Spark peering

Forums › Spark New Zealand (including Skinny and BigPipe) › Spark peering

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#2172626 4-Feb-2019 09:48

noroad: hahaha... yea, fake news is what you are trying to say then? I bet you don't want to quantify the "inaccuracies".

I never understand why certain individuals on here (or generally on the internet) think it's ok to treat another person this way.

He doesn't need to be on Geekzone and doesn't need to offer any help. But he is and explaining the situation to the best of his ability within the confines of his role. You don't need to be a d..k about it.

If you want to annoy him so that he never returns again to assist anyone then by all means keep on abusing him, but I for one appreciate all the assistance Neil gives.

I'll also include a quick snippet from Hurricane Electric who is one of the largest internet peering companies in the world:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-2rD2WiAV8&t=670

I'm sure with bi-lateral peering agreements Spark would happily peer with anyone if it made financial sense.

BarTender

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#2172641 4-Feb-2019 10:16

I think the best way for Spark to embrace Cloudflare is that *someone* sets up a video streaming service that even captures 1% of the NZ market and uses Cloudflare to deliver the content. Making sure that people actually use the service during peak hours (8-9pm most nights especially Sunday).

Until that happens I can't see a change.

Linux

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#2172643 4-Feb-2019 10:16

Well put @BarTender @Talkiet does a fantastic job here on Geekzone and we really appreciate it

John

Edit: Correct user name

Edit: Correct user name x 2

noroad

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#2172650 4-Feb-2019 10:24

BarTender:

I never understand why certain individuals on here (or generally on the internet) think it's ok to treat another person this way.

He doesn't need to be on Geekzone and doesn't need to offer any help. But he is and explaining the situation to the best of his ability within the confines of his role. You don't need to be a d..k about it.

If you want to annoy him so that he never returns again to assist anyone then by all means keep on abusing him, but I for one appreciate all the assistance Neil gives.

I'll also include a quick snippet from Hurricane Electric who is one of the largest internet peering companies in the world:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-2rD2WiAV8&t=670

I'm sure with bi-lateral peering agreements Spark would happily peer with anyone if it made financial sense.

I am doing nothing but pointing out the smoke screen in a slightly humorous way. Yes using Trump quotes is a little obtuse, but I have been in this industry in a long time and I've seen every excuse used for this artificially created de-peering situation. Trying to claim its too onerous for Spark to manage simple peering connections is a step too far and they need to be called out on it.

The Spark representative was not trying to help resolve the situation, just trying to make excuses for it. People don't like it when the smoke screen is identified and that causes upset, but how are we ever supposed to get this "Net Neutrality" issue solved if people are too timid to call it for what it is. Spark and Vodafone refuse to peer traffic within New Zealand for purely commercial reasons. Now that is fine, its their call as private companies but that does not mean they have the right to create a smoke screen and everyone else should be too scared to call them on it.

This routing issue is not caused by Cloudflare, its caused by Spark policies. If Cloudflare ponied up some money to Spark for Spark customers to receive the traffic then there would be no issue

Spark expects to have everyone else carry the huge amount of traffic that they are going to create without addressing the peering situation by funneling it through a third party (Akamai). I suppose at least by using Akamai they are not going to expect everyone else to pay them to receive it so we should be eternally grateful.

BarTender

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#2172651 4-Feb-2019 10:24

Linux:

Well put @Bartenter @Talkiet does a fantastic job here on Geekzone and we really appreciate it

John

Edit: Correct user name

Me cries a little. Get @Talkiet's name right on the second go but not mine.

Linux

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#2172652 4-Feb-2019 10:26

BarTender:

Linux:

Well put @Bartenter @Talkiet does a fantastic job here on Geekzone and we really appreciate it

John

Edit: Correct user name

Me cries a little. Get @Talkiet's name right on the second go but not mine.

@BarTender Have corrected now :)

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noroad

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#2172653 4-Feb-2019 10:27

Linux:

Well put @BarTenter @Talkiet does a fantastic job here on Geekzone and we really appreciate it

John

Edit: Correct user name

Edit: Correct user name x 2

Is he going to run away because I called him on one issue? I have not suggested he does anything but a good job on other things, just pointed out the smoke screen in this case.

noroad

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#2172655 4-Feb-2019 10:29

I'm out of this thread now...

