Today's Whiskey Tango Foxtrot

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#3215284 7-Apr-2024 13:42

You wonder about the police when an iPad is stolen in a house burglary, the owner uses find my device to locate it, gives the police the location, and they don't do anything about it.

I would have thought this would be an easy result for the police. Could possibly solve quite a few burglaries?

tweake

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#3215285 7-Apr-2024 13:49

k1w1k1d:

You wonder about the police when an iPad is stolen in a house burglary, the owner uses find my device to locate it, gives the police the location, and they don't do anything about it.

I would have thought this would be an easy result for the police. Could possibly solve quite a few burglaries?

that story has hit the headlines many times. its only an ipad, insurance will cover it. we are to busy doing other stuff. its not worth the effort.

public outcry, police declare "focus on burglary", then its "why is our rape/assault/etc case being dropped?"

kingdragonfly

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#3215291 7-Apr-2024 14:43

How many drug syndicates and professional burglars have been undone by speeding, or running a stop light?

Or child abuse case been filed because of an initial noise complaint.

It's investigating little crimes that can lead to big results.

From Wikipedia: Broken windows theory

"In criminology, the broken windows theory states that visible signs of crime, antisocial behavior, and civil disorder create an urban environment that encourages further crime and disorder, including serious crimes.

The theory suggests that policing methods that target minor crimes such as vandalism, loitering, public drinking and fare evasion help to create an atmosphere of order and lawfulness."

sir1963

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#3215292 7-Apr-2024 14:49

kingdragonfly: How many drug syndicates and professional burglars have been undone by speeding, or running a stop light?

Or child abuse case been filed because of an initial noise complaint.

It's investigating little crimes that can lead to big results.

From Wikipedia: Broken windows theory

"In criminology, the broken windows theory states that visible signs of crime, antisocial behavior, and civil disorder create an urban environment that encourages further crime and disorder, including serious crimes.

The theory suggests that policing methods that target minor crimes such as vandalism, loitering, public drinking and fare evasion help to create an atmosphere of order and lawfulness."

IIRC, didn't Hamilton trial large numbers of police patrolling at night and suddenly found they were catching a LOT more criminals ?

I suspect name and shame would also be effective...put in the mug shots too.

tweake

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#3215305 7-Apr-2024 15:51

kingdragonfly: How many drug syndicates and professional burglars have been undone by speeding, or running a stop light?

Or child abuse case been filed because of an initial noise complaint.

It's investigating little crimes that can lead to big results.

From Wikipedia: Broken windows theory

"In criminology, the broken windows theory states that visible signs of crime, antisocial behavior, and civil disorder create an urban environment that encourages further crime and disorder, including serious crimes.

The theory suggests that policing methods that target minor crimes such as vandalism, loitering, public drinking and fare evasion help to create an atmosphere of order and lawfulness."

absolutely. there has been some major cases that started off as a red light runner. even myself, a *555 call turns into a big police chase. small crimes leads into big crimes. then there is "rules that are not enforced do not exist" so people get angry when they finally do get enforced.

however policing minor crimes takes boots on the ground, resources and money. the 3 things they do not have.

sir1963

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#3215308 7-Apr-2024 15:59

tweake:

kingdragonfly: How many drug syndicates and professional burglars have been undone by speeding, or running a stop light?

Or child abuse case been filed because of an initial noise complaint.

It's investigating little crimes that can lead to big results.

From Wikipedia: Broken windows theory

"In criminology, the broken windows theory states that visible signs of crime, antisocial behavior, and civil disorder create an urban environment that encourages further crime and disorder, including serious crimes.

The theory suggests that policing methods that target minor crimes such as vandalism, loitering, public drinking and fare evasion help to create an atmosphere of order and lawfulness."

absolutely. there has been some major cases that started off as a red light runner. even myself, a *555 call turns into a big police chase. small crimes leads into big crimes. then there is "rules that are not enforced do not exist" so people get angry when they finally do get enforced.

however policing minor crimes takes boots on the ground, resources and money. the 3 things they do not have.

Apple sold 4.5 Billion into NZ, their margins are around 30%, however they pay $0 tax in NZ. THERE is a few hundred million in taxes to pay for stuff (And yes I am an Apple user).

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neb

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#3215353 7-Apr-2024 20:54

msukiwi:
From: https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/513615/police-abandoned-60-percent-of-reported-cases-in-2023

Police abandoned 572,037 of the cases reported to them last year - that's almost 60 percent.

