Telecom 4G launch 12 Nov 2013

Forums › Spark New Zealand (including Skinny and BigPipe) › Telecom 4G launch 12 Nov 2013

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#931778 12-Nov-2013 23:46

Dingbatt: [snip]
I would be interested to hear from anybody who is using a Telecom 4G sim in a generic rommed One and how their 'customer experience' has been affected.
[snip]

Well, it's not an HTC One, but I'm using a Galaxy S4 with a custom (well standardish) i9505G ROM and sure enough, there's a bug that prevents LTE being picked up on the particular ROM I'm using. I had to download an App from the Play Store to force LTE on. (And then it worked great)

As an aside, you guys should absolutely trust anything Gajan says about the Telecom Mobile network and handsets...

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

JaseNZ

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#931781 13-Nov-2013 00:18

This was mine , top one before and obviously second one after. Bit of a slight difference.

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yggdrasil

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#931784 13-Nov-2013 01:19

I have a Samsung S4 I9505 I purchased from Noel Leeming. The IMEI checker says it's all good, and it has a "4G" label on the back cover. I ordered, and got, a 4g SIM and activated it (it's working).

Today I saw the text from Telecom saying 4g is active and we should reboot, so I rebooted, but kept getting 3g. So I took the phone in to Telecom's store in Riccarton Mall. Store tech checked everything and it was fine, so put me onto phone support. Someone there got me to check, and I found that my "Network Mode" menu gives me only three options - not the LTE one.

The Telecom tech 'escalated' the case to Level 2, and told me that she would call back when she got an answer on what I should do. I went to Noel Leeming, and when they looked it up, they told me I had got a 'Vodafone model'. Shortly after, the Telecom tech called me back to say that because it was not a "Telecom sourced device" they could not help me. Period. She gave me the number of a Samsung support line (looks like an overseas number) and that was it.

The phone was fully paid for with no subsidy (precisely so that I could change carriers if I wished) so I'm not trying to pull a fast one on another company. Shouldn't Telecom be able to help with this? Behodar said above that the Telecom site said that software updates for "all 4g compatible devices" would be made available (where is that link, BTW?). Telecom has been aggressively trying to get customer to switch to its network, doesn't that mean that customers who switch (like I did a few months ago) should be able to use their existing 4g devices?

Grateful if someone could clarify...

michaelmurfy

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#931790 13-Nov-2013 02:52

yggdrasil: I have a Samsung S4 I9505 I purchased from Noel Leeming. The IMEI checker says it's all good, and it has a "4G" label on the back cover. I ordered, and got, a 4g SIM and activated it (it's working).

Today I saw the text from Telecom saying 4g is active and we should reboot, so I rebooted, but kept getting 3g. So I took the phone in to Telecom's store in Riccarton Mall. Store tech checked everything and it was fine, so put me onto phone support. Someone there got me to check, and I found that my "Network Mode" menu gives me only three options - not the LTE one.

The Telecom tech 'escalated' the case to Level 2, and told me that she would call back when she got an answer on what I should do. I went to Noel Leeming, and when they looked it up, they told me I had got a 'Vodafone model'. Shortly after, the Telecom tech called me back to say that because it was not a "Telecom sourced device" they could not help me. Period. She gave me the number of a Samsung support line (looks like an overseas number) and that was it.

The phone was fully paid for with no subsidy (precisely so that I could change carriers if I wished) so I'm not trying to pull a fast one on another company. Shouldn't Telecom be able to help with this? Behodar said above that the Telecom site said that software updates for "all 4g compatible devices" would be made available (where is that link, BTW?). Telecom has been aggressively trying to get customer to switch to its network, doesn't that mean that customers who switch (like I did a few months ago) should be able to use their existing 4g devices?

Grateful if someone could clarify...

Nope, the problem is this is not a Telecom device, they only have the power to roll out updates to their own devices. You can try fixing it yourself by doing a factory reset then flashing the Telecom 4.3 build onto the phone effectively turning it into a Telecom device, else I'm afraid that third party roms / devices (even if it's a device Telecom sell) they can't fully support only since the software on the phone is different and designed to work on the carrier the phone was purchased for.

