Big Time plan end, Pro Broadband plan is recommended!!!

Forums › Spark New Zealand (including Skinny and BigPipe) › Big Time plan end, Pro Broadband plan is recommended!!!

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10 posts

Wannabe Geek

#367862 15-Aug-2010 15:42

robbyp: You pay for what you get. Unlimited will be limited in some way, as is not sustainable for any ISP to offer real unlimited plans, as you will always get those customers who will 'pig themselves'. You see at those all you can eat restaurants, people filling up their plates to the maximum. I pay per GB, which I think is the fairest way, and I see that ISPs in the US are now moving that way too. $1 per GB isn't too much to pay.

I assume you said this to garner some response LOL I download about 100-150 gig a month and dont find that excessive Im quite happy for them to throttle the speed dureing the day for p2p and torrents and the like as i download over night I simply use the net for accessing media i would other wise miss out on because i live at the last bus stop New Zealand

louisgoodier

27 posts

Geek

#367870 15-Aug-2010 15:55

Quite simply for telecommunications you have Vodafone and Telecom with a couple of other little companies trying to survive primary off of Telecom's network.

As far as I'm concerned I want Telecom bought out by the government. I pay my taxes and see it go to pointless projects (not to mention the doll) and never see any result of it. I would much rather the Government did something that affected New Zealanders positively.

Petition to parliament anyone? - Get the telecommunications network run by the govt again, and remove Telecom from the monopoly (almost anyway) they have with the land line network in New Zealand?

Unlimited is feasible as a plan providing the company behind it makes sure costs are covered overall. The problem with Telecom is greed, which is never going to end while they have no competition. They use plans like unlimited to draw in new customers, and then change the plan a few months after and up the price.

Ragnor

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#367881 15-Aug-2010 16:15

Yeah but when the government ran the phone network getting a land line connected took months....

I highly doubt having the government run anything will improve it.

louisgoodier

27 posts

Geek

#367884 15-Aug-2010 16:23

You're right. Thats why the government should own the network but not get involved with any end user.

This leaves the network completely open to any competitor, and a level playing field.

This way the best service provider will be the cheapest and friendliest, not the one with the most control.

The Government should have nothing to do with interacting with an end-user - only the providers, this way the govt maintains the lines and sells access to an ISP. This effectively makes ISP's resellers and takes the control freak part away from companies like telecom.

robbyp

1199 posts

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#367887 15-Aug-2010 16:33

sam1234:
robbyp: You pay for what you get. Unlimited will be limited in some way, as is not sustainable for any ISP to offer real unlimited plans, as you will always get those customers who will 'pig themselves'. You see at those all you can eat restaurants, people filling up their plates to the maximum. I pay per GB, which I think is the fairest way, and I see that ISPs in the US are now moving that way too. $1 per GB isn't too much to pay.

I assume you said this to garner some response LOL I download about 100-150 gig a month and dont find that excessive Im quite happy for them to throttle the speed dureing the day for p2p and torrents and the like as i download over night I simply use the net for accessing media i would other wise miss out on because i live at the last bus stop New Zealand

So you are using your location to justify the downloading of copyright materials? 100-150g is a huge amount of data, and I take it from your post that you maybe downloading media via p2p that is likely to be copyrighted. I get through about 30GB, and that is watching TVNZ ondemand, and general browsing. If you are downloading over 100GB that is going to cost the ISP a fair amount of money, probably more than you are paying for the service solely on the bandwidth cost alone.

I find it funny how people complain about the losing of their unlimited data plan, but they are then very hush hush on what they use it for.

robbyp

1199 posts

Uber Geek

#367888 15-Aug-2010 16:35

louisgoodier: You're right. Thats why the government should own the network but not get involved with any end user.

This leaves the network completely open to any competitor, and a level playing field.

This way the best service provider will be the cheapest and friendliest, not the one with the most control.

