Home theatre in a box - clarification

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groynk

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#108505 30-Aug-2012 14:38

I've been reading many threads, and it's taking a while to get my head around

In general I know that home theatre in a box (HTiB) = bad

My question is: Is the non-ugrade-ability due to the speakers being wired in/non standard connections, or just because they are junkish.

Take the onkyo HTIB sets for example:

http://www.avalon.co.nz/htib-sets/204-onkyo-hts6505.html

To me, this is very different from a cheap dvd/bluray player with 5.1 speakers hanging off it.
But can both be referred to as HTIB?
Would this onkyo example be an exception to the "avoid HTIBs" rule?

Jaxson

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#679291 30-Aug-2012 15:03

The main limiting factors tend to be:

Limited i/o points, so it's not always easy to connect too much more at a later date.
The DVD/Bluray drives are part of the amplifier, so if it fails you're taking out two items instead of just one.
Often the subwoofer requires a big cable to it and the speakers plug into that unit as well, so you can't upgrade the subwoofer as it's integral to the whole unit.
The speakers are usually pretty rough and in some cases the amplifier is tailored to try and correct those speakers, meaning you can't easily upgrade the speakers.
Often the speakers are 4 ohm, so they're not that common with regards to upgrading either.

Depending on what you're after HTIB can be ok, just I wouldn't want it as my primary system.

The above is more like an amplifier/speaker pack rather than an all in one system. Seems similar to these for instance, but including a receiver: JB Hifi Speaker-Packs

If you were thinking of going this way, why not opt for a separate receiver and some speakers. I mean if you're getting components anyway, you don't need to be limited to an all in one pack.

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NonprayingMantis

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#679295 30-Aug-2012 15:18

With that one, it is worth checking outthe differences between that model, and the one JBHIFI sell for $777
http://www.jbhifi.co.nz/home-theatre/onkyo/5-1-channel-speaker-pack-sku-28253/

It?s around $500 cheaper, so you don?t want to be paying that extra $500 if it is just for some features you aren?t going to use.

xpd

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#679297 30-Aug-2012 15:20

Jaxson: The main limiting factors tend to be:

Limited i/o points, so it's not always easy to connect too much more at a later date.

This is the main reason I havent bought one.... also, I have a PS3, so dont need the DVD/BR aspect of it.

If you dont have any gear at all, and want to watch movies at reasonable volume without splashing out worrying about upgrades in the near future, then a box system is fine IMO...

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groynk

234 posts

Master Geek

#679299 30-Aug-2012 15:23

Jaxson: The main limiting factors tend to be:

Limited i/o points, so it's not always easy to connect too much more at a later date.
The DVD/Bluray drives are part of the amplifier, so if it fails you're taking out two items instead of just one.
Often the subwoofer requires a big cable to it and the speakers plug into that unit as well, so you can't upgrade the subwoofer as it's integral to the whole unit.
The speakers are usually pretty rough and in some cases the amplifier is tailored to try and correct those speakers, meaning you can't easily upgrade the speakers.
Often the speakers are 4 ohm, so they're not that common with regards to upgrading either.

Depending on what you're after HTIB can be ok, just I wouldn't want it as my primary system.

Pretty much what I had gathered...

The above is more like an amplifier/speaker pack rather than an all in one system. Seems similar to these for instance, but including a receiver: JB Hifi Speaker-Packs

Thats what I need confirmed! So my example is the equivelent of a (eg.) TX-NR515 + onkyo speaker pack.
It is upgradeable then...

If you were thinking of going this way, why not opt for a separate receiver and some speakers. I mean if you're getting components anyway, you don't need to be limited to an all in one pack.

I know I don't need to be limited. Dunnersfellas advice ("I would suggest purchasing an audio visual receiver, BluRay player and two bookshelf speakers") makes total sense to me.
The attraction of the package is that it's all sold together giving a "pack discount" and "integrated/made to go together" perception
But really it just comes down to value for money, and of course like most, I want more (including quality) for less!

NonprayingMantis

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#679300 30-Aug-2012 15:24

thos Onkyo packs have heaops of I/O points. they are more like a reciever bundled with speakers than a 'home theatre all in one'

that range of models have had good reviews. I was ocnsidering buying one not too long ago before the wife put the kibosh on it.

Jaxson

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#679306 30-Aug-2012 15:34

groynk: The attraction of the package is that it's all sold together giving a "pack discount"

I'd venture to say that loosely, there is no such thing. Something has got to give to give you a real discount and it's typically quality.

groynk

234 posts

Master Geek

#679307 30-Aug-2012 15:34

NonprayingMantis: With that one, it is worth checking outthe differences between that model, and the one JBHIFI sell for $777
http://www.jbhifi.co.nz/home-theatre/onkyo/5-1-channel-speaker-pack-sku-28253/

It?s around $500 cheaper, so you don?t want to be paying that extra $500 if it is just for some features you aren?t going to use.

Yes it's tough comparing models I find. You can get the range from the onkyo site, but not pricing. Priced sites only have piecemeal ranging...
Then you throw in checking out equivelents from other brands and your head just spins!

JBhifi have good prices right now, and if I go there I'm choosing between HTS4505 and TX-NR414/TX-NR515 + trademe speakers

NonprayingMantis

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#679318 30-Aug-2012 15:58

the jbhifi one is the 4505, the one in the OP is the 6505.

onkyo website has all the spec.

looks like the maing difference is that the 6505 allows you to stream spotify and similar services directly, whereas the 4505 is not itself network connected.
speakers on the 6505 are a little more powerful too.

groynk

234 posts

Master Geek

#679342 30-Aug-2012 16:26

NonprayingMantis: the jbhifi one is the 4505, the one in the OP is the 6505.

onkyo website has all the spec.

looks like the maing difference is that the 6505 allows you to stream spotify and similar services directly, whereas the 4505 is not itself network connected.
speakers on the 6505 are a little more powerful too.

I only used the original link as an example of a receiver/speaker package labeled as an HTIB, if I want an HS6505 I'll find a better price. (At least under the 1000 stated in the description on that site! "...all for less than $1,000")

While we are going off topic... I'm sure there's no chance... but can anyone please confirm that I can't and would be crazy to even want to use my current Logitech Z506s with a receiver? (http://www.logitech.com/en-nz/speakers-audio/home-pc-speakers/7191)

Jaxson

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#679440 30-Aug-2012 19:56

groynk:

While we are going off topic... I'm sure there's no chance... but can anyone please confirm that I can't and would be crazy to even want to use my current Logitech Z506s with a receiver? (http://www.logitech.com/en-nz/speakers-audio/home-pc-speakers/7191)

You might be able to but you would need to confirm the ohm rating of those speakers is compatible with the receiver. Typically receivers can handle speakers that are 6 ohm and above. If the computer speakers are 4 ohm then no, they are outside this band. Often these computer setups don't bother to print the ohm rating on the speaker casing.

richms

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#679447 30-Aug-2012 20:25

Only cheap recievers will have issues with 4 ohm speakers.

In anycase you will often find that the equalized sound of a cheap HTIB will be better than a similar pricepoint cheap speaker and reciever put together since the HTIB will be highpassing the mains at a frequancy that is more suited to them, whereas a cheap reciever will normally limit you to a choice of "small" and "large" which usually means "way to high" and "none" for the highpass filter on the mains/rears etc, also they can and often do correct for the rolloff of the bass in the smaller speakers to a degree, which isnt something you can do on an entry level dedicated amp.

Under a grand gets you a hell of a lot of kit these days, just dont buy one with useless stuff you dont need.

Also check if it has audio return channel support. There are still ones out there that do not.

Richard rich.ms