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snewellnz

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#16545 15-Oct-2007 15:38
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Hi all, wondering if anyone can help me try and get the best signal from my sky box (normal sky not my sky).  I need it in simple mans terms though.  I currently have one SCART running from the sky box (black Pace not the newer silver one) to the back of my Sony Bravia TV, and one running to the back of my Sony DVD hard drive recorder.  These are good SCART connectors.  I seem to get reasonable picture on the TV through the Input select, but a little haziness on the yellow lines on the menu.  On the DVD though the picture is worse, with the little yellow lines on the menu being really hazy.  Is there something I am missing?

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cyril7
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  #91120 15-Oct-2007 16:10
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Could you explain exactly what Sky decoder you have, There is normally a manufacture label underneath or on the rear.

Depending on exactly which model Sky box you have will depend on what signals it will support. All but the very early Zenith and Pace DSR600/620 will support Component, RGB, S-Video and composite. The above mentioned older boxs will not support Component.

On all models the TV SCART will provide access to all modes, the VCR SCART only S-Video and composite. Most models will not allow S-Video on the VCR SCART if RGB or Component has been selected on the TV SCART.

The Pace DSR2000 has a seperate S-Video miniDin that is active at all times regarless of SCART settings.

The best to worst signals is Component/RGB, S-Video, composite.

I would use Component between the STB and TV, and depending on what box you have S-Video between STB and DVR. I imagine from your comments that currently you have both TV and VCR SCART set to composite.

What is the connection between the DVR and TV? Dont forget that the DVR has its own mpeg encoders that will reduce the quality due to the fact that they are quite cheap and have quite simplistic encoding techniques, and concatenating two low bit rate encodes is never going to look flash. This is one advantage of MySky over a DVR setup, in that the MySky has no encoders, it simply streams the incoming mpegs streams to the HardDisc.

To get the most out of you DVR you should have component between the DVR and TV, and if possible S-Video between the STB and DVR, otherwise composite is you only choice.

you will need to get a Component RCA to SCART cable to access the component output from the TV SCART, aswell as making the appropriate selection in the SCART setup menu.

Cyril

snewellnz

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  #91130 15-Oct-2007 17:29
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Thanks Cyril,

The Sky decoder is a DSR2000.  I have set the TV SCART to Componant and the VCR to S-video.  The cables between all the "parts" are all quality cables.  The SCART cables from the Sky box to the TV is the type that has video + 2 audio connections, and the SCART cable from the sky box to the DVR is the same as well as an s video connection which I have connected but am not sure if that is actually required as doesn't seem to make much difference.  The only output available from my DVR to the TV is via the componant cables, which again are of reasonable quality.  Is there an SCART cable available that can go from the Sky box to the TV in componant?  I have another rack available for this so would be happy to use it.  Last time I looked I couldn't find any and just assumed they didn't exist.  The signal from the sky box to the TV is reasonable, just so much worse when going through the DVR.  In the "old days" a VCR used to be good for getting a better signal! What is an S video mini Din?  You will have to excuse my ignorance I am sorry!

vindaloo
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  #91132 15-Oct-2007 17:47
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Hi Cyril, are you familiar with setups involving a PC as well? I currently have my PC connected to my TV using a DVI/HDMI connection. I also have a Sky Digital STB (not sure on model but its the little silver one that supports component) connected to my TV tuner card on the PC but the card only supports composite video so thats what I'm stuck with (its a generic Dell TV card that came bundled with my PC).
The idea was to use my PC as a PVR through Media Centre and it works well but the picture quality is very disappointing.
Any ideas or comments on how to improve things?

*TV is a Philips LCD that supports up to 1080i if that makes a difference.



allstarnz
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  #91135 15-Oct-2007 17:56
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the problem is, that with all of the above, you are converting your signal to analogue before it gets to its destination. Therefore there will always be loss of quality.