The Government should have nothing to do with interacting with an end-user - only the providers, this way the govt maintains the lines and sells access to an ISP. This effectively makes ISP's resellers and takes the control freak part away from companies like telecom.

That is what unbundling has done to an extent, for those ISPs who have chosen to install their own equipment in the popular exchanges. From what I have read, the government won't be paying for this fibre rollout, the ISPs will be, who will then onbill their cusomters.

robbyp

1199 posts

Uber Geek

#367889 15-Aug-2010 16:37

louisgoodier: Quite simply for telecommunications you have Vodafone and Telecom with a couple of other little companies trying to survive primary off of Telecom's network.

As far as I'm concerned I want Telecom bought out by the government. I pay my taxes and see it go to pointless projects (not to mention the doll) and never see any result of it. I would much rather the Government did something that affected New Zealanders positively.

Petition to parliament anyone? - Get the telecommunications network run by the govt again, and remove Telecom from the monopoly (almost anyway) they have with the land line network in New Zealand?

Unlimited is feasible as a plan providing the company behind it makes sure costs are covered overall. The problem with Telecom is greed, which is never going to end while they have no competition. They use plans like unlimited to draw in new customers, and then change the plan a few months after and up the price.

That is what this fibre to the door plan is doing. Also telecom will be splitting into two.

When companies offer unbelievable deals, they can often be unsustainable, if they don't get the expected uptake, or they get a higher proportion of users absuing the term 'unlimited' The fact that they had to change the plan, showed that someone who designed the plan did some major miscalculations.

Telecom has shareholders who need a return on their investment, so it is not greed, it is business. They are not a charity. Considering how much the shareprice has tanked over the last few years, it shows how much the shareholders are hurting.

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louisgoodier

27 posts

Geek

#367892 15-Aug-2010 16:41

@robbyp

Seriously - you can use 200gb now simply putting a fresh install on a machine and installing stuff like AVG, iTunes etc. Windows updates are phenomenal, thats why its all cached in NZ.

I myself work from home doing web development, I can easily use 80-100gb after backing up my personal websites etc before I even do any work for clients.

ISP's have ridiculously tiny costs for data transfer, its simply greed. Thats why Telecom's shares continued to increase even during the "XT failure".

freitasm

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Geekzone

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#367896 15-Aug-2010 17:02

louisgoodier: As far as I'm concerned I want Telecom bought out by the government. I pay my taxes and see it go to pointless projects (not to mention the doll) and never see any result of it. I would much rather the Government did something that affected New Zealanders positively.

Petition to parliament anyone? - Get the telecommunications network run by the govt again, and remove Telecom from the monopoly (almost anyway) they have with the land line network in New Zealand?

So you rather see the government running a monopoly then? Governments in general don't like competition to themselves. I would not trust the government (any government, regardless of political diretion) running a monopoly like this one.

louisgoodier: Unlimited is feasible as a plan providing the company behind it makes sure costs are covered overall.

Bandwidth is a limited resource, which makes it expensive at somepoint. Unlimited use of a limited resource is not sustainable and companies can't "make sure costs are covered overall".

louisgoodier: The problem with Telecom is greed, which is never going to end while they have no competition. They use plans like unlimited to draw in new customers, and then change the plan a few months after and up the price.

Like WorldxChange did before? Like Slingshot is doing from next week? Where do you draw the line? Telecom offering an "unlimited" plan is greedy, what about the other companies?

Do you want "unlimited" plan? Actrix offers one, if you are prepared to pay ten times more than what Telecom was charging.

louisgoodier: They use plans like unlimited to draw in new customers, and then change the plan a few months after and up the price.

Telecom already said that customers are free to go to another ISP, no early termination charges will be laid on their accounts. So what's the problem?

Talkiet

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#367898 15-Aug-2010 17:09

louisgoodier: @robbyp

Seriously - you can use 200gb now simply putting a fresh install on a machine and installing stuff like AVG, iTunes etc. Windows updates are phenomenal, thats why its all cached in NZ.

