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Delphinus

594 posts

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#288675 16-Jul-2021 13:52
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I have a friend who purchased a Microsoft Surface Pro 1796 (5th gen) back in July 2017. In February this year (3 years, 7 months from purchase) it developed a fault where trying to turn it on just flashes up the windows logo for a few seconds then it disappears.

 

I tried various combinations to reset it, bootable memory sticks etc, all which did nothing. It seems this flashing of the logo is a very common issue based on my googling.

 

Returned it to Noel Leeming in March this year requesting a CGA repair. They sent it off to FuturePC for assessment, and Microsoft declined the claim saying 3years 7 months was acceptable for this laptop. We pushed back when Noel Leeming told us this, who said they went back to Microsoft again, who again declined the repair. They eventually returned it just over a month ago.

 

Consumer NZ website says that Laptops have a life expectancy of 5 years.

 

What do you think are the odds of winning a disputes tribunal case for repair/replace of this Surface Pro 5 at the age of 3.6 years under CGA?


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elpenguino
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  #2745173 16-Jul-2021 13:59
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Dunno about your chances but considering the filing fees are ~$40, it'd be much cheaper than a new laptop.





Most of the posters in this thread are just like chimpanzees on MDMA, full of feelings of bonhomie, joy, and optimism. Fred99 8/4/21


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GV27
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  #2745179 16-Jul-2021 14:10
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Can it be upgraded to Windows 11?

 

If a functioning same model is approved to update to Windows 11 then I'd try my luck.

 

I could have sworn I'd seen a local case about an Apple watch not lasting long enough being ruled in favour of the complainant due to the premium price for the product, I would have thought a Surface Pro would be similar. I can't for the life of me find any proof it ever happened. See if you can get away with citing this ruling I might just have imagined. 


Delphinus

594 posts

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  #2745188 16-Jul-2021 14:21
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GV27:

 

Can it be upgraded to Windows 11?

 

If a functioning same model is approved to update to Windows 11 then I'd try my luck.

 

I could have sworn I'd seen a local case about an Apple watch not lasting long enough being ruled in favour of the complainant due to the premium price for the product, I would have thought a Surface Pro would be similar. I can't for the life of me find any proof it ever happened. See if you can get away with citing this ruling I might just have imagined. 

 

 

Good thinking, that's what I was hoping to achieve with this thread, some evidence to support it still being a reasonable timeframe.

 

I see that model is still getting some updates in March and June: https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/surface-pro-5th-gen-update-history-5203144a-90c1-63df-ce0b-7ec7ff32ff10




sxz

sxz
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  #2745189 16-Jul-2021 14:21
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I think you'd need a report from a professional as to what caused the issue is. I.e.

 

1. Was it caused by a software fault or user error?  If so, probably not their fault.

 

2. Was it caused by you not taking care of it (excess dust, moisture, dropped etc.)? If so, probably not their fault, although mobile devices do need to be sufficiently durable having regard to their intended use.

 

3. Was it a genuine hardware defect or durability issue?  They could be liable to repair.  I'd say a better than 50/50 ods, and the more it cost the more likely you would win.

 

You need to show that they have breached one of the CGA default warranties to be able to win a claim.  There are lots of reasons a PC might die, and only some of them are because it didn't stand up to the CGA standards.


  #2745194 16-Jul-2021 14:29
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Consumer say 5 years, but what consumer fails to mention is how often/much/how is it used.

 

a washing machine for instance they say 10 years (top and front loaders). Is this for someone using it 2x a week to do a load or someone used it 7+ times a week? there is a massive difference there.

 

Same deal with a laptop how often is it used? is it mobile a lot or does it sit on a desk its entire life, is it used every day? how many hours?

 

While i think 3 years is a little on the low side i don't think its unreasonable based on the above and also how ive seen some people treat theirs.


Delphinus

594 posts

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  #2745199 16-Jul-2021 14:35
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sxz:

 

I think you'd need a report from a professional as to what caused the issue is. I.e.

 

1. Was it caused by a software fault or user error?  If so, probably not their fault.

 

2. Was it caused by you not taking care of it (excess dust, moisture, dropped etc.)? If so, probably not their fault, although mobile devices do need to be sufficiently durable having regard to their intended use.

 

3. Was it a genuine hardware defect or durability issue?  They could be liable to repair.  I'd say a better than 50/50 ods, and the more it cost the more likely you would win.

 

You need to show that they have breached one of the CGA default warranties to be able to win a claim.  There are lots of reasons a PC might die, and only some of them are because it didn't stand up to the CGA standards.

