Eva888: Lawyers, between $1500 -$2000 per annum.

Oh noes, that's like, almost a whole days Lawyer fees :P

empacher48:

 

Screams out to be just a money grabbing exercise more than anything. 

 

Screams of a government department recovering costs from their captive "users" for services that aren't wanted by the users nor of benefit to the users. The formula will be "how much does it cost to do what we're doing" / "how many people can we get money from". With the teachers over a barrel, there's no need to even think about changing the way they do things.

We have a Ministry of Education that costs us taxpayers a small fortune. Why in God's name can't they get on with it and administer education, of which teacher registration is surely a fundamental part? The MoT can process a car registration change for, what, $20? The Teacher's Council should subcontract the "teacher registration" aspect to the MoT.

Eva888: Lawyers, between $1500 -$2000 per annum.

Trolling?!

This topic has too many dismissive comments that suggest ignorance of the issues.

The TC has been created to perform some of those functions which more closely match the Legal Complaints Review Office Levy of $150 a year.

So a better and more accurate comparison would be $150 per year for lawyers vs the current $220, or the proposed $450, per 3 years would be a better comparison. But I'd expect that it should be lower for teachers because of economies of scale.

To compare with lawyers total levies you'd have to compare all professional fees for teachers. But unlike the Law Society fees, teachers pay fees to multiple organisations. The Law Society performs functions which, for teaching, are mainly performed by the teacher unions such as the PPTA.

https://www.lawsociety.org.nz/news/law-society-statements/practising-fee-to-rise-by-100-for-202122-year/

Regulatory fees and levies are compulsory for all lawyers and enable the Law Society to meet its legal obligations to protect the consumers of legal services and uphold professional standards.

 

The practising fee is not a membership fee. It provides the funding for the Law Society to oversee complaints, administer the Registry, provide input into law reform, and resources required to investigate cases as well as a share of operational costs to support these functions.

The NZ teaching profession has difficulty attracting new young teachers and is increasingly dependent upon older and semi-retired teachers. Covid has accelerated the trend to lose part-timers who are the main pool for relief teachers. The Teaching Council (TC) levy will have a greater relative impact on part-time teachers. Ironically, Covid will have reduced the TC levy impact because there will already be fewer of practising part-time teachers.

My wife is a secondary school teacher and I have always known a lot of teachers. 

I have observed that the TC:

- is extending its activities. The TC appears to be building an empire. For example, they are creating resources for teachers that teachers have said they don't want, not the least, because this duplicates work already being done elsewhere.

- is disciplining more teachers for issues that, from my perspective, do not really reflect upon their professional competence. I interpret this as the TC having to be seen to be doing something.

- does not appear to be getting rid of bad teachers any faster. The TC levy increase does not appear likely to make this work any better.

Hammerer:

 

To compare with lawyers total levies you'd have to compare all professional fees for teachers. But unlike the Law Society fees, teachers pay fees to multiple organisations. The Law Society performs functions which, for teaching, are mainly performed by the teacher unions such as the PPTA.

 

There is

• Teacher's council
• Union (optional)
• Subject association (optional)

That's all isn't it?

frankv:

 

empacher48:

 

Screams out to be just a money grabbing exercise more than anything. 

 

 

Screams of a government department recovering costs from their captive "users" for services that aren't wanted by the users nor of benefit to the users. The formula will be "how much does it cost to do what we're doing" / "how many people can we get money from". With the teachers over a barrel, there's no need to even think about changing the way they do things.

 

We have a Ministry of Education that costs us taxpayers a small fortune. Why in God's name can't they get on with it and administer education, of which teacher registration is surely a fundamental part? The MoT can process a car registration change for, what, $20? The Teacher's Council should subcontract the "teacher registration" aspect to the MoT.

 

 

 

There's a fair bit more to renewing a practicing certificate than there is in registering a motor vehicle. It not at all comparable.

Geektastic: I'm surprised it's not been rebranded as a "convenience fee"...

We have "knowledge" and "innovation" fees here in Dubai. 

Technofreak:

 

Notably they didn't talk about their fees which I rather suspect dwarf the certificate fee. 

$665 per annum vs $472/3 years

The first one is of course optional, comes with considerable included value and doesn't dwarf the second.

Andib:

 

Divhon88:

 

Nurse's annual pracitisng fee is $110 a year although they are payed for by the employers I'm sure they won't mind paying $153 a year if they'll only have to work Mon-Fri 9am-3pm and be paid in full salary and just working 10 months a year.

 

 

This is going off topic but based on all the teachers I know (many family members are teachers) this is outright incorrect.
Teachers work a LOT longer than the 9-3 Monday to Friday they're in front of kids. 

 

I have to chime in here too. I'm with @andib and @divhon88 is 1000% incorrect. 

My wife is a primary school teacher. She leaves the house at 7:45am and is back at 5pm or later each day. Add onto that at few hours most nights doing planning or making resources (Often helped my me. I'm an expert at laminating now) plus frequently a visit to school on the weekend (also with me usually).

Then there's the 2-3 weeks spent at school in January setting up the classroom, and at least 3-4 days during the term break.

Don't even get me started on the 'school stuff' line in our budget. Her first year of teaching she spent more than $10k building up her resources, and it's been a solid 5 figures each year after that.

danfaulknor:

 

Andib:

 

This is going off topic but based on all the teachers I know (many family members are teachers) this is outright incorrect.
Teachers work a LOT longer than the 9-3 Monday to Friday they're in front of kids. 

 

 

I have to chime in here too. I'm with @andib and @divhon88 is 1000% incorrect. 

 

My wife is a primary school teacher. She leaves the house at 7:45am and is back at 5pm or later each day. Add onto that at few hours most nights doing planning or making resources (Often helped my me. I'm an expert at laminating now) plus frequently a visit to school on the weekend (also with me usually).

 

Then there's the 2-3 weeks spent at school in January setting up the classroom, and at least 3-4 days during the term break.

 

Don't even get me started on the 'school stuff' line in our budget. Her first year of teaching she spent more than $10k building up her resources, and it's been a solid 5 figures each year after that.

 

I've given up engaging with people who make the sort of comment above. They are at best ignorant and generally disingenuous. 

Handle9:

 

There's a fair bit more to renewing a practicing certificate than there is in registering a motor vehicle. It not at all comparable.

 

Which is why the consultation document separates the change into the Fee of $128 which is the actual cost involved with renewing the practicing certificate and the Levy of $378 for the "day to day running and expenses of the Teachers Council".

Then tell us this Levy will be adjusted each year AND be able to recoverable for past expenses should the levy you paid three years ago did not cover their costs.

It's worth having a quick read over their Annual Report which can be found here

All sorts of good information in there, such as their new initiatives etc - which to me feel like they should be centrally funded and not through the member fees. But that's my opinion.

This thread has gone on a bit of a tangent which isn't unusual for many threads. 😀

I was making comment about the fee/levy charged by the statutory body that enables teachers to be able to ply their craft. My point was there are many other occupations where such statutory body levies are applied and these levies are of a similar magnitude to the proposed new Teacher Council fee. In comparison to these other levies/fees the Teacher Council levy isn't out of the ordinary. If teachers think the Teacher Council levy is too high then they are out of touch with the rest of the world.

I find it impossible to believe that someone would leave a profession just because they had to pay another $70 or so each year to get their practising certificate. Most probably spend more than that per month in lattes.

My other point is that for all other occupations where this sort of levy is imposed the employer pays for it. Why hasn't the NZEI negotiated such a deal for its members?