This makes me cross

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#1727867 28-Feb-2017 18:35

Geektastic:

Do we have Prison Farms in NZ?

If not, we should. Some long months of hard physical labour might wake these morons up a bit and actually produce some return to the taxpayer to offset the costs of their stupidity.

Or army boot camp. Compulsory military service for some people is a good thing, as they need order. I recall at school, the Navy used to come out to recruit, and you get free training, but you pay it back with service over a period of time. We have just got too PC, and the police can't really do very much, especially if they are under age. When I was at school in the early 90's we had all sorts of corporal punishment as well, such as canning, and for some people it worked. When it got removed, people played up a lot more, as there were minimal consequences. The problem is that sort of thing is always open to abuse, which is likely why it was removed.

kiwirock

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#1727888 28-Feb-2017 19:24

That would be the 'burn' part of burnout.

He was probably toasting the rotors at the same time to keep it still in the garage.

I wonder if the 'water' was alcohol. That would be just to funny.

Geektastic

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#1727972 28-Feb-2017 21:42

We could also have US style chain gangs picking litter etc under armed guard.

A bit of public shame for these criminals might help.

gzt

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#1728043 1-Mar-2017 07:13

Some kind of alcohol education could be more effective in this case.

driller2000

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#1728095 1-Mar-2017 09:00

Geektastic: We could also have US style chain gangs picking litter etc under armed guard.

A bit of public shame for these criminals might help.

From your posts it would seem you come from a generation where punishment, shaming, hard labour and bit of military service would "sort the buggers out."

However the evidence does not support such ideas.

You don't have to try very hard to find study after study which discusses the complexities of criminal behaviour and what leads to it - and the interventions that need to be implemented to get any real reduction in recidivism and a safer society as a result.

So yeah up to you ....... keep thinking the way you always have - or look for alternative ideas that will actually benefit us all - offenders included.

MikeAqua

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#1728128 1-Mar-2017 09:17

driller2000:

Geektastic: We could also have US style chain gangs picking litter etc under armed guard.

A bit of public shame for these criminals might help.

From your posts it would seem you come from a generation where punishment, shaming, hard labour and bit of military service would "sort the buggers out."

However the evidence does not support such ideas.

You don't have to try very hard to find study after study which discusses the complexities of criminal behaviour and what leads to it - and the interventions that need to be implemented to get any real reduction in recidivism and a safer society as a result.

So yeah up to you ....... keep thinking the way you always have - or look for alternative ideas that will actually benefit us all - offenders included.

The burn out incident wasn't criminal, but it did demonstrate a remarkable lack of thought about consequences.

I think a mistake that's easy to make (lot's of us make it) is to assume forethought on the part of others.

The reality is there are plenty of people who don't think before they act.

The prospect of punishment doesn't deter someone who isn't thinking ahead ...

Alcohol doesn't help. If drunk people thought ahead there would be no jager-bombs

Mike

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Jas777

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#1728133 1-Mar-2017 09:23

driller2000:

Geektastic: We could also have US style chain gangs picking litter etc under armed guard.

A bit of public shame for these criminals might help.

From your posts it would seem you come from a generation where punishment, shaming, hard labour and bit of military service would "sort the buggers out."

However the evidence does not support such ideas.

You don't have to try very hard to find study after study which discusses the complexities of criminal behaviour and what leads to it - and the interventions that need to be implemented to get any real reduction in recidivism and a safer society as a result.

So yeah up to you ....... keep thinking the way you always have - or look for alternative ideas that will actually benefit us all - offenders included.

Like what? Throwing money at it sure isn't going to solve the problem either.

driller2000

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#1728162 1-Mar-2017 10:04

Jas777:

driller2000:

Geektastic: We could also have US style chain gangs picking litter etc under armed guard.

A bit of public shame for these criminals might help.

From your posts it would seem you come from a generation where punishment, shaming, hard labour and bit of military service would "sort the buggers out."

However the evidence does not support such ideas.

You don't have to try very hard to find study after study which discusses the complexities of criminal behaviour and what leads to it - and the interventions that need to be implemented to get any real reduction in recidivism and a safer society as a result.

So yeah up to you ....... keep thinking the way you always have - or look for alternative ideas that will actually benefit us all - offenders included.

Like what? Throwing money at it sure isn't going to solve the problem either.

Google is your friend buddy:

Crime and effective rehabilitation

These were just some from a quick google with "crime and effective rehabilitation" as the search.

I am sure with more searching better sources could be found.

PS: And as to the OP - yep this sh&t pisses me off too - little prick needs to be punished/and rehabilitated - or he will likely do more more dumb sh%t.

But simplistic, antiquated knee jerk responses are not the answer.

DravidDavid

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#1728181 1-Mar-2017 10:30

I've got good money that says that the "water" was diesel or similar and the rotors were white hot.

gzt

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#1728195 1-Mar-2017 10:45

MikeAqua:
driller2000:

Geektastic: We could also have US style chain gangs picking litter etc under armed guard.

A bit of public shame for these criminals might help.

From your posts it would seem you come from a generation where punishment, shaming, hard labour and bit of military service would "sort the buggers out."

However the evidence does not support such ideas.

You don't have to try very hard to find study after study which discusses the complexities of criminal behaviour and what leads to it - and the interventions that need to be implemented to get any real reduction in recidivism and a safer society as a result.

So yeah up to you ....... keep thinking the way you always have - or look for alternative ideas that will actually benefit us all - offenders included.

The burn out incident wasn't criminal, but it did demonstrate a remarkable lack of thought about consequences.

I think a mistake that's easy to make (lot's of us make it) is to assume forethought on the part of others.

