Changing of our flag , Yes or No.

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tdgeek

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#1450379 14-Dec-2015 21:27

amiga500: I find Red Peak to be visually jarring and to me just unpleasant. The winning alternative flag is not bold enough, I voted for the red and blue version, on the basis of which flag would I be least disappointed in should it win in March - if that makes sense. Although the winner is designed by one person, it could have been designed by a group of people striving for consensus. I shall be voting for the current flag.

I also think it is quite good that we have a flag similar to Australia. Although we are fierce rivals in sports, when one Country needs help who steps up first? Bush fires Kiwi fire fighters are over there helping. Christchurch earthquakes, Aussie Police helping out. RNZAF Orion looking for the Malaysian plane etc etc. Yes, true we are at times like fighting cousins, but we more alike than different.

That camaraderie is not due to the flag. Well, we don't have a flag, its a commonwealth flag that disappears to foreigners who see it as Australian, as due to size , Oz gets more air time than us. Ive seen that on sports broadcasts. We have zero recognition based on the flag

tdgeek

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#1450380 14-Dec-2015 21:30

trig42:
networkn: Not sure how it would be embarrassing for the Government?

I see plenty of people who would like it to be so, but I don't foresee embarrassment, I foresee them putting forward a motion and allowing the people to have their opinions heard.

Agreed, there will be people all over it if the current flag wins in the referendum.
Unfortunately it has become too politicized, and the 'left' will IMO be less likely to vote for change as they (or the stupid ones amongst them) will see it as a vote for Key.

How? If it wins the final referendum it is the popular choice. And like anything, the loser gets the squeaky wheel. Media are probably pre booking space for "articles"

I dont live on Stuff, nor the TV news, but I watch them often. Ive not seen a huge issue of the flag issue. Im not seeing agro and dissent every night. Here its "vibrant" discussion, but elsewhere not so sure

Geektastic

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#1450395 14-Dec-2015 21:59

Paul1977: I predict an overwhelming (and embarrassing for the government) landslide to keep the current flag.

- The 10% of voters who cast invalid votes as a protest will all vote against change.
- Red Peak supporters (which was still easily the 3rd most popular) will vote for no change.
- Anyone that didn't vote in the first referendum who choose to vote in the second will be voting for no change.

"No change" will win by at least a 2:1 margin.

I remain at least partially convinced that this is in fact the answer they want.

I think it may be an early move in a long game to spike the guns of republicans.

MikeB4

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#1450397 14-Dec-2015 22:03

Geektastic:
Paul1977: I predict an overwhelming (and embarrassing for the government) landslide to keep the current flag.

- The 10% of voters who cast invalid votes as a protest will all vote against change.
- Red Peak supporters (which was still easily the 3rd most popular) will vote for no change.
- Anyone that didn't vote in the first referendum who choose to vote in the second will be voting for no change.

"No change" will win by at least a 2:1 margin.

I remain at least partially convinced that this is in fact the answer they want.

I think it may be an early move in a long game to spike the guns of republicans.

God I hope I am not around when NZ debates the Republican idea, that will just be too embarrassing

Paul1977

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#1450564 15-Dec-2015 09:33

networkn:
Paul1977:
networkn: Not sure how it would be embarrassing for the Government?

I see plenty of people who would like it to be so, but I don't foresee embarrassment, I foresee them putting forward a motion and allowing the people to have their opinions heard.

Embarrassing because the entire process has been a debacle from the beginning, polls have consistently shown that the majority are against a change, and response to the alternative designs chosen by the committee ranged from cold to luke-warm.

I don't think that's embarrassing. JK wasn't the first politican to suggest it. Not everything has to be about roads, education and health care. We all get a chance to vote, the vote is fair, you get to pick which design you prefer, and then get to offer it against the existing.

He's not the first to suggest it, but he is the one really pushing it despite what (at least to me) seems to be a clear majority of the public against the idea.

I am personally not against the idea of changing the flag, but the process has been horribly flawed.

I would also question the process undertaken by the flag committee when selecting their final four, which essentially chose the eventual winner before any public vote happened (two Lockwood designs that are essentially the same, and two that were clearly terrible flag designs that only a small minority would vote for).

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