The link is here: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=97&topicid=133963&page_no=1#930099 - It's quite easy to do but please make sure you factory reset your phone before you install this software on it.

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JaseNZ

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#931796 13-Nov-2013 06:57

Strangely enough I do not get 4G at home yet the coverage map says I should where as I get it at work which is outside the coverage area , Easy come easy go at least I get it some of the time , at home its on wifi anyway.

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Dingbatt

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#931797 13-Nov-2013 07:32

Wade: @ Dingbatt - My telecom sourced One is working just fine on Telecom 4G, albeit because i have a non carrier branded rom but be clear the problem is limited to Telecom sourced One's running Telecom branded firmware, pretty much everyone else running a One is without problem

Having run so many unbranded roms over time I just can't buy into this argument that we need carrier branding

I guess this just reinforces my point. The HTC One works fine on the Telecom 4G network. If there isn't enough server space at HTC to push out the minor update then maybe that should have been considered earlier.

Perhaps I'll just bite the bullet and load the GPE version on my One.

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gajan

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#931798 13-Nov-2013 07:38

Dingbatt:

<snip>

The 'customer experience' line wears a little thin when it is trotted out time and again to explain massive delays in pushing out updated software. Especially when all you are doing is activating a piece hardware that was hobbled initially. There is no 'customer experience', beyond being able to select Auto GSM/WCDMA/LTE in the Mobile Settings menu.

<snip>

edit: Having just reread your post are you saying there is actually a problem with the One operating on your network? That would be a bit embarrassing for an award winning international handset....

As I eluded to earlier there is a lot of engineering and testing that goes on between us and device vendors, when dealing with carrier specific releases. Defects that we consider an issue may not be an issue with other carriers (either because they don't consider it serious - or doesn't affect them). The process involves a large dedicated engineering team that work through these issues, and it's simply not a cause of just enabling the "LTE" switch.

My comments and remarks are not necessarily of my employer.

freitasm

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#931799 13-Nov-2013 07:43

yggdrasil: The phone was fully paid for with no subsidy (precisely so that I could change carriers if I wished) so I'm not trying to pull a fast one on another company. Shouldn't Telecom be able to help with this? Behodar said above that the Telecom site said that software updates for "all 4g compatible devices" would be made available (where is that link, BTW?). Telecom has been aggressively trying to get customer to switch to its network, doesn't that mean that customers who switch (like I did a few months ago) should be able to use their existing 4g devices?

No, Telecom is not required to help with this. Take Vodafone HD voice for example. Although my (Telecom sourced) Nokia Lumia 1020 handles HD voice perfectly it is not in the list of devices they announced - because it's not a device they have tested and they won't say "yes" or "no" on something they haven't tested.

If anyone buys a handset from Telecom (or Vodafone) and it fails to provide a service that it is listed for then one has a right to complain. Third party handsets on the other hand (parallel imported or non-network handsets) is another case.

For example the LG G2 box says it supports LTE, and the device is only sold through Harvey Norman. I got one here for review a couple of days ago. I put the Telecom 4G SIM I have been using in the trial and nothing changed. I was able to enable LTE via its service menu but it goes away after a reboot. Should Telecom provide support on a handset they don't distribute or should LG release an update?

No, I don't think so.

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MikeB4

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#931800 13-Nov-2013 07:43

gajan:
Dingbatt:

<snip>

The 'customer experience' line wears a little thin when it is trotted out time and again to explain massive delays in pushing out updated software. Especially when all you are doing is activating a piece hardware that was hobbled initially. There is no 'customer experience', beyond being able to select Auto GSM/WCDMA/LTE in the Mobile Settings menu.

<snip>

edit: Having just reread your post are you saying there is actually a problem with the One operating on your network? That would be a bit embarrassing for an award winning international handset....