I myself work from home doing web development, I can easily use 80-100gb after backing up my personal websites etc before I even do any work for clients.

ISP's have ridiculously tiny costs for data transfer, its simply greed. Thats why Telecom's shares continued to increase even during the "XT failure".

I'm presuming you meant to say 200MB, or else I'll have to ask you to cite your sources.

And ISPs do not have a ridiculously tiny cost for BW. Telecom Retail buy BW just like any other ISP.

It's not greed. If it was greed, then other companies would be massively undercutting, even if it was only in the unbundled areas. That hasn't happened, or has it?

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

Ragnor

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#367908 15-Aug-2010 17:28

Less limited plans would be available and cheaper if adsl port cost, backhaul, domestic tranist and handover link prices where cheaper.

All Telecom pricing has to support a bloated sales, management and general cost structure imo.

Telecom aren't evil as some people are trying to make out, tt's not a problem unique to Telecom! Pretty much all large businesses have this problem eventually especially ones that had or have a monopoly position and are ex-government owned.

sam1234

10 posts

Wannabe Geek

#367916 15-Aug-2010 17:49

Ok There seems to be a lot of clever people here, and what we are discussing volume downloads really So first of all Is it illegal to record a tv show either here or in America say on a PVR ? My other comment to the righteous ones we will never get HDTV streaming movies or tv shows through the net all the time there are caps I don't know how its handled overseas but I believe it is starting to happen. I really get the feeling somone in corporte NZ is having a lend of us which is why we seem to pay excessive charges compared to other countries on banking Eftpos Mobile Phones and Internet

Mooseboy

124 posts

Master Geek

#367990 15-Aug-2010 21:08

robbyp:
sam1234:
robbyp: You pay for what you get. Unlimited will be limited in some way, as is not sustainable for any ISP to offer real unlimited plans, as you will always get those customers who will 'pig themselves'. You see at those all you can eat restaurants, people filling up their plates to the maximum. I pay per GB, which I think is the fairest way, and I see that ISPs in the US are now moving that way too. $1 per GB isn't too much to pay.

I assume you said this to garner some response LOL I download about 100-150 gig a month and dont find that excessive Im quite happy for them to throttle the speed dureing the day for p2p and torrents and the like as i download over night I simply use the net for accessing media i would other wise miss out on because i live at the last bus stop New Zealand

So you are using your location to justify the downloading of copyright materials? 100-150g is a huge amount of data, and I take it from your post that you maybe downloading media via p2p that is likely to be copyrighted. I get through about 30GB, and that is watching TVNZ ondemand, and general browsing. If you are downloading over 100GB that is going to cost the ISP a fair amount of money, probably more than you are paying for the service solely on the bandwidth cost alone.

I find it funny how people complain about the losing of their unlimited data plan, but they are then very hush hush on what they use it for.

I don't take any stock in that argument anymore. The fact that it is both cheaper and faster to send data by buying a 500 GB HDD and mailing it to where you want to send it speaks volumes about the price of an internet connection.

Talkiet

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#368011 15-Aug-2010 22:06

Mooseboy: I don't take any stock in that argument anymore. The fact that it is both cheaper and faster to send data by buying a 500 GB HDD and mailing it to where you want to send it speaks volumes about the price of an internet connection.

I think it speaks more to the phonomenally low cost per bit of fixed storage media now...

Oh, that and there's no opex costs or rentals associated with the HDD.

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

louisgoodier

27 posts

Geek

#368014 15-Aug-2010 22:11

Are you serious?

A hard drive gets made overseas, shipped here, marked up and sold on the shelf. I can buy it, write data to it until it full, get in the car drive to the post office and mail it all cheaper than firing that same series of electrical signals down a phone line?

GET REAL PEOPLE!!! YOU GET RIPPED OFF BY ISP's

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