BarTender

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#2172661 4-Feb-2019 10:37

@noroad: I am doing nothing but pointing out the smoke screen in a slightly humorous way. Yes using Trump quotes is a little obtuse, but I have been in this industry in a long time and I've seen every excuse used for this artificially created de-peering situation. Trying to claim its too onerous for Spark to manage simple peering connections is a step too far and they need to be called out on it.

The Spark representative was not trying to help resolve the situation, just trying to make excuses for it. People don't like it when the smoke screen is identified and that causes upset, but how are we ever supposed to get this "Net Neutrality" issue solved if people are too timid to call it for what it is. Spark and Vodafone refuse to peer traffic within New Zealand for purely commercial reasons. Now that is fine, its their call as private companies but that does not mean they have the right to create a smoke screen and everyone else should be too scared to call them on it.

This routing issue is not caused by Cloudflare, its caused by Spark policies. If Cloudflare ponied up some money to Spark for Spark customers to receive the traffic then there would be no issue

Spark expects to have everyone else carry the huge amount of traffic that they are going to create without addressing the peering situation by funneling it through a third party (Akamai). I suppose at least by using Akamai they are not going to expect everyone else to pay them to receive it so we should be eternally grateful.

And this in a nutshell is where you are completely wrong.

Akamai does have CDN nodes within Spark.

Cloudflare does not. When CF generates more traffic at peak than a single Spark UFB customer can create considering there are over 600k+ customers on Spark then I suspect that Spark may be interested in a bi-lat relationship but it's my understanding that CF aren't close to that.

As a ex-employee at Spark who worked with Neil and not wanting to speak much about it I can say that I personally reached out to CF on options with hosting their CDNs and had all of them rejected by CF so I do think it does take two to tango.

Update: Slight rewording.

michaelmurfy

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#2173094 4-Feb-2019 21:16

So I just found out something from Cloudflare. If an ISP doesn't have a peering arrangement they will route traffic on some plans depending on PoP load and also the customers plans.

Hi Michael,

You are totally on the right track, if we do not have a peering relationship with your network provider or if that cache location is under heavier load, we may manually route our self-service plans to other datacenters.

Most of the requests are sent to the physically closest cache location, but some requests are sent to nearing ones that are under a lower capacity.

Therefore, if you would like your zone to always be served by the closest geographic colo and a higher priority of traffic, please consider upgrading the plan level.

Cheers,

Michael Murphy | https://murfy.nz
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freitasm

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#2173097 4-Feb-2019 21:24

It makes no sense. There's no mention on the plans page about this "feature" - unless it's the Prioritized IP Range ("Enterprise Internet assets are placed on Cloudflare dedicated IP ranges, providing prioritized routing and protection to ensure maximum speed and availability.")

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#2173098 4-Feb-2019 21:25

I thought @freitasm already had a "higher level plan" with Cloudflare?

Doesn't explain why some times go via Sydney and others various overseas pops

freitasm

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#2173100 4-Feb-2019 21:30

dfnt:

I thought @freitasm already had a "higher level plan" with Cloudflare?

Doesn't explain why some times go via Sydney and others various overseas pops

It seems this "feature" is an enterprise plan thing only.

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#2173102 4-Feb-2019 21:31

TBH it shouldn't matter if traffic is a small portion of total traffic. spark should be doing the best they can for their customers. they pay the money for the best possible service and they have picked spark over other ISP's/choices.

over all the plans its a tiny portion of everyone monthly fee to cover it.

Pony up spark and stop putting politics above your customers.

Sounddude

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#2173104 4-Feb-2019 21:33

Jase2985:

TBH it shouldn't matter if traffic is a small portion of total traffic. spark should be doing the best they can for their customers. they pay the money for the best possible service and they have picked spark over other ISP's/choices.

over all the plans its a tiny portion of everyone monthly fee to cover it.

Pony up spark and stop putting politics above your customers.

Plenty of ISP's which peer (infact all of them, other than Spark).

If it means that much to you, vote with your wallet.

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