MBP - kernel panic

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sir1963

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#1603048 2-Aug-2016 16:01

beemerac3:

For over 3k on a laptop that is 5 years off the shelf I would expect more. As the CGA states: The CGA doesn’t define how long any product should last, it is based on what a reasonable person would expect something to last taking into account the amount of use, cost of item, etc.

Yeah, but he did not spend 3K+ on it.

And 6 years is basically double Apples warranty+ Applecare.

So, sorry, but 2-5 years would be realistic for a laptop (based on quality of product).

Yabanize

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#1603049 2-Aug-2016 16:02

So if it was already a known issue,

Perhaps you could have a go with the CGA as a substantial problem, meaning

"A reasonable consumer wouldn’t have bought the goods if they’d known about the fault."

beemerac3

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#1603053 2-Aug-2016 16:04

The reason he went for the 2010 build is because officially (according to Apple) these are NOT affected by the GPU issue. This was after the failure of the other one so hoped this would be ok for the next year or two. Shortly after it started exhibiting issues familiar to the build up of the death of the other machine.

I agree - it is a risk purchasing a 5 year old machine however having said that I have retained earlier models longer and with no issues.

I am not anti Apple as we have over 100 brand new 5k iMacs here at work but after two failures I am losing confidence that when issues arise they will do the right thing.

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#1603059 2-Aug-2016 16:12

beemerac3:

The reason he went for the 2010 build is because officially (according to Apple) these are NOT affected by the GPU issue. This was after the failure of the other one so hoped this would be ok for the next year or two. Shortly after it started exhibiting issues familiar to the build up of the death of the other machine.

I agree - it is a risk purchasing a 5 year old machine however having said that I have retained earlier models longer and with no issues.

I am not anti Apple as we have over 100 brand new 5k iMacs here at work but after two failures I am losing confidence that when issues arise they will do the right thing.

Believe me, I am no fan of Apple, but your position is amazing to me. Apple HAVE acknowledged the issue, they have set up a program for a period of time to replace machines/components, beyond the original warranty period, but that extra coverage has lapsed through no fault of Apple.

I think you should reconsider your position here. It's almost logic-defying (I somehow missed this) that you are claiming on a machine you bought SECOND HAND.

You have a 100 Apples at work which are working fine, but two failures has you doubting Apple.

Sorry, but I think you are being patently unreasonable in your dot-joining.

I'll say nothing else on this beyond these comments for fear of beating a dead horse, but for my money, there are considerably better (and more deserving) cases for Tim Cook to be doing something about, than this.

beemerac3

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#1603060 2-Aug-2016 16:16

There is no official acknowledgement of a fault with the 2010 build, only 2011 onward.

sir1963

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#1603063 2-Aug-2016 16:20

beemerac3:

As mentioned it is a 2010 with an initial purchase date of early/mid 2011 - so still 5 years old and I accept that. What I do not accept is a known fault that gets swept under the carpet. Apple were aware of this issue and it took ages for them to admit it.

This is the second unit we have had that has failed - the other was a 2012 unit.

But they did NOT sweep it under the rug. There was a free extended warranty for that fault. And they offered you a discount on a new machine.

And you did not even buy it from Apple, you bought it 2nd hand.

If you felt you were in the right, make a claim under the CGA, however that is not what is happening, what I see here is an attempt at a publicity campaign against Apple to try and force them into giving your son something for free.

Hell I have been there and done that with my sons laptop, 3 years old and I got a new motherboard under the CGA. There was no smear campaign, no lets make this go viral, this was me making a reasoned case under the CGA to Apple and they agreed. And if they didn't, I would have then gone to court over it and sorted it out there.

This smacks of you don't believe you are in the right hence the attempt at court of public opinion.

If ANYONE is being a bully, it is you. You are trying the wrong step first.

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beemerac3

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#1603087 2-Aug-2016 16:32

I will do the CGA this this week, however let me reiterate once more - They never acknowledged the issue on the 2010 build. Had this been one of the ones that they acknowledge as having the GPU fault (2011 build thru 2012) this would have been fixed/MB replaced by Apple.

Moving on - I will see how lodging a claim this week goes.

sir1963

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#1603088 2-Aug-2016 16:33

beemerac3:

The reason he went for the 2010 build is because officially (according to Apple) these are NOT affected by the GPU issue. This was after the failure of the other one so hoped this would be ok for the next year or two. Shortly after it started exhibiting issues familiar to the build up of the death of the other machine.

I agree - it is a risk purchasing a 5 year old machine however having said that I have retained earlier models longer and with no issues.

I am not anti Apple as we have over 100 brand new 5k iMacs here at work but after two failures I am losing confidence that when issues arise they will do the right thing.

HUH ???

Has Apple refused warranty on the new machines , or is this more smear tactics ?

What are you wanting...here lets give you a million dollars too ?????

I too have hundreds of Macs at work, had probably 2 die within warranty in 30 years, one iMac and an SE30 the SE30 replacement power supply was also Faulty.

The failure rate is about the same as the Toshiba Laptops, HP desktops we have too.

Sure we have had other Macs die at the 5 year + age, but after that age it is expected that the rate of failure will increase, that however does not say ALL will fail then.

I have working computers from the 1980s, but that does not change my expectation of realistic life of hardware.

sir1963

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#1603091 2-Aug-2016 16:40

beemerac3:

I will do the CGA this this week, however let me reiterate once more - They never acknowledged the issue on the 2010 build. Had this been one of the ones that they acknowledge as having the GPU fault (2011 build thru 2012) this would have been fixed/MB replaced by Apple.