The reality is there are plenty of people who don't think before they act.

The prospect of punishment doesn't deter someone who isn't thinking ahead ...

Alcohol doesn't help. If drunk people thought ahead there would be no jager-bombs

Well, he was charged with a crime. Hence the intentional damage charges.

frankv

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#1728201 1-Mar-2017 10:57

DravidDavid:

I've got good money that says that the "water" was diesel or similar and the rotors were white hot.

I'm no expert on burnouts (since I have always had to pay for my own tyres), but it seems to me that in this case the (I assume) brake rotors wouldn't be hot at all. In a basement garage, you would have the front brakes hard on to stop the vehicle moving (i.e. no movement = no heat) and the back brakes off (else no spinning wheels = no burnout). Vice versa for a FWD, of course.

Any heat would be produced by the rubber of the tyres, and eventually by the steel wire reinforcing in them rubbing against the concrete floor. I'm guessing the wire scraping across the concrete caused sparks, which ignited the "water". But that wouldn't be a requirement... you could have burning rubber thrown off the tyres against the walls and any other stuff in the garage.

Do you want to snail mail me your good money as a cheque, or should I PM you my bank account? ;)

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BTR

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#1728205 1-Mar-2017 11:12

frankv:

DravidDavid:

I've got good money that says that the "water" was diesel or similar and the rotors were white hot.

I'm no expert on burnouts (since I have always had to pay for my own tyres), but it seems to me that in this case the (I assume) brake rotors wouldn't be hot at all. In a basement garage, you would have the front brakes hard on to stop the vehicle moving (i.e. no movement = no heat) and the back brakes off (else no spinning wheels = no burnout). Vice versa for a FWD, of course.

Any heat would be produced by the rubber of the tyres, and eventually by the steel wire reinforcing in them rubbing against the concrete floor. I'm guessing the wire scraping across the concrete caused sparks, which ignited the "water". But that wouldn't be a requirement... you could have burning rubber thrown off the tyres against the walls and any other stuff in the garage.

Do you want to snail mail me your good money as a cheque, or should I PM you my bank account? ;)

You do realise that with a RWD car that when you use the brake that brakes are applied to the rear wheels as well so there is heat. You can't simply choose which wheels you want to brake.

With FWD cars though you do have to option of using the handbrake to keep the car in place if its good enough.

Coil

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#1728212 1-Mar-2017 11:31

BTR:

frankv:

DravidDavid:

I've got good money that says that the "water" was diesel or similar and the rotors were white hot.

I'm no expert on burnouts (since I have always had to pay for my own tyres), but it seems to me that in this case the (I assume) brake rotors wouldn't be hot at all. In a basement garage, you would have the front brakes hard on to stop the vehicle moving (i.e. no movement = no heat) and the back brakes off (else no spinning wheels = no burnout). Vice versa for a FWD, of course.

Any heat would be produced by the rubber of the tyres, and eventually by the steel wire reinforcing in them rubbing against the concrete floor. I'm guessing the wire scraping across the concrete caused sparks, which ignited the "water". But that wouldn't be a requirement... you could have burning rubber thrown off the tyres against the walls and any other stuff in the garage.

Do you want to snail mail me your good money as a cheque, or should I PM you my bank account? ;)

You do realize that with a RWD car that when you use the brake that brakes are applied to the rear wheels as well so there is heat. You can't simply choose which wheels you want to brake.

With FWD cars though you do have to option of using the handbrake to keep the car in place if its good enough.

Have you never got vice clamps and clamped your brake hoses to drop it fat and not burn out your brakes.
Works a treat and you can put the power down easier!
I had a paddock hack a year ago that we just smashed the rear brake tubes flat so they wouldnt get pressure to the calipers... Please dont do what i do, its silly.... But fun.

LookingUp

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#1728234 1-Mar-2017 12:15

What really makes ME cross about this is that the father appears to have no responsibility for the damage even though:

1. He's the tenant, and therefore has some responsibility for reasonable care of the property

2. He appears to have been present when the incident occurred and could have potentially prevented it, but no...

3. He appears to have given permission for his son to use HIS car in that manner, or if the didn't give permission he certainly knew of his son's intentions, and could have tried to prevent it

4. It's his son, under "his" roof, with him present - while the "child" is old enough to be considered an adult in this instance one or other of them needs to be properly accountable

I'm strongly suspicious that Dad had a hand in this, but by playing things this way they've avoided responsibility for restitution.

There will be those out there who say "that's what insurance is for", but something needs to be done to protect landlords (and Housing NZ) from those that demand housing as a right but refuse to respect it.

Yes - I'm a grumpy landlord, currently looking at the cost of refurbishing a house that has been neglected by tenants. In 51 years of living in houses, I can't think of a single incidence where I've been involved in a hole being "accidentally" knocked in a wall, or large areas of plaster knocked off. Why is it that this is a regular occurrence in rentals? Grrr!

Things are LookingUp.... A photo from my back yard :-)

Linuxluver

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#1728261 1-Mar-2017 12:45

Geektastic:

Do we have Prison Farms in NZ?

If not, we should. Some long months of hard physical labour might wake these morons up a bit and actually produce some return to the taxpayer to offset the costs of their stupidity.

Some prisons have farms...and others work in the forests.

What you believe about prisons isn't true.......but I've never seen that get in anyone's way for minute when reality doesn't align with their preferred piece of fantasy.

I worked in an NZ prison for 2 years. All you folk who think they are the solution to minor offending have no idea at all what you're talking about.

Lock up murderers, rapists and violent people? Absolutely! Keep everyone else safe. But the idiots who do stuff like in the OP aren't those people.

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