Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.




Webhead
2220 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 764

Moderator
Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

Topic # 136448 27-Nov-2013 11:10
Send private message

Pretty interesting article. In a blind test several audio buffs were unable to tell the difference between Monster Cables and coat hangers:
 http://gizmodo.com/363154/audiophile-deathmatch-monster-cables-vs-a-coat-hanger

I have to admit I am not very surprised. Mind you, some amplifiers might have a problem with coat hangers and the resistance in them. But with normal speaker cables the differences between cables really shouldn't make a difference to a normal amplifier.

The whole story:
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/general-av-discussions/2512-speakers%3B-when-good-enough-enough-3.html#post15412

Now this is a rather brilliant post about Hi-Fi think (and provides some background on the guy posting about the experiment):
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/general-av-discussions/2512-speakers%3B-when-good-enough-enough-4.html#post15419






View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
 1 | 2
1092 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 182


  Reply # 941679 27-Nov-2013 12:34
Send private message

In my opinion super expensive cables aren't necessary however I was a bit surprised when I bought my first set of hi-fi book shelf speakers and connected them to the crummy old Sony HT amp I had at the time using thin cables that I had been using with little satellite speakers. They didn't sound that great, the next day I went and bought some $3/Meter fairly chunky OFC speaker cable and the difference was like night and day.




2385 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 286
Inactive user


  Reply # 941703 27-Nov-2013 13:22
Send private message

I installed new 14ga speaker wire to my car rear speakers earlier this year. The difference was very noticable when compared to the factory (+/- 20ga wiring)

Installing fancy oxygen-free monster cables would not have made any difference IMO. The gauge of the wire is probably the most important factor to consider.

 
 
 
 


913 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 52

Trusted

  Reply # 941704 27-Nov-2013 13:22
Send private message

Hmm... when I bought my stereo probably nearly fifteen years ago, we bought expensive speaker cables. The stereo was what you'd probably describe as high-end mass produced - $1000+ per component. We went to a lot of effort to get both it and the room set up well, and we could certainly hear the difference between different (expensive) speaker cables.

However now we have moved a few times and we have never bothered to set it up properly again. I would bet that any differences wouldn't be so clear - overwhelmed by a poor set up and perhaps by gear that doesn't sound as good as it did when new.




 

19282 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2600
Inactive user


Reply # 941710 27-Nov-2013 13:28
Send private message

Klipspringer: I installed new 14ga speaker wire to my car rear speakers earlier this year. The difference was very noticable when compared to the factory (+/- 20ga wiring)


Please tell me you are joking?

1198 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 149


  Reply # 941720 27-Nov-2013 13:41
Send private message

oxygen free copper is a myth.

as soon as it encounters the atmosphere it starts to oxidise, hence some companies are developing carbon based next generation cables.

as to whether there is an audible difference...

it depends.

:)

2385 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 286
Inactive user


  Reply # 941727 27-Nov-2013 13:45
Send private message

johnr:
Klipspringer: I installed new 14ga speaker wire to my car rear speakers earlier this year. The difference was very noticable when compared to the factory (+/- 20ga wiring)


Please tell me you are joking?


Not at all.

I have a pair Infinity 6x9's, 330 watt, 2 ohm in the rear. After installing them I originally wired them to the existing factory wiring. They sounded good but not great. I then replaced the speaker wire and their true performance was release. :-)

 

 


3344 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1089

Trusted
Vocus

  Reply # 941728 27-Nov-2013 13:47
Send private message

johnr:
Klipspringer: I installed new 14ga speaker wire to my car rear speakers earlier this year. The difference was very noticable when compared to the factory (+/- 20ga wiring)


Please tell me you are joking?


At this level it would make a difference.  The wiring installed in cars is pretty thin and not of great quality, the resistance would be significant enough for 4 ohm speakers.  Which reminds me I need to replace all the very thin speaker wire in my own car :/

2385 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 286
Inactive user


  Reply # 941735 27-Nov-2013 13:52
Send private message

ubergeeknz:
johnr:
Klipspringer: I installed new 14ga speaker wire to my car rear speakers earlier this year. The difference was very noticable when compared to the factory (+/- 20ga wiring)


Please tell me you are joking?


At this level it would make a difference.  The wiring installed in cars is pretty thin and not of great quality, the resistance would be significant enough for 4 ohm speakers.  Which reminds me I need to replace all the very thin speaker wire in my own car :/


There is a table on Wikipedia which I found really useful.

16ga would probably have been good enough for me too :-)





Webhead
2220 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 764

Moderator
Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 941758 27-Nov-2013 14:18
Send private message

From that Wikipedia article I found this. A worthwhile read:

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm

"However, there is another side to the story and not all amplifiers show instability or overshoot when burdened with high capacitance wire. For instance, when further tests were made with amplifier B using a capacitor to simulate a capacitive load, values of capacitance of up to 20,000pf (.02mfd) showed no change in performance. A well-designed amplifier will not have a problem with any of the high capacitance wires found to date."

...

"It can be solid, stranded, copper, oxygen free copper, silver, etc.--or even "magic" wire--as long as the resistance is kept to be less than 5% of the speaker impedance. There is no listening difference as long as the wire is of adequate size. Bear in mind, as previously mentioned, a well-designed amplifier will not have a problem with any of these wires."




4079 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1370


  Reply # 941796 27-Nov-2013 15:25
Send private message

TinyTim: Hmm... when I bought my stereo probably nearly fifteen years ago, we bought expensive speaker cables. The stereo was what you'd probably describe as high-end mass produced - $1000+ per component. We went to a lot of effort to get both it and the room set up well, and we could certainly hear the difference between different (expensive) speaker cables.

