Car Accident - Who is at fault here?

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147 posts

Master Geek
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#294964 31-Jan-2010 17:14

The wording on the road code is either wrong or correct. I don't know if the following is a recommendation or the actual law:

You can only pass on the left when:
There are two or more lanes on your side of the centre line and you are able to pass safely by using the left-hand lane

The reason I don't know if it is the actual law is because the road code also says:
Remember, it is against the law to cross over a no-passing line on your side of the centre line to pass another vehicle.

I don't even know if the two-second rule is a recommendation or the actual law.

You say you have 2 witnesses and the other driver has none? How can this be? If the witnesses saw you hit the other car then those witnesses can be both your witnesses and the others car driver's witnesses couldn't they?

If the other driver did speed up and go over the speed limit then it is going to be difficult to prove if there is no speed camera that caught it or no tyre marks left by skidding.

ticallista

24 posts

Geek

#294966 31-Jan-2010 17:19

Sorry but you are at fault. Doesn't matter if the other lane is a bus lane. You need to make sure the lane is 100% clear before you cross over. The other vehicle was travelling straight so he has right of way.

That is how I think the insurance co will rule, as I used to work in one ages ago and deal with this kind of things everyday.

whispernz

11 posts

Geek

#294976 31-Jan-2010 17:56

bigal_nz: A couple of things you need to clarify here:
1) Do you know which lane he was in before he undertook you?
2) Where is the damage located on your car and his car?
3) Confirm you indicated for more than 3s in the correct direction before moving to the left?
4) Was it possible he was in your blind spot and you didnt see him, or do you think he made a sudden lane change into the bus lane to get past you?

I believe that I am at fault now. the fact that i was indicating doesnt mean anything. That would have been a matter of courtesy if anything when I really think about it.

I've called the insurance company to lodge this. On the phone I did not admit it was my fault but as someone had predicted in this post, they see it as my fault but will make a note of the fact that the other driver acknowledges he saw me indicate and sped up. The accident team will contact him shortly and ask if he thinks he is liable or not. If he says yes, then its an easy road. If he says no, then i'm told the accident team will come around with paperwork and will need to carry out an investigation, taking photos and everything.

Also the reason the other guy did not have any witnesses is because he failed to take their details down.
I saw him drive away as i got contact details down.

Rant:
Just really gutted that i failed to see this car as I felt i had done everything correctly. Accidents happen.
The guy was pretty ignorant as well. First thing i did was check if he/his passengers we're hurt
Im 21 and being younger than he was, the first thing he did was to make the assumption that i was drunk and going to a party which i was not. He also didn't even bother to check if anyone was hurt. Instead he stood at his car looking at the damage.

Bung

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#294979 31-Jan-2010 18:34

richms: also was he driving with correct lights on. Lots of tards just have parks and foglights which is pretty easy to miss.

If the Police ever did want to have a revenue grab they should start ticketing everything with the fog lights stuck on in good conditions.

The guy probably sped up because it seems to be the standard reaction to someone changing lanes.

As regards blind spots, it seems that Wellington is full of new scooter riders that just love hiding on your rear corner.

Batman

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#294988 31-Jan-2010 19:43

based on all the facts you posted at the top: assuming they're all true (which i doubt, because there is ALWAYS some bias)

it seems that the other guy was in your blind spot, and you rammed into him. it doesnt matter whether he sped up, drove onto the curb, he got blind sided.

if you could prove that: the other guy wasnt in your blindspot initially, but drove into the lane while you were indicating and tried to overtake on the left lane despite all that, then he is in the wrong. it sound absurd, but there are idiots out there! i've seen a few! but this is probably not one of them.

corksta

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#294992 31-Jan-2010 19:51

whispernz, if one is a bus lane then it will have times that it is officially designated a bus lane. Outside of those times it becomes a normal lane on the road. For arguments sake we'll call the bus lane 'lane one' and your lane 'lane two'. Correct me if I'm wrong but as I understand it you are in lane two and indicate to pull into lane one, and as you are doing this a car travels past you in lane one and you collide.

Speed of the other vehicle is irrelevant. If you are deviating from one lane to another it is your responsibility to ensure it is safe to perform the lane change. In this case because you were the one doing the manouevre, it was 100% your responsibility to ensure you could do this safely, so unfortunately this collision is your fault.

