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70 posts

Master Geek

PrimoWireless Ltd
Lifetime subscriber

#115522 28-Mar-2013 14:23
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[13:29] <mercutio> it's 13:30

[13:29] <&freitasm> Ok... Thanks dredmore. Let's wait a couple minutes before starting

[13:29] <FTTHGuy> im here :)

[13:30] <DonG> is there an audio feed on this somewhere?

[13:30] <gunkaaa> mercutio: yeah, we have two at the moment

[13:30] <gunkaaa> one of which is my home one

[13:30] * can_i_haz_chees_er_fibre is now known as i_want_my_molenburg

[13:30] <LennonNZ> so how are we doing this.. one question per person so thus not to overload Telecom

[13:30] <&freitasm> Yes... One question and we wait for an answer.

[13:30] * djshadow (Mibbit@CF3D1272.95C82626.BB9D402A.IP) has joined #geekzone

[13:30] <&freitasm> We might not get an answer straight away if David don't have it

[13:30] <callumb> question: Why no VoIP?

[13:30] <&freitasm> So he might go to the next one and come back latyer

[13:31] <&freitasm> callumb just wait :)

[13:31] <GZ_AD117> so how long will this chat last?

[13:31] <&freitasm> Around 20 - 30 minutes

[13:31] <i_want_my_molenburg>

[13:31] <&freitasm> Let's do some introductions and house management

[13:31] <&freitasm> David (dredmore in this chat) is in the Central Product Group and is a Senior Propositions Manager and among the product development for Telecom‘s Ultra Fibre UFB product launched this week to residents, schools and businesses in most Chorus-live areas across NZ. 

[13:31] <i_want_my_molenburg> press release ^^^

[13:31] <&freitasm> Please be patient as David works to respond to each question as it is logged. From time to time he may have to move to the next question, where he doesn’t have the answer immediately to-hand. He will do his best to respond as and when he can.

[13:31] <&freitasm> We plan to go for 20 - 30 minutes

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[13:32] <&freitasm> Thanks David for coming online to talk to our folks here

[13:32] <+dredmore> Lovely to be here

[13:32] <&freitasm> David, I think the first question is Callumb's: why no VoIP?

[13:32] * FREENET (Mibbit@CC735C15.F931A007.370FDB10.IP) has joined #geekzone

[13:32] <+dredmore> Some pre-prepared answers for some questions

[13:32] <+dredmore> on Voip:We always planned to launch Ultra broadband over fibre ahead of voice over fibre because we knew it would be more complicated to migrate customer’s voice and low-speed analogue data services that also use traditional voice lines (e.g. monitored home alarms). We’re currently working with Chorus and the other LFCs to develop a robust voice solution that

[13:32] <+dredmore> also we have business IP voice

[13:33] <Lorenceo> What make and model will the CPE be for Telecom fibre connections?

[13:33] <LennonNZ> question: Can I order UFB From Telecom without any other services?

[13:33] <+dredmore> but that is targetting multi-line businesses with a requirement for SIP Trunking and IP Centrex

[13:33] <FREENET> If we get 100 megabit internet how long do we get unlimited data?  And we can download at full speed international?

[13:33] * Geekzone_user8230 (Mibbit@2AEA9AA8.2D858DE7.40ACF6DF.IP) Quit (Quit: ajax IRC Client)

[13:33] <&freitasm> Ok... So customers on Fibre+copper for voice will have the option to change to VoIP later or will be mandatory?

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[13:33] <&freitasm> Ok, four questions there... Let's give some time to get the answers.

[13:33] <+dredmore> do you mean naked BB?

[13:33] <&freitasm> Yes

[13:34] * i_want_my_molenburg is now known as fishyman

[13:34] <+dredmore> Pre-prepared answer again: Naked broadband is an emerging product for some customers.  We are looking at options to meet these customers’ needs. Meantime, we know the vast majority of New Zealanders genuinely value the convenience and calling value we offer in our broadband and voice packages.

