. SKY are still (I think) pumping out the three sets of data - at some stage they'll switch Southern customers back to their own bouquet (I think) with regional TVNZ and your links will either be the old '3' (and so still working) or be '1's and have to be reset.

JohnPorter

187 posts

Master Geek

#55135 10-Dec-2006 09:32

Ok, now I understand what "Failed: no signal" means. It means the program's time slot expired, but the expected program id wasn't detected on that channel. I would have thought "no signal" meant the dish was disconnected or something like that. That could explain other reports of "failed: no signal" - the id of the booking and the broadcast of the program were different.

I am still confused about the regionalised channels though. I thought the EPG and series link info was broadcast on Sky channels and everyone got all 3 versions. So my box would know to look for region 3. Which means it would have to be told to look for the region 3 version of a program which, on the EPG, contains all 3 versions.

Are you saying that the EPG for TVNZ is broadcast on TVNZ channels so I only get one version? Or perhaps that the region of a channel being received is auto-detected somehow at booking time?

manaia

272 posts

Ultimate Geek

#55147 10-Dec-2006 13:38

There are two mechanisms at work here: the bouquet you're assigned (which determines which of the three regional versions of TV1, for example, you see as channel 1 on your decoder) and the series/programme ID of each programme (which drives series link and comes with the EPG data). If you are in Chch, for example, then your account would be associated with the South Island bouquet, so one particular version of TV1 would take channel number 1 and its EPG data (superficially identical to the other regions/bouquets data) would appear in the guide in the first slot.

When MySKY was first launched we had the "..searching" problem on TVNZ because the programmes on all three services for each of TV1 & 2 had the same ID. Link to one instance of Coro St and the box would know that there were actually three transmitted programmes on three channels to record (strangely enough, all at the same time). That's when the bouquet steps in - your box can never see two of the channels so it cannot complete two of the three entries in the planner. The fix was to generate separate IDs for each programme in each regional feed. That way you can link to only the Chch copy of Coro St and ignore the other two.

So... when the regional TVNZ feeds dropped off the bird SKY put all its customers in the Auckland bouquet so that Southern customers would have a TV1/2. The trouble is that the series link mechanism doesn't understand bouquets. All it has is the ID of the series it was recording, which will now never recur. Or, as you point out, it could have been sighted but have mysteriously disappeared leaving a misleading "failed: no signal" error in its place. SKY would like to make series link "bouquet aware" so it can cope with this kind of drama a little more elegantly but that is a possible future feature.

Hope this helps,
M

OrangeDrink

51 posts

Master Geek

#55150 10-Dec-2006 14:34

There was some rumour over on the Tivo boards today that Apple are going to licence the Tivo software for their iTV PVR thing...

Frankly even though Series 1 software for Tivo is anything up to what? 10 years old now? It kicks the crap out of MySky's software and functionality.

It really shouldn't be so hard for Sky to figure out these problems if a small collective of Tivo enthusiasts can do it with fewer problems despite not having access to Sky's EPG...