I'm a police officer with 9 years service (we can be geeks too!) so I should know what I'm talking about! Feel free to PM me if I can help clarify anything for you.

Bung

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#294993 31-Jan-2010 19:55

joker97: it seems that the other guy was in your blind spot, and you rammed into him. it doesnt matter whether he sped up, drove onto the curb, he got blind sided.

There's the legal position then there's the if you sit in someone's blind spot for 3 seconds while they're indicating a lane change then speed up, you're an idiot position.

Italian drivers get irate if you don't change lanes promptly after indicating.

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kingjj

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#295021 31-Jan-2010 22:34

corksta: I'm a police officer with 9 years service (we can be geeks too!) so I should know what I'm talking about! Feel free to PM me if I can help clarify anything for you.

Oh no, the cops have discovered the internet now? Is there no escape... please tell me your still naive on on this new fangled txt talk?

whispernz

11 posts

Geek

#295024 31-Jan-2010 22:47

thanks alot guys for all your advice, i've made my statement to the police and the insurance company about how i recall the event. i lodged the claim at my fault with a note attached saying that I have witnesses to the other driver acknowledging he saw me indicate and in his own words "sped up" to overtake me. i doubt this will change things but its worth a try i'm told. I will now endeavor to become geekzone's best blindspot checker.

sorry about the confusion with the term "bus lane", at the time (10.35pm) the bus lane rule does not apply. i was simply using the term "bus lane" as reference.

On a side note, the damage to my car will be relatively easy to fix. I will need a left side front indicator and am looking for a grey leftside fender panel. Ill be paying strongs honda a visit on tuesday.

nzpat

167 posts

Master Geek

#295026 31-Jan-2010 23:00

Do a defensive driving course through the AA, one of the most eye opening things i've done. It will make you a much better driver.

whispernz

11 posts

Geek

#295027 31-Jan-2010 23:02

patznz: Do a defensive driving course through the AA, one of the most eye opening things i've done. It will make you a much better driver.

this is still made available to fully licensed drivers? and what are the average prices these days?

yuxek

147 posts

Master Geek
Inactive user

#295064 1-Feb-2010 01:42

whispernz:
bigal_nz: A couple of things you need to clarify here:
1) Do you know which lane he was in before he undertook you?
2) Where is the damage located on your car and his car?
3) Confirm you indicated for more than 3s in the correct direction before moving to the left?
4) Was it possible he was in your blind spot and you didnt see him, or do you think he made a sudden lane change into the bus lane to get past you?

I believe that I am at fault now. the fact that i was indicating doesnt mean anything. That would have been a matter of courtesy if anything when I really think about it.

I've called the insurance company to lodge this. On the phone I did not admit it was my fault but as someone had predicted in this post, they see it as my fault but will make a note of the fact that the other driver acknowledges he saw me indicate and sped up. The accident team will contact him shortly and ask if he thinks he is liable or not. If he says yes, then its an easy road. If he says no, then i'm told the accident team will come around with paperwork and will need to carry out an investigation, taking photos and everything.

Also the reason the other guy did not have any witnesses is because he failed to take their details down.
I saw him drive away as i got contact details down.

Rant:
Just really gutted that i failed to see this car as I felt i had done everything correctly. Accidents happen.
The guy was pretty ignorant as well. First thing i did was check if he/his passengers we're hurt
Im 21 and being younger than he was, the first thing he did was to make the assumption that i was drunk and going to a party which i was not. He also didn't even bother to check if anyone was hurt. Instead he stood at his car looking at the damage.

the witnesses actually stayed at the scene for you to take their details down or did you have to run after them and ask them to stay? how old were the witnesses? pretty kind of whoever they are. the witnesses weren't drunk right?

nzpat

167 posts

Master Geek

#295078 1-Feb-2010 07:59

Ive just done one (im on my restricted) I think about $250ish, and yes there where people with full licenses at the course.

kingjj

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#295111 1-Feb-2010 09:59

patznz: Ive just done one (im on my restricted) I think about $250ish, and yes there where people with full licenses at the course.

Its compulsory to get a defensive driving certificate for certain jobs, such as the NZ Police. Therefore you get a lot of older drivers on full licences sweating it with the young ones.

corksta

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#295126 1-Feb-2010 10:44

whispernz I tried to reply to your PM but it won't let me send it and says you prefer not to receive private messages.

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