[13:34] <+dredmore> I did write these BTW

[13:34] <LennonNZ> dredmore: I mean without having to buy any voice services (For example for Areas who don't have any Copper at all in their area and UFB Only)

[13:34] <+dredmore> Greenfield areas are no go for us at the mo

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[13:35] <LennonNZ> dredmore: any reason? Thats exactly what I'm talking about..

[13:35] <+dredmore> we're gutted about it and working hard to get something out there ASAP

[13:35] * freitasm sets mode: +m

[13:35] <&freitasm> Folks, I've set the channel to moderate

[13:35] <&freitasm> Please PM me with questions and I will post here.

[13:35] <+dredmore> Because we can only provide voice and support for analogue data services over copper right now

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[13:36] * PLambrechtsen is now known as plambrechtsen

[13:36] * freitasm sets mode: +v LennonNZ

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[13:36] * freitasm sets mode: +v mercutio

[13:36] * freitasm sets mode: +v plambrechtsen

[13:36] <+plambrechtsen> Howdy

[13:36] <+dredmore> yo

[13:36] <&freitasm>  For customers where UFB is not going to be installed for quite some time but have access to VDSL are you going to offer VDSL plans?

[13:37] <+LennonNZ> Thanks So you say you can offer a UFB service without Voice but you say you won't in UFB only Areas?

[13:37] <+dredmore> We’re looking closely at VDSL as part of our overall suite of broadband products. In particular we envisage VDSL as a potential solution for those customers who are either outside the UFB rollout programme, or who won’t have access to UFB in their area within the next few years. We hope to announce more on VDSL in due course.

[13:37] <&freitasm> When VOIP is available on fibre, will Telecom provide it through the ONT ports, or from a seperate ATA similar to Orcon and Snap?

[13:37] <+dredmore> All our UFB offerings require a copper voice line at this time

[13:38] <&freitasm>  If we get 100 megabit internet how long do we get unlimited data?  And we can download at full speed international?

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[13:38] <+dredmore> Initially our VoF product will be delivered via the ATA ports like some other providers do now

[13:38] * +LennonNZ ends his question. (dredmore) Thanks (it doens't say that on telecom's Website anywhere).

[13:38] <&freitasm> What make and model will the CPE be for Telecom fibre connections?

[13:39] * freitasm sets mode: +v DonG

[13:39] <+dredmore> the period of no data usage rating is TBC

[13:39] <+dredmore> but we will give customers advanced notice of implementation

[13:39] <+dredmore> meantime we would encourage customers to choose the datacap that suits their needs from the get-go

[13:39] <+dredmore> so there's no surprises when datacaps come in

[13:39] <&freitasm> What make and model will the CPE be for Telecom fibre connections?

[13:39] <+dredmore> BEFORE we implement data caps ALL residential prices will be at the 50GB plan level

[13:40] <+mercutio>  FTTHGuy ¦ UFB and fibre have been around for a long time, you have known for a while VoIP would be a requirement how come you still have no options after all this time

[13:40] <+dredmore> We have a residential modem from Technicolor (sorry don't remember model number) and a business modem from PACE bit feature

[13:40] <+dredmore> dual core processes, 128MB of onboard memory

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[13:41] <+dredmore> The technicolor has a

[13:41] <+dredmore> broadcom wifi chipset and 2 x 2 wifi

[13:41] * Geekzone_user4610 is now known as TalkieT

[13:41] <&freitasm> Folks, I have five questions in the queue. If you want to ask, please PM myself and I will post here.

[13:41] <+dredmore> the pace has a lantec chipset and 3 x 3 wifi and can support wifi G and N devices without slowing down to G speeds

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[13:42] <&freitasm> Next one: if we can download and upload and use our limit up in less than an hour what prevention can we have that someone doesn't accidentally use up all of our data?