As I eluded to earlier there is a lot of engineering and testing that goes on between us and device vendors, when dealing with carrier specific releases. Defects that we consider an issue may not be an issue with other carriers (either because they don't consider it serious - or doesn't affect them). The process involves a large dedicated engineering team that work through these issues, and it's simply not a cause of just enabling the "LTE" switch.

+1

I would rather wait a few weeks and get a tested quality update, released under ITIL principles than a rushed mistake.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

plambrechtsen

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#931802 13-Nov-2013 07:45

ajobbins:
Dingbatt: There is no 'customer experience', beyond being able to select Auto GSM/WCDMA/LTE in the Mobile Settings menu.

Absolutely correct. There is NO TECHNICAL REASON to disable this in firmware. It's done for commercial reasons, and commercial reasons only.

I've gone to a Nexus 5. Carrier devices and firmware are a joke. Even my last phone (Galaxy S3) was an un carrier branded version and it worked 100% fine on a number of networks.

I look forward to both of you spending say, half an hour with the device testing team to see how completely incorrect both of your views are.

I am personally in complete agreement with any Telco (be it Telecom, Vodafone or 2D) deciding to disable features that aren't supported on their networks.

Is it better to satisfy the minority (sorry but it's the truth!) of ~~geeks~~ customers who desire the 4G option enabled out of the box on the phone when it could mean the phone accidentally tries to connect to the test network, locks onto another carrier, drops data more often due to switching or a whole myriad of other issues impacting ALL customers. Taking the pragmatic approach of waiting until the phone has been tested and approved to work correctly on the network the provider sold the phone on.

The other wrinkle is that for Android phones the images first need to be signed off by Telecom, then Google and then the OEM which all takes time which never helps.

Feel free to read this TelecomTech blog post from last year discussing the issue in detail: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/TelecomTech/8182

w2krules

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#931812 13-Nov-2013 07:57

Most interesting. Now I know why I haven't been able to get 4G/LTE overseas, even using other carrier's SIMs. Maybe a little note in the box to say 4G is disabled would have been helpful. Thanks Telecom.

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JonoNZ

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#931813 13-Nov-2013 07:59

w2krules: Most interesting. Now I know why I haven't been able to get 4G/LTE overseas, even using other carrier's SIMs. Maybe a little note in the box to say 4G is disabled would have been helpful. Thanks Telecom.

Apple Store for the next iPhone we buy...

You should not be having any issues with a Telecom supplied iPhone 5/5S/5C. Install a 4G SIM, activate the SIM, then restart the phone...and it just works.

Yabanize

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#931819 13-Nov-2013 08:15

Does Telecom even have the power to disable 4g on iPhones?

Telecom phones support 2g but they dont disable that

JonoNZ

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#931841 13-Nov-2013 08:38

Yabanize:
Does Telecom even have the power to disable 4g on iPhones?

Telecom phones support 2g but they dont disable that

iPhones are unlocked (in NZ) but do use carrier settings which are downloaded when you install a new SIM, and updated from time to time.

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#931846 13-Nov-2013 08:53

yggdrasil: I went to Noel Leeming, and when they looked it up, they told me I had got a 'Vodafone model'. Shortly after, the Telecom tech called me back to say that because it was not a "Telecom sourced device" they could not help me. Period. She gave me the number of a Samsung support line (looks like an overseas number) and that was it.

All devices are not created equal. There is customisation that goes into phone firmware to ensure that the device is fully compatible with the network that it's being used on. One other such example is fast dormancy - use a phone with this enabled on a network that doesn't support it and you'll find your battery life suffers significantly.

This is the very reason why models are sold in stores normally with very clear branding. If you buy a phone for one network and use it on another there is no guarantee that everything will work fine - this isn't anything new, it's been the case for 10+ years. The one exception to this is Apple where a lot more of the settings are controlled from the carrier pack which can easily updated easier.

Operator testing of firmware is something that is *very* important. The consequences of this can be degradation of a network for all users, something that's happened on a couple of occasions where Apple have deployed iOS updates that have had a major impact on network resources due to changes to the signaling.

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