However now we have moved a few times and we have never bothered to set it up properly again. I would bet that any differences wouldn't be so clear - overwhelmed by a poor set up and perhaps by gear that doesn't sound as good as it did when new.


So , you thought the cable makes a difference to audio quality?  

I'm skeptical  -- I just don't think you cannot tell the difference between the high end cables and a suitable budget cable.  

I have a reasonably high -end setup, and I bought expensive / cheap cables over the years and I couldn't tell the diff -- and , my hearing is pretty good according to some tests I took a few years back. 

19282 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2600
Inactive user


Reply # 941797 27-Nov-2013 15:28
Send private message

Klipspringer:
johnr:
Klipspringer: I installed new 14ga speaker wire to my car rear speakers earlier this year. The difference was very noticable when compared to the factory (+/- 20ga wiring)


Please tell me you are joking?


Not at all.

I have a pair Infinity 6x9's, 330 watt, 2 ohm in the rear. After installing them I originally wired them to the existing factory wiring. They sounded good but not great. I then replaced the speaker wire and their true performance was release. :-)

 



Excuse me while I roll around on the floor LOL, Next time use 30 year old telephone cable and you would not be able to tell the difference

1092 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 182


  Reply # 941809 27-Nov-2013 15:39
Send private message

Righto. Mind giving some technical explanation between your fits of laughter?

How about this, having a party at my place decided that I wanted to have some speakers near a window so we could have music outside. I decided to try the CAT6 cabling in my house, used 2 ports with all conductors joined together in each port. I didn't expect it to sound great but thought it was worth a go. Not surprisingly it was totatly unworkable, no base at all, and fairly faint/distorted. Instead I just grabbed a roll or 1.5mm TPS power cable which I had been using to re-wire my house that work perfectly.




2385 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 286
Inactive user


  Reply # 941813 27-Nov-2013 15:59
Send private message

johnr:
Klipspringer:
johnr:
Klipspringer: I installed new 14ga speaker wire to my car rear speakers earlier this year. The difference was very noticable when compared to the factory (+/- 20ga wiring)


Please tell me you are joking?


Not at all.

I have a pair Infinity 6x9's, 330 watt, 2 ohm in the rear. After installing them I originally wired them to the existing factory wiring. They sounded good but not great. I then replaced the speaker wire and their true performance was release. :-)

 

 



Excuse me while I roll around on the floor LOL, Next time use 30 year old telephone cable and you would not be able to tell the difference


Don't think so. Telephone wire is about 22ga.

 

Besides. Telephone wire is not easily available unless I go digging for it :-)

 





469 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 107


  Reply # 941817 27-Nov-2013 16:12
Send private message

I'm sure there is a threshold effect between that where speaker cables matter and that where they don't, but the background post does have some good points about the subjectiveness of sound and what it's replicating...

But my experience is that those who believe that expensive cables matter will disregard any evidence to indicate otherwise, as will those who don't believe expensive cables matter...


913 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 52

Trusted

  Reply # 941821 27-Nov-2013 16:21
Send private message

surfisup1000:
TinyTim: Hmm... when I bought my stereo probably nearly fifteen years ago, we bought expensive speaker cables. The stereo was what you'd probably describe as high-end mass produced - $1000+ per component. We went to a lot of effort to get both it and the room set up well, and we could certainly hear the difference between different (expensive) speaker cables.

However now we have moved a few times and we have never bothered to set it up properly again. I would bet that any differences wouldn't be so clear - overwhelmed by a poor set up and perhaps by gear that doesn't sound as good as it did when new.


So , you thought the cable makes a difference to audio quality?  


Yes, both my non-audiophile wife and I heard the difference and we both preferred the red cables over the blue ones (even though the blue ones would have gone better with the decor) :-)

I have no idea what the difference between the cables was (beyond price) and I can't remember what the difference in what we heard was either.

surfisup1000:
I'm skeptical  -- I just don't think you cannot tell the difference between the high end cables and a suitable budget cable.  

I have a reasonably high -end setup, and I bought expensive / cheap cables over the years and I couldn't tell the diff -- and , my hearing is pretty good according to some tests I took a few years back. 




 

 1 | 2
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic



Twitter »

Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

Orcon announces new always-on internet service for Small Business
Posted 18-Apr-2019 10:19


Spark Sport prices for Rugby World Cup 2019 announced
Posted 16-Apr-2019 07:58


2degrees launches new unlimited mobile plan
Posted 15-Apr-2019 09:35


Redgate brings together major industry speakers for SQL in the City Summits
Posted 13-Apr-2019 12:35


Exported honey authenticated on Blockchain
Posted 10-Apr-2019 21:19


HPE and Nutanix partner to deliver hybrid cloud as a service
Posted 10-Apr-2019 21:12


Southern Cross and ASN sign contract for Southern Cross NEXT
Posted 10-Apr-2019 21:09


Data security top New Zealand consumer priority when choosing a bank
Posted 10-Apr-2019 21:07


Samsung announces first 8K screens to hit New Zealand
Posted 10-Apr-2019 21:03


New cyber-protection and insurance product for businesses launched in APAC
Posted 10-Apr-2019 20:59


Kiwis ensure streaming is never interrupted by opting for uncapped broadband plans
Posted 7-Apr-2019 09:05


DHL Express introduces new MyDHL+ online portal to make shipping easier
Posted 7-Apr-2019 08:51


RackWare hybrid cloud platform removes barriers to enterprise cloud adoption
Posted 7-Apr-2019 08:50


Top partner named at MYOB High Achievers Awards
Posted 7-Apr-2019 08:48


Great ideas start in Gisborne with hackathon event back for another round
Posted 7-Apr-2019 08:42



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.


Support Geekzone »

Our community of supporters help make Geekzone possible. Click the button below to join them.

Support Geezone on PressPatron



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.