[13:42] <+dredmore> we always knew we would launch BOF before VOF

[13:42] <+dredmore> VOF is harder

[13:42] <+dredmore> much harder

[13:42] * matthewc (Mibbit@EFD58535.CD3A06D8.40ACF6DF.IP) has joined #geekzone

[13:42] <+dredmore> sorry - wish is was easier

[13:42] <+dredmore> GOOD question

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[13:42] <+dredmore> Our trials have shown this is a very small risk

[13:43] <+dredmore> however, that's where the owner has full control over the connections usage. Security has never been more important on high bandwidth

[13:43] <+dredmore> connectivity

[13:43] <&freitasm> Next question

[13:43] <+dredmore> one customer that failed to get their firewall up and running had 2TB of data blown over the course of a weekend

[13:43] <&freitasm> Will Telecom be offering IPv6 on their fibre plans? If not, when will they?

[13:44] <+dredmore> that's one of the reasons why we have McAfee Security Suite free on our packages

[13:44] <+dredmore> IPV6 - will have to come back to you on that

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[13:44] <&freitasm> What, if any, performance guarantees or targets will be associated with the UFB plans?

[13:44] <+dredmore> in a day or so

[13:44] <+dredmore> sorry!

[13:45] <+dredmore> no performance guarantees on broadband over fibre, BUT

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[13:45] <+dredmore> we work our butts off to deliver a consistent service (as measured by people like TrueNet)

[13:45] <+dredmore> consistent, high speed service that is

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[13:46] <%Summer> Quote 685: <Xeo> last night i suddently woke up and i was shocked  <Xeo> i kept touching my cheeks and i realized i have long beard <Xeo> it was like i woke up from a coma!

[13:46] <&freitasm> Thanks... Ready for next?

[13:46] <+dredmore> yes

[13:46] <&freitasm> wifi - will there be a mixed radio - 5.x and 2.4 offering, as wifi is clearly saturating freq space in urban areas.

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[13:47] * ChanServ sets mode: +ao freitasm freitasm

[13:47] <%Summer> Quote 942: <freitasm> Well done, Extro, being a troll must be a birth thing. <Extro> yea was a birth defect.

[13:47] <&freitasm> Doh.

[13:47] <&freitasm> Anyway, next question?

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[13:48] <+dredmore> GREAT question, BUT don't know answer, will have to get back to you... we're writing a list of questions to get back to you on. Sorry

[13:48] <&freitasm>  followup question on the caps - have overage prices been published?

[13:48] <+dredmore> yes

[13:48] <&freitasm>  followup question on the caps - have overage prices been published?

[13:48] <+dredmore> depends on the plans, business is $1/GB

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[13:49] <&freitasm> Next question

[13:49] <&freitasm> Does Telecom have a clear policy on install costs for places with very long drives or multi tenant dwellings? Is that different between LFCs? How long until non-Chorus LFCs are included?

[13:50] * Geekzone_user3049 ( Quit (Quit: ajax IRC Client)

[13:50] <&freitasm> Pass this one for now?

[13:50] * Geekzone_user6205 ( Quit (Quit: ajax IRC Client)

[13:50] <+dredmore> obviously the 30GB plan is not one of the UFB ones

[13:50] <+dredmore> install costs are free for the VAST majority of residential customers, including all MDUs, very long driveways could be an issue in the future

[13:50] <+dredmore> but for now

[13:51] <+mercutio> has telecom got any influence on increasing the speed of rollout in Auckland which is clearly behind other centres.

[13:51] <&freitasm> I have seven questions in the queue folks. I think I will post these ones and then pause to see if we go longer than 30 minutes

[13:51] <+dredmore> we're not seeing any issues from Chorus - their deal with CFH is covering costs

[13:51] * freitasm sets mode: -v mercutio

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[13:51] <+dredmore> Telecom has no influence on rollout plans - sorry

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[13:51] <&freitasm> are you planning to unmeter nz web sites?

