Now if this had been Telecom it would have been headline news

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#305750 9-Mar-2010 18:45

NonprayingMantis:
since you are quoting me, you will note I was quite careful to refer only to the first XT outage for comparison purposes, so as to exclude the 'multiplier; effect of having several outages over short time.

Obviously in terms of number of people affected I was out, but the point aobut it being the third outage is not relevant to that point. The first XT outage, I'm pretty sure, was only a few hours, even if it did affect a lot more people.

You may have compared the first XT outage, but you then refered to the compensation offered for the 3rd XT outage, so what one are you really comparing? The first outage had no compensation - so as per your example Vodafone should give no compensation :)

Or if you are really quoting the third, Vodafone has two to go before dishing out a cool 5 Mill... (looks both ways) (waits for network to crash)(checks PO Box for cheque)

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VFNZPaulBrislen

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#305753 9-Mar-2010 18:56

Curious... made me read the AUG again.

Just a couple of points:

1: The outage wasn't an outage. Customer could and did continue to make calls/send TXTs. The issue was SOME sites lost 3G but not 2G and SOME sites lost 2G not 3G.

2: The duration was from about 0830 to 1440 on Saturday.

3: My quote about hair trigger reaction was not about customers, it was about the Media. We had very little interest from customers about the issue because basically nobody noticed. But the media went bonkers about it and one "journalist" in particular went over and above the truth to deliberately misrepresent the situation.

Cheers

Paul

Paul Brislen
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http://forum.vodafone.co.nz

freitasm

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#305760 9-Mar-2010 19:04

PaulBrislen: 3: My quote about hair trigger reaction was not about customers, it was about the Media. We had very little interest from customers about the issue because basically nobody noticed. But the media went bonkers about it and one "journalist" in particular went over and above the truth to deliberately misrepresent the situation.

The NZ Herald do make it sound like your comments are towards customers:

Mr Brislen dismissed complaints as "hair trigger reactions".

"The moment they can't make a call on the first attempt or don't receive a text in three seconds, they jump to the conclusion there must be a problem with the network."

You are saying your words were distorted by whoever wrote that (gotta love newspapers with no bylines)?

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#305765 9-Mar-2010 19:20

The perils of the new handsfree kit... I wasn't going to answer the call while driving and Pop! there it was. Oh well.

From memory I said something along those lines but it was about journalists, not customers. I'm not sure I made it clear (Lincoln, the reporter who called, is usually very straightforward about such things) which is entirely my fault.

I've had more journalists call me about the non-outage than I had call about anything else in the past six months. TV, radio, newspapers, magazines... most got it - that it wasn't an outage. Some declined to understand and one went out of his way to get it deliberately wrong.

Cheers

Paul

Paul Brislen
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freitasm

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#305768 9-Mar-2010 19:23

I wasn't personally affected, but in any case calling that an outage is a stretch. If all descriptions are accurate that would be at most "reduced service". But hey...

VFNZPaulBrislen

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#305769 9-Mar-2010 19:26

tell me about it... mutter mutter....

still, plenty of learnings, for all of us in the business. The bar has been raised in terms of what's acceptable for a network. We really do live in interesting times. Six months ago this issue wouldn't have been reported if I bought them all a steak dinner.

Paul Brislen
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NonprayingMantis

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#305773 9-Mar-2010 19:33

exportgoldman:
NonprayingMantis:
since you are quoting me, you will note I was quite careful to refer only to the first XT outage for comparison purposes, so as to exclude the 'multiplier; effect of having several outages over short time.

Obviously in terms of number of people affected I was out, but the point aobut it being the third outage is not relevant to that point. The first XT outage, I'm pretty sure, was only a few hours, even if it did affect a lot more people.

You may have compared the first XT outage, but you then refered to the compensation offered for the 3rd XT outage, so what one are you really comparing? The first outage had no compensation - so as per your example Vodafone should give no compensation :)

Or if you are really quoting the third, Vodafone has two to go before dishing out a cool 5 Mill... (looks both ways) (waits for network to crash)(checks PO Box for cheque)

I thought Telecom gave out compensation for all the outages, no?

ETA:

I'm getting them muddled up it seems.