With Sky this is currently (and indefinitely) unavoidable, due to no 3rd party applications/hardware being able to decrypt the NDS signal Sky has, legal or otherwise. Also I suspect Sky don't necessarily run their content at the highest bitrates either. I recall when they rebroadcast TV1 and TV2, it was capped at 3mb/s, which is pretty low (TV3 goes at 6.3mb/s or so usually)

To see what I mean, record something off freeview via your HTPC, and then do the same via an analogue cable, you'll notice a massive difference.

Has anyone ever tested whether there is much of a real (ie visual) difference between S-Video and RCA? I have my Sky running into any device via RCA, but have considered changing this to s-video or (even better) RGB. Not sure if it's worth it though for 1% gain.

Regs
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  #91142 15-Oct-2007 19:17
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allstarnz:
Has anyone ever tested whether there is much of a real (ie visual) difference between S-Video and RCA? I have my Sky running into any device via RCA, but have considered changing this to s-video or (even better) RGB. Not sure if it's worth it though for 1% gain.


there is a reasonable difference between the s-video and composite signals. quite clearly noticeable.  i forget what the difference in lines of resolution are but its significantly more than 1%.  more like 25%+




cyril7
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  #91143 15-Oct-2007 19:18
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snewellnz, to get component video out of your STB you need to use an appropriate cable, Jaycar have WQ7255 that will give you component video YCrCb+audio, or you can get a simple adaptor plus cables from Dick Smith or Jaycar for around $20 but it wont do audio out of the SCART. It would appear even though you have selected component on the TV SCART you are only using composite (which also outputs simultaneously as component), you need the correct cable or adaptor.

On the DSR2000 there is a dedicated miniDin S-Video socket (looks like a PS2 mouse/keyboard connector), this outputs S-video all the time.

Vindaloo, it would appear you are stuck in the 1050s with composite.

Cyril

vindaloo
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  #91150 15-Oct-2007 19:48
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I was afraid as much, thanks for that Cyril.

So the only way to improve the picture in my situation would be to replace my TV card with one that supports component, is that right?



vindaloo
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  #91153 15-Oct-2007 19:58
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allstarnz: the problem is, that with all of the above, you are converting your signal to analogue before it gets to its destination. Therefore there will always be loss of quality.


Thanks allstarnz. I have noticed something else tho - does the signal degrade further if it is routed to the TV via a PC as opposed to direct?

Last night I sterted watching a movie on Sky via media centre and after grumbling (again) about how poor the picture looked, I unplugged the connections into the PC, plugged it direct into the TV instead and noticed an immdiate improvement. Still not very flash, but noticebly better than before.

Do you know if this is normal? Or is there something in my setup that I have got wrong?

snewellnz

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  #91237 16-Oct-2007 14:34
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OK, thanks everyone, I think I have it sorted now.  How does this sound though, I haven't tried it, thought I would ask you all first before I shell out too much money!

Run Sky SCART componant to TV.  Run Sky s-video to DVR.  My DVR has HDMI, (have just realised this), as does my TV, so I should be running HDMI from my DVD to my TV for the best result?  Do you think running HDMI from DVR to TV is better than running componant?

Thanks for your thoughts.

cyril7
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  #91249 16-Oct-2007 16:12
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Possibly your concidered solution may well be the best based on what options you have. I am always a bit hesitant about HDMI, I have had both good and bad experiences with it. A lot of that is based on the fact that some DVD players have soso deinterlaces, some very good. Depending on what display you have depends on where its best to do the deinterlacing. This is compounded by the fact that some DVD players and some displays will not work with 576i over HDMI.

If your display has good deinterlacing (what do you have?) then I normally recommend that you set either HDMI or component to 576i and let the display do the deinterlacing and scaling rather than have the DVD set to 720p or 1080i.

Cyril

BarTender
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  #91259 16-Oct-2007 16:32
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allstarnz: With Sky this is currently (and indefinitely) unavoidable, due to no 3rd party applications/hardware being able to decrypt the NDS signal Sky has, legal or otherwise.


I disagree with that :)...

http://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?ForumId=34&TopicId=16236&page_no=3#91170




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