29 Miners Stuck in West Coast

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#407304 21-Nov-2010 14:33

old3eyes: I'm getting a little concerned with the police down there sitting on their hands in the name of safety. What's wrong with sending in a couple of guys with good breathing gear like the firemen have on the train that they have in the mine to have a look. The longer they wait.. though I suspect by the force of the blast it may be all bad news. Hope I'm wrong..

You gotta love armchair critics in this country.

You're not there at the site, you have no experience in mine rescues, all you know is what the media is reporting.

So what happens when the rescuers go in without establishing it's safe to do so and then they need rescuing, who rescues them?

rscole86

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#407305 21-Nov-2010 14:37

corksta:
old3eyes: I'm getting a little concerned with the police down there sitting on their hands in the name of safety. What's wrong with sending in a couple of guys with good breathing gear like the firemen have on the train that they have in the mine to have a look. The longer they wait.. though I suspect by the force of the blast it may be all bad news. Hope I'm wrong..

You gotta love armchair critics in this country.

You're not there at the site, you have no experience in mine rescues, all you know is what the media is reporting.

So what happens when the rescuers go in without establishing it's safe to do so and then they need rescuing, who rescues them?

You may have answered your own question... "armchair critics".

On a completely serious note, why don't we send in the "armchair critics" without any torch light, flame or anything that could cause a spark, and ask them to perform the rescue?

robbyp

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#407307 21-Nov-2010 14:44

They will be doing everything correctly, as there is only one goal, and that is to save all the miners in the safest way.

leaplae

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#407316 21-Nov-2010 15:16

Why not send in rescuers with Breathing equipment, wearing antistatic plastic bags and waving glowsticks?

Kaos36

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#407317 21-Nov-2010 15:18

Aussie experts are heading here if not already here, they would probably know more about rescuing miners than we would. Here's hoping the miners are found alive.

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leaplae

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#407318 21-Nov-2010 15:27

Aussie experts...?

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old3eyes

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#407319 21-Nov-2010 15:28

freitasm: And who would be in charge?

a) The Labour Party
b) The NZSPCA
c) The New Zealand Army

Who should be in charge?

NZ Mine Rescue??

http://www.minerescue.org/members.htm

Regards,

Old3eyes

corksta

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#407322 21-Nov-2010 16:00

leaplae: Why not send in rescuers with Breathing equipment, wearing antistatic plastic bags and waving glowsticks?

As per Stuff:

"Trevor Watts, general manager of NZ Mines Rescue, told gathered media they were ''information gathering'' for gas and atmopshere analysis.

Some of the most highly respected experts in the world are now on site, particulary from Austraila, he said.

The explosive atmosphere was giving the most concern and the logistics of deploying underground ''are quite vast.''

"This is not like walking down to the local supermarket."

The terrain is unlevel. Rescuers would need heavy breathing apparatus and would have to walk for two hours. They would then have to return to fresh air.

Mr Watts confirmed there are six five men rescue teams, doing eight hours shifts each."

SCM

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#407328 21-Nov-2010 16:33

c71931f:
nate:
SteveON:
c71931f: I thought there was already a thread in regards to this....

... Who do you think you are? ...!

A fellow user, like you, who thought there was another thread that we could close to merge into this one.

Have you got an issue with this?

Seems to, Lol.

Nothing unusual there, look at the BS JohnR had to deal with -.-

antoniosk

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#407331 21-Nov-2010 16:49

I found it odd that the UK Telegraph website seemed to have a lot more information available than is presented locally:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/australiaandthepacific/newzealand/8148972/Agonising-wait-for-families-of-trapped-miners-in-New-Zealand.html

(sigh, I really dislike using Firefox on Geekzone)

You gotta feel for the frustration going on there... a big deep hole filled with explosive gas. Hmmm..... quite a year this is turning out to be for the Sth Island....

________

Antoniosk

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#407333 21-Nov-2010 16:56

antoniosk: I found it odd that the UK Telegraph website seemed to have a lot more information available than is presented locally:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/australiaandthepacific/newzealand/8148972/Agonising-wait-for-families-of-trapped-miners-in-New-Zealand.html

(sigh, I really dislike using Firefox on Geekzone)

You gotta feel for the frustration going on there... a big deep hole filled with explosive gas. Hmmm..... quite a year this is turning out to be for the Sth Island....

What's wrong with FF on Geekzone?(Serious question, since I use Chrome and have no issues)

I have moved across the ditch. Now residing in Melbourne as a VOIP/Video Technical Trainer/Engineer.

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freitasm

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#407334 21-Nov-2010 16:57

AFAIK it doesn't auto-hyperlink, like Internet Explorer does. Blame TinyMCE and Firefox not working nicely together.

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Dratsab

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#407338 21-Nov-2010 17:07

old3eyes:
Dratsab:
old3eyes: I'm getting a little concerned with the police down there sitting on their hands in the name of safety.

Do you know anything about explosive atmospheres?

No. But it seems the NZ thing these days. Police super cautious and why exactly are the police in charge of this??

The first word was sufficient...

old3eyes:
freitasm: And who would be in charge?

a) The Labour Party
b) The NZSPCA
c) The New Zealand Army

Who should be in charge?

NZ Mine Rescue??

http://www.minerescue.org/members.htm

These people *will* be heavily involved in the rescue. They will be provided invaluable information about the do's and don'ts and will also be heavily involved in the donkey work. No forays into the mine will be occurring at this stage on the back of advice from mining experts. Decisions like this are not made lightly or in a vacuum, no matter what you may think.

In NZ, Police are the lead agency in Search and rescue operations. There's also other reasons for them to be running this operation, examples include:

1. Gathering evidence for an investigation (alongside the Department of Labour) into the cause of the explosion and determining if there is any criminal liability.

2. This may turn into a Disaster Victim Identification exercise. The length and full direction of the explosion is unknown. It's possible miners may have been close to exploding dust/gas and been killed, so the state of their bodies (intactness, decay) is unknown.

3. If there are deceased miners, police also become agents for the Coroner and will pass on investigative material to the inquest.

To say they're sitting on their hands in the name of safety is an appallingly ignorant statement to make. It's a coal mine. There's been an explosion. As others have pointed out, it'll be very easy to trigger another explosion. Such an explosion could well kill rescuers and or any surviving miners.

And don't think for an instant police will be the only ones going in to look for people. The search party will consist of mine rescue personnel, a structural engineer or two, paramedics and possibly some fire service staff. Even when it's deemed 'safe', it's still going to be a very dangerous job for these brave folk to undertake.

nakedmolerat

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#407443 21-Nov-2010 22:02

i have a plan, this will need a very very long rope. tie it to a brave rescuer. let him or her go into the tunnel with excellent equipments. if anything happen, we can quickly pull him out to safety. i understand the safety concern but the chance for them to survive is decreasing over time.

p/s: i am not a coal mine expert

SpookyAwol

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#407516 22-Nov-2010 08:47

Are you an expert on really long ropes?

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