 

 

1. I don't believe it was a software fault. Plenty of other surface's around the internet that just stop working with the logo flashing up for 1 second. If it was a software issue I would have assumed a factory reset (or reimage from usb) would fix it>

 

2. It looks well looked after. Was used with a case etc.

 

3. Feel it's a hardware defect. Common fault example1.

 

 

 

How do you diagnose the issue further when there are no error messages or faults showing?


  #2745214 16-Jul-2021 15:16
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Delphinus:

 

How do you diagnose the issue further when there are no error messages or faults showing?

 

 

you take it to a repair shop and have them investigate

 

Computer issues often dont have error messages




networkn
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  #2745237 16-Jul-2021 16:30
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To my mind, pay the $40 and log the case. I think your case is reasonable. Worst case you are out $40, and you don't win, best case they repair/replace, and likely scenario is they just replace it rather than even bother attending. I'd be pretty unhappy if I paid what those things cost on a device and it didn't last 4 years of pretty heavy use.

 

 


elpenguino
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  #2745389 16-Jul-2021 20:10
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See if you can read the system uptime from bios or the OS.
That will be in your favour if it's reasonably low.

Same if the case is pristine.




Most of the posters in this thread are just like chimpanzees on MDMA, full of feelings of bonhomie, joy, and optimism. Fred99 8/4/21


Oblivian
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  #2745396 16-Jul-2021 20:48
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Gen4s got an extra cover due to swollen batteries. But the makeup of themselves is that if they die in warranty, it's a 1:1 swap. They're not serviceable. So surprised they asked someone for fixing advise.

 

Most extra support/PC shops are as limited as the End User for diagnosing. Right up there with dumb ideas, but it fit the bill of what people wanted. Until they broke and realise how bad they are to do anything with.

 

Especially if your work has secure data disposal requirements. Want the SSD to recover? too bad. (later models may be a plug in) Fused to systemboard and glued shut

 

And the screens are under so much lateral tension, as soon as you use a tool in the side they shatter unless you heat them up to degrade the glue and pull apart with suckers. 


snnet
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  #2745493 17-Jul-2021 06:24
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Only really thinking outloud here but I wonder if there is a design flaw where the power is routed thru the battery before the system and if the battery is shot (which could happen after this length of time) maybe that's the cause? Feel for your friend, Surface Pros aren't cheap - I had an out of warranty repair done on mine and it was $520 - they just got me to send it to Australia and they shipped a new one back to me - don't know if that's a feasible amount in this case or not, but I did it thru their support web site (my repair was accidental damage) - I have moved away from them now just because they're particularly unservicable and I prefer my Dell which I can open up and order parts for anytime


baabits
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  #2745494 17-Jul-2021 06:55
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Just as an aside I have a friend who bought a Surface Pro 6 and has gone through three of them through warranty replacements. The last one they had Microsoft replace had the exact symptoms you described- the logo would flash for a few seconds, no spinny Windows loading boot screen icon would come up, and then it would shut down. It would also refuse to boot to UEFI Firmware or from USB using the volume buttons. They just sent him a brand new one. 

 

If the machine is still in good physical condition I'd take your chances with the CGA, gather all the evidence you can and make your case. They may just decide to replace it so as not to have to go through the hassle.

 

Good luck!!


Delphinus

594 posts

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  #2745540 17-Jul-2021 10:18
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baabits:

 

Just as an aside I have a friend who bought a Surface Pro 6 and has gone through three of them through warranty replacements. The last one they had Microsoft replace had the exact symptoms you described- the logo would flash for a few seconds, no spinny Windows loading boot screen icon would come up, and then it would shut down. It would also refuse to boot to UEFI Firmware or from USB using the volume buttons. They just sent him a brand new one. 

 

 

I don't suppose your friend would be willing to provide any evidence I can take to disputes to back this up? Eg any warranty documents or confirmations. Just something showing that the logo flashing up is a common fault, and Microsoft generally replace under warranty.


baabits
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  #2745554 17-Jul-2021 11:14
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Sorry he's from the states so it probably wouldn't be any use. He did send me a video of the issue when he was asking for help though:

 

 

 

https://streamable.com/v1f1g5


Delphinus

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  #2746509 19-Jul-2021 11:54
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Got a copy of the report from the repair agent for Noel Leeming.

 

Diagnosed to find Main Board faulty, replacement unit can be supplied.

 

Lets try disputes and see what happens!


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