[13:52] <+dredmore> unmetering is not currently part of our proposition

[13:53] <&freitasm> Back to other LFCs, ahow long until non-Chorus LFCs are included? They're on trial now, right?

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[13:53] <+dredmore> Trial connections live with each now. Will start going live with them for managed internet, metro ethernet, IP-VPN, SIP Trunking and IP Centrex over the next few months

[13:54] <+dredmore> BUT

[13:54] <+dredmore> no confirmed dates for broadband over fibre launch yet, Sorry

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[13:54] <&freitasm> Thanks. Next: will you be using pppoe or dhcp on cpe's to connect to the internet

[13:54] <+dredmore> wish we were nationwide, but not yet

[13:54] <+dredmore> ahh

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[13:54] <+dredmore> you've out-geeked me but a long way

[13:55] <+dredmore> will have to get back to you on that one

[13:55] <&freitasm> Put on the list then please...

[13:55] <&freitasm> Next: Will UFB be available in the current Business Fibre areas?

[13:55] <+plambrechtsen> Freitasm.. We will be using PPPoE

[13:55] <+dredmore> P2P UFB is available in offcial UFB areas NOW

[13:56] <+dredmore> GPON is a staged rollout

[13:56] <&freitasm> Thanks...

[13:56] <&freitasm> Next one

[13:56] <&freitasm> Will telecom be doing work to drive consumer education around products that will suite UFB. eg will they run a 'device is ready' type compign to draw attention retailer CPE such as TVs that will benefit from UFB?

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[13:56] <&freitasm> For those joining us now... I have three questions in the queue. Please PM for questions to be relayed.

[13:57] <&freitasm> We should finish soon.

[13:57] <+dredmore> we are certainly planning extensive customer education campaigns yes. but not necessarily that particular one... good idea though, will pass it on to marketing

[13:57] <&freitasm> One for Peter now: if using PPPoE hwo will you overcome the MTU overheads of PPPoE, will your CPE be able to run larger MTU's or will they be locked at 1492 ?

[13:58] <+dredmore> peter?

[13:58] <&freitasm> If Peter is watching instead of drinking the afternoon beer?

[13:58] <+plambrechtsen> I believe MTU is going to be up to 5-6k, but customers should lock their MTU to 1492 otherwise you can get packet fragmentation

[13:58] <&freitasm> What bitstream service are you offering.. is it 30/10 with 2.5/2.5M CIR or higher? and the 100/50 with 2.5/2.5 ?

[13:58] <+dredmore> GOOD question

[13:58] <+plambrechtsen> The main rationale with PPPoE is full subscriber management vs IPoE aka DHCP where the subscriber mgmt isn't as great

[13:59] <+dredmore> we are offering 30/10 and 100/50 but not using the high-priority channels that these inputs come with - the CIR thing is a bit confusing in the public specs

[13:59] <+dredmore> it's not a CIR, it's a high-priority channel that you must specifically tag traffic to use

[13:59] <+dredmore> having said that the 'low' priority channel spec is AWESOME

[13:59] <+dredmore> in comparison to any copper technology

[14:00] <&freitasm> Folks... David needs to leave at 2:15pm. So I will make the next four questions and that's it

[14:00] <+dredmore> high priority is additive to low priority

[14:00] <&freitasm> Thanks David. Next one:

[14:00] <&freitasm> For the future data cap, will there be higher than 500GB cap, say like 1TB cap like Orcon offer? Also why they won't offer an unlimited plan, and why they chose to differentiate pricing tiers on data caps not speed?

[14:00] <+dredmore> so the access tail actually has more than 30/10 and 100/50

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[14:00] <+dredmore> we are always evaluating our data caps, but

[14:01] * Riahon ( Quit (Quit: ajax IRC Client)

[14:01] <+dredmore> I should say AND

[14:01] <+dredmore> We recently refreshed our residential packages, significantly increasing datacaps and introducing a 500GB. Based on detailed analysis of customer usage our 50GB, 150GB and 500GB, datacaps will meet the needs of 99% of our customers. For example, you can download five movies while watching 10 hours of video per day and use less than 250GB of data in a month.