The firstoutgae was in December I think, and there was compensation for that, but it was not 1 months plan as I thought before. It was 3 days plan credit (or $10 on prepaid), plus credit for the monday's calls, and a free weekend of calling.
http://tvnz.co.nz/business-news/telecom-offers-compensation-outage-3309973

then there was compo for the Jan outage, which was more serious
http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/3283981/Telecom-to-announce-XT-outage-compensation

which was 1 or 2 week of plan charges depending on how hard you were hit,plus some other bits and bobs

then there was the 'loyalty bonus' of 3 months half price, for the most recent outage(s)

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#305785 9-Mar-2010 20:50

Ok Paul where are the Keys to the Black Helicopter? We can't use the red one for this mission might stand out a bit much

John

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#305794 9-Mar-2010 21:35

Don't you have them? Frack, but that's not good.

Are they down the back of the sofa in the ready room?

Paul Brislen
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nitrotech

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#305801 9-Mar-2010 22:41

PaulBrislen: tell me about it... The bar has been raised in terms of what's acceptable for a network. We really do live in interesting times. Six months ago this issue wouldn't have been reported if I bought them all a steak dinner.

Correct me if i'm wrong but isn't this your own (vodafone's) doing, by claiming 'new zealand's reliable network' you've raised the bar to a point where people on vodafone now expect 100% uptime.

I would say any customer on vodafone would have good cause for claim of loss of business during any furture outage on the vodafone network with the huge marketing push around reliability, CC would also take a dim viiew of such a marketing push if it is proven to infact be incorrect.

MikeyPI

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#305823 10-Mar-2010 01:18

nitrotech:
PaulBrislen: tell me about it... The bar has been raised in terms of what's acceptable for a network. We really do live in interesting times. Six months ago this issue wouldn't have been reported if I bought them all a steak dinner.

Correct me if i'm wrong but isn't this your own (vodafone's) doing, by claiming 'new zealand's reliable network' you've raised the bar to a point where people on vodafone now expect 100% uptime.

I would say any customer on vodafone would have good cause for claim of loss of business during any furture outage on the vodafone network with the huge marketing push around reliability, CC would also take a dim viiew of such a marketing push if it is proven to infact be incorrect.

huh? How does "most reliable" = "100% uptime". And they would have no case unless you could PROVE they were less reliable than XT

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#305824 10-Mar-2010 01:33

journalists: join random words in various orders to paint a story which when published often deviates from the truth!
interviewees: often say things to hide the truth (not implying anyone in particular) or give a biased story

the final product: read them with a grain of salt

nitrotech

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#305829 10-Mar-2010 07:18

MikeyPI:
huh? How does "most reliable" = "100% uptime". And they would have no case unless you could PROVE they were less reliable than XT

That might make sense if they claimed to be the 'most' relablie network but they don't they say 'new zealands reliable network'

rely - to depend confidently; put trust in

So if there is any downtime can you then couldn't rely on their network, dangerous marketing for VF if they have any outages in my opinion.

exportgoldman

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#305839 10-Mar-2010 07:51

nitrotech:
PaulBrislen: tell me about it... The bar has been raised in terms of what's acceptable for a network. We really do live in interesting times. Six months ago this issue wouldn't have been reported if I bought them all a steak dinner.

Correct me if i'm wrong but isn't this your own (vodafone's) doing, by claiming 'new zealand's reliable network' you've raised the bar to a point where people on vodafone now expect 100% uptime.

I was going to say that they only need to have less than 4 days of downtime a year to be better than XT, but we all forget about 2 Degree's which has had no public downtime, so you could claim false advertising for Vodafone as they only have NZ's 'second most reliable network', unless they put 3G in there somewhere, then they are back to only having to do better than XT.

Tyler - Parnell Geek - iPhone 3G - Lenovo X301 - Kaseya - Great Western Steak House, these are some of my favourite things.

johnr

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#305840 10-Mar-2010 07:54

exportgoldman:
nitrotech:
PaulBrislen: tell me about it... The bar has been raised in terms of what's acceptable for a network. We really do live in interesting times. Six months ago this issue wouldn't have been reported if I bought them all a steak dinner.

Correct me if i'm wrong but isn't this your own (vodafone's) doing, by claiming 'new zealand's reliable network' you've raised the bar to a point where people on vodafone now expect 100% uptime.

I was going to say that they only need to have less than 4 days of downtime a year to be better than XT, but we all forget about 2 Degree's which has had no public downtime, so you could claim false advertising for Vodafone as they only have NZ's 'second most reliable network', unless they put 3G in there somewhere, then they are back to only having to do better than XT.

2D is dependant on Vodafone as well so 2D customers in the area during the issues would of had issues as well. Many customers would not know this so its down time in there eyes

Higb

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