Smoking Legislation has made things worse in some ways!

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JBO

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#635602 4-Jun-2012 19:07

blackjack17:
JBO: And what would the punishment for selling (sorry, 'dealing') tobacco be?

How would you define sale? Would a shared or giften cigarette count? A paid-for single cigarette?

The laws already exist for homebrew. You can brew your own, you can share with friends but you can't sell or exchange for goods or services, doesn't have to be any more complicated.

That or borrow laws from countries that have legalised weed for personal consumption.

Fair enough. I guess I was more responding to the people who simply said 'ban it completely'.

Out of interest, would you support the introduction of the same regime, but for weed?

Elpie

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#635603 4-Jun-2012 19:07

People congregating outside building entrances has been happening here for over 20 years. Most workplaces haven't allowed smoking indoors for at least that long. What has changed is people's attitudes towards it.

Alcoholism is treated as a disease and people have some sympathy for those who are battling to come back from it - not so the smokers. Recreational smokers are fools and those who can give up most definitely should, IMO, but there are people around for whom giving up is hell on earth. Being vilified by anti-smoking sentiments doesn't help.

Elpie

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#635605 4-Jun-2012 19:13

Zeon: Learn how to hold breath? Or look on the plus side you are getting free smoke - even more valuable now that prices are going up!

I don't really care about smoking, as long as smokers pay for their health costs and put their butts in the bin.

NZ cities are really bad for providing rubbish bins. There are fines for littering that nobody enforces but, in fairness to smokers, just look around for bins when you are out and about.

As for covering their health costs, Treasury reported that tobacco taxes already bring in more than the health costs: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/health/news/article.cfm?c_id=204&objectid=10809145

kobiak

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#635613 4-Jun-2012 19:21

Been a smoker for the past 14 years and having no issues with it, I just don't understand the rant. Personally I hate more the smelly people who don't take shower, or use deodorant/perfume excessively. and you can meet them everywhere, especially on the flight :( so should we ban them too from been at the public place?

Currently I'm in the country where smoking is not banned at bars and restaurants, however there are usually two areas for smokers and non-smokers. and I would say I smell no smoke at some places with good ventilation system. and I doubt I ever seen place like that in New Zealand.

Would not it be better for bars/cafes/restaurants to invest in ventilation rather then lose customers? I see no issue with smoking on the street, so people just over reacting.

and yeah. Currently smoking e-cigs and loving it :)

helping others at evgenyk.nz

plod

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#635620 4-Jun-2012 19:32

Currently I'm in the country where smoking is not banned at bars and restaurants, however there are usually two areas for smokers and non-smokers. and I would say I smell no smoke at some places with good ventilation system. and I doubt I ever seen place like that in New Zealand.

Would not it be better for bars/cafes/restaurants to invest in ventilation rather then lose customers? I see no issue with smoking on the street, so people just over reacting.

and yeah. Currently smoking e-cigs and loving it :)

Didn't realise smoking was still allowed in country pubs

Elpie

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#635621 4-Jun-2012 19:34

kobiak:

Would not it be better for bars/cafes/restaurants to invest in ventilation rather then lose customers? I see no issue with smoking on the street, so people just over reacting.

When Australia changed their law about 10 years ago they initially allowed restaurants and bars to offer a separated smoking and non-smoking area with the smoking area having to be ventilated to set standards. It cracked me up to walk into a bar in Canberra that looked almost empty, only to find that the smoking room was standing-room only with people crushed together shoulder-to-shoulder. Yet, despite the people smells there was no sign or smell of smoke. Most people in there were not smoking but they were in social groups that seemed to include smokers. With the ventilation going it was almost impossible to tell that there were smokers in the room.

The places that had the smoking rooms were buzzing. Others that were non-smoking only looked pretty dead. However, I don't think that was a popular move over there because the costs of (a) having a separate, sealable room and (b) the cost of the ventiliation/filtration systems were both very expensive.

NZ should have at least been offered this option. One place I know spent close to $80,000 establishing a roofed-over smoking area & had never recovered the cost before smokers were forced outside.

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kobiak

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#635636 4-Jun-2012 20:03

Elpie:

When Australia changed their law about 10 years ago they initially allowed restaurants and bars to offer a separated smoking and non-smoking area with the smoking area having to be ventilated to set standards. It cracked me up to walk into a bar in Canberra that looked almost empty, only to find that the smoking room was standing-room only with people crushed together shoulder-to-shoulder. Yet, despite the people smells there was no sign or smell of smoke. Most people in there were not smoking but they were in social groups that seemed to include smokers. With the ventilation going it was almost impossible to tell that there were smokers in the room.

The places that had the smoking rooms were buzzing. Others that were non-smoking only looked pretty dead. However, I don't think that was a popular move over there because the costs of (a) having a separate, sealable room and (b) the cost of the ventiliation/filtration systems were both very expensive.

NZ should have at least been offered this option. One place I know spent close to $80,000 establishing a roofed-over smoking area & had never recovered the cost before smokers were forced outside.

That's what I'm saying separate areas for smokers should not be any different from non-smoking areas apart from good ventilation system. so that people who are there don't have any discomfort, or area be overcrowded.

and I think that 80k for a business is almost nothing, when people would realise that they can smoke and smell no smoke at same time - they would love it. and to be honest most of NZ cafes and bars have a cheap interior and try no effort to attract customers or what so ever, which is so different from Europe :(

and yeah, I aggree totaly, that bars should be given an option to creat these specially ventilates areas for customers, if they wanted to.

Good example of a bar I like in Auckland. Taylors garage, where roof is used as separate area for smokers, so awesome to sit and enjoy beer with a e-cig :)

helping others at evgenyk.nz

avecha

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#635645 4-Jun-2012 20:22

We go outside to smoke and all the non-smokers come with us.

It's New Zealand's way. Give it time and something else will come along for everyone to get up in arms about.
Happened with the smacking bill, Paul Henry, there was another NZ personality, teacup tapes etc.

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