[14:01] <+dredmore> before you complain

[14:01] <+dredmore> it's standard def media

[14:01] * djshadow (Mibbit@CF3D1272.95C82626.BB9D402A.IP) Quit (Quit: ajax IRC Client)

[14:01] <+dredmore> but still, 500GB is more than some of our Geni clients use at their head offices

[14:01] <&freitasm> Still related to caps

[14:02] <&freitasm> Actually, this was ansered before, so next topic...

[14:02] <&freitasm> Would new and used houses still be able to get phonelines without internet ie the elderly.  or would this be diffrent form?

[14:02] <+dredmore> Once we have VOF we will be offering a voice-only product

[14:02] * altron ( Quit (Quit: ajax IRC Client)

[14:03] <&freitasm> Is the VOF under trial now?

[14:03] <+dredmore> Yes, we've been developing and testing for some time, but it's a complicated beast

[14:03] <&freitasm> Ok... Last two

[14:04] <&freitasm> WHy are schools limited to 50/50mbit plans?

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[14:04] <+dredmore> we have a 100/100 access tail plan on GPON BS3a for $249 details here

[14:05] <&freitasm> Thanks...

[14:05] <&freitasm> Will we be able to pick up sensible fibre pricing where fibre exists (eg 10m from a NGN cabinet) in Christchurch where Chorus are not the LFC?

[14:05] * Geekzone_user0649 (Mibbit@6E7BFE78.2FE4F359.2C66A9F0.IP) Quit (Quit: ajax IRC Client)

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[14:06] <&freitasm> Perhaps put this in the "answer later"?

[14:06] <&freitasm> Last one please David: have you considered data rollover/databanking, and purchase of overage data packs rather than straight $x/gb?

[14:06] <+dredmore> we will be launching managed internet services down there soon, no official pricing yet. Broadband timings TBC sorry

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[14:07] <+dredmore> straight $x/gb is what we have for now, but we're always looking at our options on that one

[14:07] <+dredmore> or throttle on cap of course!

[14:07] <&freitasm> Throttle fibre? Never!

[14:07] <&freitasm> Do we have time for one last one?

[14:07] <+dredmore> haha! some prefer it to overage

[14:07] <+dredmore> I'm ok

[14:07] <&freitasm> Ok, last one: will there be any faster plans available for schools, eg 1gig ?

[14:08] <+dredmore> Right, well

[14:08] <+dredmore> schools could buy one of our P2P services at that sort of speed, but the price is very high

[14:08] * Zed ( Quit (Quit: ajax IRC Client)

[14:09] <+dredmore> Chorus have some exciting developments on GPON in the pipe though, and overseas examples tell us that GPON has a life well beyong 100Mbps

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[14:09] <&freitasm> Well thanks for your time today David. I am unmoderating the channel so people can say their own thanks.

[14:10] <+dredmore> Cool - loved it

[14:10] * freitasm sets mode: -m

[14:10] <+DonG> thanks David

[14:10] * iamatroll is now known as ptinson

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[14:10] <Behodar> Thanks :)

[14:10] <matthewc> cheers

[14:10] <mercutio> 75 people

[14:10] <FTTHGuy> cheers

[14:10] <&freitasm> Good numbers

[14:10] <GregV> thanks David

[14:10] <wired> Thanks

PrimoWireless - Connecting Taranaki

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738 posts

Ultimate Geek

Spark NZ

  #788785 28-Mar-2013 16:44
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For the gentleman asking about PPPoE vs MTU I have a full answer on this question.

With the Technicolor RGW a full 1500 byte PPPoE MTU will be supported.  So that's a full 1500 byte payload within the PPPoE frame.  Ethernet users should not see any fragmentation.