Moving on - I will see how lodging a claim this week goes.

Perhaps that is because Apple has the statistics of the real failure rate of that model and it is not out of the ordinary.

And I have a late 2011 15" MBP and it is performing perfectly fine, and I bought it new from Apple.

I also have a 27" iMac also bought new where the HDs were supposedly faulty, mine again has not missed a beat.

beemerac3

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#1603097 2-Aug-2016 16:51

sir1963 - question for you as it appears you deal with pcb's. How effective is a reflow on a GPU as I have read a bit about this being done on some of the MBPs. Is this a lasting fix (1 year plus) or is it likely the issue will resurface?

Any suggestions on who best to approach to do this? I have had various quotes ranging from $149 up to $600 with a varying warranty of 3 - 12 months on the repair.

CYaBro

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#1603105 2-Aug-2016 17:04

Unfortunately you have no coverage under the CGA, since you bought the device 2nd hand.

Unless you bought it second hand from a retail store, then you would need to take it up with them, not the manufacturer.

As already stated those models were covered under an extended repair program, for 4 years from the original date of purchase, or end of March 2015, whichever gave you longer coverage.

That is a very long time in technology terms.

We have one of those models here in our workshop that we use all day every day and it functions perfectly fine as long as we use a little piece of software to disable the discrete graphics card.

You have to do this every time you boot up the device but small price to pay to be able to keep using the device.

We also missed out on the repair program, and only by a few months, not over year like yourself.

Here's the link to the software: https://gfx.io/

Just select the Integrated Graphics option so the discrete card is not used by the system.

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beemerac3

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#1603106 2-Aug-2016 17:07

I am sitting here reading an email from Apple that specifically states the 2010 build was NOT covered. The extension program did not include these.

mindtpi99

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#1603115 2-Aug-2016 17:31

beemerac3:

I am sitting here reading an email from Apple that specifically states the 2010 build was NOT covered. The extension program did not include these.

In that case, maybe there is no general fault with that particular model for the GPU? Maybe your one is just bad luck rather than a design fault? Apple is generally pretty open about recalls and so on. I'm guessing your one is a MacBookPro7,1, the one that was covered under the faulty video was (I think) the MacBookPro8,1 so yours probably doesn't have an extension program in place. Otherwise, though, like everyone has said, the extension program ran for 4 years on the faulty models - that's pretty generous

I think you're wasting your time with the CGA, according to the Consumers Institute re: private sales/secondhand goods:

"... don't expect much protection from the law if something goes wrong. Neither the Fair Trading Act nor the Consumer Guarantees Act applies. All is not lost though: you may get limited help from the Contractual Remedies Act if you've relied on a claim made by the seller that was important to you. The Act is complicated but in essence: if you have been misled you may be able to claim compensation"

Apple wasn't the seller, so your issue isn't with them, it's with the person you bought it off assuming they knew there was a fault. If Apple is offering you a discount for a fairly old computer you didn't buy off them anyway, I'd take it. Or just buy another MacBook of a similar vintage for a few hundred from a dealer where you will get some sort of basic protection. You can easily pick them up for $500

sir1963

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#1603141 2-Aug-2016 18:10

beemerac3:

sir1963 - question for you as it appears you deal with pcb's. How effective is a reflow on a GPU as I have read a bit about this being done on some of the MBPs. Is this a lasting fix (1 year plus) or is it likely the issue will resurface?

Any suggestions on who best to approach to do this? I have had various quotes ranging from $149 up to $600 with a varying warranty of 3 - 12 months on the repair.

Ta

God, thats a how long is a piece of string question.

I replace some SMD components myself but have never had to do a reflow on a GPU or anything that big (Been lucky !!!!!).

And at my age, seeing the damn pins is becoming a challenge anyway. (So no I won't do it for anyone else)

The question I would ask is how much is this worth to you and is it worth just another (potentially) 12 months or less.

If you assume the laptop is DOA then any failed repairs will mean you are no worse off (if they don't cost for trying).

What is it worth as scrap value (HD, Screen, Keyboard, etc) for use as a deposit

How much are the repayments on a new laptop (interest free terms ?)

Whats the cost of leasing a machine for the next 3-4 months until school finishes.

Risks of other components failing (Screen, CPU, RAM, etc etc etc) over the short / long term

From my own financial perspective, I am fortunate enough to just say F^&k it, and buy a new one, have a go repairing the old one, and if it works

give it to the kids/grandkids and if they only get 6 months from it, then thats that. Your mileage may vary as they say.

Is it worth $600.... not in my books, $150 ...unsure (and I would prefer to spend the $150 on a SSD/RAM upgrade on a new machine).

If you look at it as having a 5 year life (anything more is a bonus) , $3000 is $600 a year, so that is your limit I guess for 12 months of extra life.

Yes, its sh!t being on the end of these decisions, and you are going to get some wrong, but that is life, accept the choices were yours and move on.

CYaBro

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#1603254 2-Aug-2016 22:08

beemerac3:

I am sitting here reading an email from Apple that specifically states the 2010 build was NOT covered. The extension program did not include these.

They could be talking about the program that is still running that only covers the 2011 models.

The program that covered the 2010 models finished over a year ago so perhaps the person who emailed you doesn't even know about the 2010 program that ended last year?

And the fact that you even linked to the page on Apple's website yourself.

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