That figure is kinda meaningless without a further breakdown of what the cases were. If it's Karen phoning to say that a black person is eating a sandwich in a public park (or whatever some of those US cases have been), or even one of a thousand types of nuisance complaints that it's a waste of police time to investigate then "abandoning" the case may be perfectly valid.

In other words, are we talking 572,000 murders, or 572,000 "the neighbour's dog keeps pooping on my lawn"?

Tinkerisk

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#3215359 7-Apr-2024 21:46

Oh how liberal we are in Germany!

Since last weekend, smoking weed (cannabis) in public (but not everywhere) has been legal, because they want to decriminalise the stuff (no, not an April Fool's joke). Let's see what the traffic statistics and health treatment costs have to say about this in the coming years. Perhaps another reason to ask for asylum in Germany.

Somehow that reminds me of the proverb: "If the donkey is doing too well, he goes out on the ice." 🤔

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neb

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#3215361 7-Apr-2024 21:55

Tinkerisk:
Since last weekend, smoking weed (cannabis) in public has been legal, because they want to decriminalise the stuff (no, not an April Fool's joke). Let's see what the traffic statistics and health treatment costs have to say about this in the coming years.

Translated: Since last weekend a law that was never enforced anyway has been officially not enforced rather than unofficially not enforced.

For people in NZ, of all the times you've seen, or at least smelled, marijuana smoked in public, have you ever seen anyone arrested for it? Excluding special events where either the police or the users were trying to make a point about marijuana use.

Tinkerisk

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#3215363 7-Apr-2024 22:00

I am not concerned with law and order. Everyone should kill themselves (or make a fool of themselves) with what they know best. But I am very much concerned with those who unfortunately become innocent collateral damage (e.g. car accidents).

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Firewalls do NOT stop dragons.
In effect we have everything to hide from someone, and no idea who someone is.

Ge0rge

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#3215364 7-Apr-2024 22:06

Why do you think that there will be more accidents? Surely you're not so naive as to think that people aren't doing it already? Do you really think that there is suddenly going to be a massive increase in consumption?

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neb

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#3215366 7-Apr-2024 22:09

Tinkerisk:
I am not concerned with law and order. Everyone should kill themselves (or make a fool of themselves) with what they know best. But I am very much concerned with those who unfortunately become innocent collateral damage (e.g. car accidents).

The point is that we already have marijuana used widely, and used in public. Changing the lack of enforcement in this case from de facto to de jure won't change anything, the use will continue as before.

Tinkerisk

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#3215372 7-Apr-2024 22:13

Ge0rge: Why do you think that there will be more accidents? Surely you're not so naive as to think that people aren't doing it already? Do you really think that there is suddenly going to be a massive increase in consumption?

Any facilitation also makes it easier to use it every day as a matter of course "because the step in front is no longer prohibited." The scent of what was already coming out of the driver's cab of the car directly in front of me at the traffic lights will certainly not become less, but rather more, if it is decriminalised. Now "only" its use in road traffic is a criminal offence. Before it was several offences. The inhibition threshold continues to fall.

Qui nihil scit, omnia credere debet.
Firewalls do NOT stop dragons.
In effect we have everything to hide from someone, and no idea who someone is.

neb

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#3215376 7-Apr-2024 22:21

Tinkerisk:
Any facilitation also makes it easier to use it every day as a matter of course "because the step in front is no longer prohibited." The scent of what was already coming out of the driver's cab of the car directly in front of me at the traffic lights will certainly not become less, but rather more, if it is decriminalised. Now "only" its use in road traffic is a criminal offence. Before it was several offences. The inhibition threshold continues to fall.

Statistics from Portugal's decriminalisation in 2001 contradict that. Virtually every statistic tied to drug use (HIV/AIDs, drug deaths, use among adolescents, police time devoted to drug enforcement, etc, declined. Some of the stats are a bit ambiguous, e.g. in some cases did a slight rise in use correspond to people being more willing to admit use after decriminalisation, but if there had been serious adverse effects we would have heard about them by now.

As a rhetorical question, has marijuana prohibition ever prevented one single person from getting it?

(And more generally, this probably belongs in its own thread. I don't particularly care about the whole topic, I just find some of the thinking around continuing prohibition pretty strange).

Tinkerisk

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#3215377 7-Apr-2024 22:31

neb: As a rhetorical question, has marijuana prohibition ever prevented one single person from getting it?

No, but who is harmed if a society does not tolerate it?

Qui nihil scit, omnia credere debet.
Firewalls do NOT stop dragons.
In effect we have everything to hide from someone, and no idea who someone is.

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