With the Pace RGW, only a 1492 byte PPPoE MTU will initially be supported.  It is expected that a firmware update later this year will allow a full 1500 byte MTU to be set with this piece of equipment.  In the meantime the RGW does support MSS-clamping so most users should not notice any impacts of not supporting the full MTU size.

My views are my own, and may not necessarily represent those of my employer.

70 posts

Master Geek

PrimoWireless Ltd
Lifetime subscriber

  #788930 28-Mar-2013 19:52
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Do you work for telecom? I am currently having an issue with local gen-i staff who will not listen and have installed gear which does not support MTU higher than 1492, and since it is a 100mbit connection its having to have the tcp mss changed, etc - I would like to get something official from telecom about this issue so I can show them and get them to change their mind and way of simple thinking.

PrimoWireless - Connecting Taranaki


738 posts

Ultimate Geek

Spark NZ

  #788963 28-Mar-2013 20:56
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Hi Fishyman, yes I do work for Telecom.  However unfortunately I know absolutely nothing about Gen-i products or processes Frown

Is there an account manager that you have which you can talk to?

My views are my own, and may not necessarily represent those of my employer.

70 posts

Master Geek

PrimoWireless Ltd
Lifetime subscriber

  #788964 28-Mar-2013 20:57
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Not likely, we aren't customers of theirs we supply UFB connections to their customers on the UFF network in Taranaki.

PrimoWireless - Connecting Taranaki

738 posts

Ultimate Geek

Spark NZ

  #789713 30-Mar-2013 19:14
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So ... unclear how you're connected to what Gen-i are supplying their customers??

My views are my own, and may not necessarily represent those of my employer.

70 posts

Master Geek

PrimoWireless Ltd
Lifetime subscriber

  #789716 30-Mar-2013 19:24
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Well as an ISP we want to make sure our customers get the best experience on our network, in this specific case the customer did not want our routers because of what gen-i advised them (our routers support higher MTU's) and if gen-i are installing devices which do not support higher MTU's then this will obviously effect the end user experience, its not a major problem as we can shape the TCP MSS but it would be nice for them to just listen and install routers that do support higher MTU's, especially if they are being installed for the new UFB connections and the customer is paying a top dollar ($5000 in this case).

PrimoWireless - Connecting Taranaki

BDFL - Memuneh
67785 posts

Uber Geek

Lifetime subscriber

  #789719 30-Mar-2013 19:34
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Answers to the questions that needed a followup:

Question: wifi - will there be a mixed radio - 5.x and 2.4 offering, as wifi is clearly saturating freq space in urban areas?
Answer: We’ve gone with 2.4 at this stage. 5.x is not yet ratified and we don’t want to go down a technology cul-de-sac. Plus it currently adds a lot of cost to the modems. We expect big progress on this front in 2014, and will bring through mixed radio solutions our customers as soon as we can

Question: will you be using pppoe or dhcp on cpe's to connect to the internet?
Answer: pppoe

Question: what are the modem model numbers?
Answers: Residential modem = Technicolor TG587n V3, Business modem Pace v5542



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4025 posts

Uber Geek


  #789798 31-Mar-2013 00:07
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I assumed 5ghz wireless n was standardized when 802.11n went final, but perhaps it was never ratified. a quick search doesnt reveal much.

Also people keep referring to them as modems, why is this when its a router (in the traditional consumer device sense of the word) when people associate a modem with a device which is converting from one medium to another (eg to DSL, Cable, 3G, etc). Are these CPEs not simply not routers connecting to the ONT, and the ONT is actually the 'modem'?

738 posts

Ultimate Geek

Spark NZ

  #789828 31-Mar-2013 08:29
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They are routers. There is no modem function in them for fibre. I suspect they are still referred to as modems for two reasons: 1) both the Pace and Technicolor both do DSL as well and 2) it is the language users associate with the device that allows them to connect to the network.

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